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ESL Labour Market research

 
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Fa'aitoito



Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
Location: Northern Canada

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2012 9:54 pm    Post subject: ESL Labour Market research Reply with quote

I am trying to get permission from the government to attend a TESL class while collecting benefits. To do so I am required to interview several people in the ESL industry with these questions. I thought it might be interesting to pose questions to this board since there are such a variety of people, skill levels and countries represented here.

Anyone have a moment to answer as many (or as few) questions regarding their teaching position? Feel free to pm me if you want. I am interested in what people currently working abroad have to say about the ESL industry.

Thanks =)

Occupation / Job Title:
Company Name/Country
How did you get started in this occupation?
What are the duties and responsibilities of this position?
What kind of personal qualities should a person have to perform this type of work well?
What kind of personal qualities should a person have to perform this type of work well?
Did you complete any training to obtain work in this field?
If yes, where did you attend school?
What program did you complete?
Would you attend the same school again?
If no, why not?
Did you receive any on-the-job training when you started?
What are the opportunities for advancement in this industry?
What do you enjoy the most about your job?
What do you enjoy the least about your job?
If you had to do anything differently, what would it be?
In your opinion, what are the employment prospects in this industry?
What is the current starting wage for your position?
Is there anything else that will increase a personís chances of gaining employment in this field?
Can you recommend any books or other types of resources that I can study about your position and industry?
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tttompatz



Joined: 06 Mar 2010
Posts: 1951
Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A question back to you first. Do you have a degree?

IF yes, then there is a decent career path in ESL/EFL/teaching abroad and getting a decent TESOl/TEFL course is a step in the right direction.

If no, you do not have a degree, then pick a new line of work because the only places you will find work are countries where you will be working at substance wages with no upward mobility or illegally (no proper visa or work permits).

There is also no work in Canada in ESL without an undergrad degree.

.
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Fa'aitoito



Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
Location: Northern Canada

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the response. I do have a BA.
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tttompatz



Joined: 06 Mar 2010
Posts: 1951
Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have:
i) a BA,
ii) a Canadian passport and
iii) a clean RCMP check then start shooting out resumes to ESL/EFL jobs.

As long as you are willing to work in Asia you can be AT WORK in about 90 days (time to find a job and process a visa).

The best option for someone with minimal backup money is Korea.
They prepay the airfare and supply housing so you get by with as little as $1000 in your pocket. Untrained, entry level jobs start in the $1800-2000 range. http://www.eslcafe.com/jobs/korea/ .

China is pretty much a sure thing for jobs but you will need to come up with airfare. They typically supply housing. You should be able to find jobs in the 6000 rmb range with little trouble. The wages are about 1/2 what a newbie will earn in Korea but the cost of living, unless you are in Beijing or Shanghai, are substantially lower as well. With a little frugality you should be able to save about 1/2 your wages in either case. http://www.eslcafe.com/jobs/china/ .

The rest of SE Asia is easy enough to get work in (simply google "ESL jobs in Asia") but until you get settled and established you will make a decent living but you won't be sending any money home to pay off old debts. (wages in the $1000 range are common for entry level jobs).

In the majority of Asia you do NOT need a TEFL course to get a job.
Unless you also have an EU passport you can pretty much rule out western Europe for visa reasons.
Eastern Europe is best left to others to fill in the details but a CELTA or equivalent (in terms of entry level jobs) is pretty much required.

The rest of your questions are already answered in this and other forums. Just take a couple of hours to read a few threads and you will quickly get a handle on it.

.
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LongShiKong



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 938
Location: China

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 6:10 pm    Post subject: Re: ESL Labour Market research Reply with quote

Fa'aitoito wrote:
... I am required to interview several people in the ESL industry with these questions.


That's not market research, it's what's commonly referred to as 'informational interviewing' by career counselors. You're better off conducting such interviews face-to-face as 'instructed' (yes?) so you get a sense for the personality behind the answer.

Am I the only one who thinks the more our educational institutions attempt to guide students meta-cognitively, the less they're able or even motivated to think for themselves? It's not education, it's indoctrination. Overschooled = undereducated.

As for tttompatz's advice: I've already argued against the insistence on irrelevant (random) degrees in ELT as being a prerequisite as I'm opposed to unnecessary credentialism. Thirteen years of schooling used to be enough to support a family. Now 17 years are not enough and only prolongs our youth's dependency on their parents.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9488
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These types of inquiries pop up from time to time. I guess that in most cases, it's a matter of conducting some job research in order to continue to qualify for benefits. I don't recall any such poster ever going on to actually working in the field and posting about it - it would be VERY refreshing if someone actually did follow through, someday!!
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tttompatz



Joined: 06 Mar 2010
Posts: 1951
Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines

PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:48 am    Post subject: Re: ESL Labour Market research Reply with quote

[quote="LongShiKong"]
Fa'aitoito wrote:
...
As for tttompatz's advice: I've already argued against the insistence on irrelevant (random) degrees in ELT as being a prerequisite as I'm opposed to unnecessary credentialism. Thirteen years of schooling used to be enough to support a family. Now 17 years are not enough and only prolongs our youth's dependency on their parents.


It is not about my advice to hold a degree but an immigration requirement in more and more countries. By 2015 holding a degree will be a requirement for legal employment (as a teacher) with all the "proper" attendant visas and permits in all of the ASEAN block.

Currently, only China and Indonesia want a TEFL cert but there is no move to verify the authenticity of same.

.
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santi84



Joined: 14 Mar 2008
Posts: 854
Location: under da sea

PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tttompatz wrote:

There is also no work in Canada in ESL without an undergrad degree.

.


And nothing that puts food on the table for less than a provincial teacher license!

An MA... well, maybe. With lots of experience I suppose, but even many teachers with MAs in Canada are only working 10-15 hours a week.

Get your license and come to Quebec. You'll make a decent wage and actually be able to afford a house! Otherwise, you're looking at scraps.[/i]
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santi84



Joined: 14 Mar 2008
Posts: 854
Location: under da sea

PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm curious though - since you are collecting benefits (welfare), will they be willing to provide this class considering you will only get employment overseas?

I have a related degree (TESL) and a level 2 certificate (which is 250 hours). It is very difficult to find consistent employment, and I live in Quebec where 96% of the population is French!

Is this to work in Canada, or to leave Canada? Because if it's to STAY in Canada, I'm afraid I can't answer your survey because it will not bode well for your application. It would not help you, unfortunately. If it is to LEAVE Canada, then sure, you are fine.

If you are in the North, then get your provincial teacher certificate rather than a TESL certificate.
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LongShiKong



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 938
Location: China

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 1:11 am    Post subject: Re: ESL Labour Market research Reply with quote

santi wrote:
If you are in the North, then get your provincial teacher certificate rather than a TESL certificate.


With a prior degree, it's only 1 yr in some provinces. NWT/Nunavut recruits B.Ed grads at $70,000+/annum.
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santi84



Joined: 14 Mar 2008
Posts: 854
Location: under da sea

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:21 am    Post subject: Re: ESL Labour Market research Reply with quote

LongShiKong wrote:
santi wrote:
If you are in the North, then get your provincial teacher certificate rather than a TESL certificate.


With a prior degree, it's only 1 yr in some provinces. NWT/Nunavut recruits B.Ed grads at $70,000+/annum.


I have a friend in NWT right now and she loves it! Smile She is single though. I can't really stomach the thought of bringing my kids up there, or else I would consider it as well Confused
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Fa'aitoito



Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
Location: Northern Canada

PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for your responses. Its been intriguing.

yes, ultimately I can glean all the answers from a variety of sources. Unfortunately, the government, in its infinite bureaucratic wisdom has deemed it necessary that I acquire all of these answers from a single source with annoyingly specific details. This works fine when I interview local ESL teachers whom I can actually physically interview and accost for answers to fill out this generic form. I thought it would be an interesting experiment to see if I could get at least one interview from an international source by asking this message board. The matter was very time sensitive so I was in a rush to find an international person to ask.

I was expecting more flames and cynicism so thanks everyone for your input!


...all for the sake of a few weeks of unemployment insurance while I am going to school...

=)


Last edited by Fa'aitoito on Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:19 am; edited 1 time in total
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Fa'aitoito



Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
Location: Northern Canada

PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:14 am    Post subject: Re: ESL Labour Market research Reply with quote

santi84 wrote:
LongShiKong wrote:
santi wrote:
If you are in the North, then get your provincial teacher certificate rather than a TESL certificate.


With a prior degree, it's only 1 yr in some provinces. NWT/Nunavut recruits B.Ed grads at $70,000+/annum.


I have a friend in NWT right now and she loves it! Smile She is single though. I can't really stomach the thought of bringing my kids up there, or else I would consider it as well Confused


I had a friend that went to the Yukon to get his obligatory "up north" experience. He loved it to, and stayed ever since. Smile Kids would probably enjoy the snow!

I could totally see myself working up north after I get my teaching certificate in a few years. I think it would be such a neat experience. I am from a northern town myself and it can be such a different pace of life compared to the south.

As for ESL, the opportunities don't seem as good up north. Although, I did see some ESL postings for Fort Mcmurray that paid 40+ dollars an hour. There are lots of immigrants up there. I imagine there is a pretty high demand for ESL. I will look into next time I go up there.
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