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New INM Rules as of November 9, 2012
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Tretyakovskii



Joined: 14 Aug 2009
Posts: 462
Location: Cancun, Mexico

PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
If switching visa types within Mexico is no longer possible, how will students taking teacher training courses within Mexico go on to look for/obtain employment without having to leave and return?

Answers to a great many specific questions, such as this one, can be found in the law and regulations.

Those who arrived here on student visas, and initially got the corresponding migratory document, can change their status later, to accept work for example, without leaving the country. Guy clearly understands this, and commented on it along the lines of there not being a need for a student visa for courses of short duration, but this was only ever true for those who were entitled to enter the country visa free, such as Canadians. Now, there will be justification for even these to apply for a student visa abroad, if their final intention is to stay and work in Mexico, after the course completes.

There are just a very few who can change status, in country, if they did not request the change on or before 9 November (the last day the old law was in effect). I discussed the problems this causes for those who enter, hoping to find teaching jobs, at length on other threads.

Yucalandia is cautious in what they say, and most of the time accurate, in my opinion; but, there is simply no substitute for looking at the law, itself, for many websites offer wildly erroneous information on this subject.

One of the most egregious errors made is the confusion of the work of INM, in country, with the work of the consulates and embassies. The later issue visas, while the former do not.

Those who enter the country with a visa issued by a consulate or embassy have just 30 days in which to apply for the corresponding migratory document at INM offices in Mexico. Although Xie Lin didn't use the terminology as it's used in the law, he had the right concept in mind for this process.
Quote:
I spent most of the weekend reading up on all of this, and from what I remember, the details of the Points System have not yet been published.

I can't find it, either, Guapa. It's supposed to be published in the DOF, once it's ready.

I'm planning to apply on points, so I'll just throw as much into the application as I can, hoping to hit the mark. If that fails, one more year in temporary residency will get the job done for me.

The financial requirements for temporary residency based on financial self sufficiency (the old Visitante Rentista) have been raised, significantly. Something approaching $100,000 on deposit for the last twelve months is now required, or an income stream of nearly $2,000/month, over the last six months, seems to be the new standard. (I have my fingers crossed on this last information, as I haven't had time to fully investigate and confirm it: call it a "first impression".)

However, I don't see this requirement applied to renewals, so some old timers may be home free. (Again, just a preliminary judgment.)
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1434
Location: 17°48'N 97°46'W

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isla Guapa wrote:

I spent most of the weekend reading up on all of this, and from what I remember, the details of the Points System have not yet been published. Has anyone has found something other than general categories that points would be awarded for (a distinguished career in academia, special talents and skills, gobs of money to invest in Mexico, and so)?


Isla, one of the things that was linked to in an earlier thread in Spanish from IMN gave some ideas--but not details as to point weights. I remember the ability to speak Spanish and knowledge of Mexican history and culture being on the list, so I think you are a shoe in. Very Happy

Quote:
CAPÍTULO SEGUNDO, DEL SISTEMA DE PUNTOS

Artículo 124. El sistema de puntos para que las personas extranjeras puedan adquirir la residencia permanente, establecerá criterios de selección para atraer personas extranjeras inversionistas o con alta competencia en áreas como la ciencia, la tecnología, el deporte, las humanidades y las artes o aquellos que fortalezcan y fomenten el desarrollo y competitividad en el territorio nacional.

Artículo 125. Los criterios de selección podrán incorporar, entre otras, las siguientes categorías:

I. Nivel educativo;
II. Experiencia laboral en áreas de interés para el país que tengan gran demanda y poca oferta;
III. Experiencia laboral en otras áreas;
IV. Inversionista;
V. Aptitudes en ciencia y tecnología;
VI. Reconocimientos o premios internacionales;
VII. Dominio del idioma español, y
VIII. Conocimiento de la cultura mexicana.
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Samantha



Joined: 25 Oct 2003
Posts: 2038
Location: Mexican Riviera

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

T wrote:
Quote:
The financial requirements for temporary residency based on financial self sufficiency (the old Visitante Rentista) have been raised, significantly. Something approaching $100,000 on deposit for the last twelve months is now required, or an income stream of nearly $2,000/month, over the last six months, seems to be the new standard.


I don't believe this is correct information for a Temporary Resident. Could you provide your source, please?
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Xie Lin



Joined: 21 Oct 2011
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Samantha wrote:
T wrote:
Quote:
The financial requirements for temporary residency based on financial self sufficiency (the old Visitante Rentista) have been raised, significantly. Something approaching $100,000 on deposit for the last twelve months is now required, or an income stream of nearly $2,000/month, over the last six months, seems to be the new standard.


I don't believe this is correct information for a Temporary Resident. Could you provide your source, please?


I'll leave it to Tretyakovskii to provide his source if he wishes, but, yes, these are the same figures that I have been reading--$95,000ish on deposit, or a bit over $1,900 a month income.

.
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Xie Lin



Joined: 21 Oct 2011
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's one article:

http://yucalandia.wordpress.com/answers-to-common-questions/new-rules-and-procedures-for-immigration-visiting-and-staying-in-mexico/

.
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Isla Guapa



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF wrote:
Isla Guapa wrote:

I spent most of the weekend reading up on all of this, and from what I remember, the details of the Points System have not yet been published. Has anyone has found something other than general categories that points would be awarded for (a distinguished career in academia, special talents and skills, gobs of money to invest in Mexico, and so)?


Isla, one of the things that was linked to in an earlier thread in Spanish from IMN gave some ideas--but not details as to point weights. I remember the ability to speak Spanish and knowledge of Mexican history and culture being on the list, so I think you are a shoe in. Very Happy

Quote:
CAPÍTULO SEGUNDO, DEL SISTEMA DE PUNTOS

Artículo 124. El sistema de puntos para que las personas extranjeras puedan adquirir la residencia permanente, establecerá criterios de selección para atraer personas extranjeras inversionistas o con alta competencia en áreas como la ciencia, la tecnología, el deporte, las humanidades y las artes o aquellos que fortalezcan y fomenten el desarrollo y competitividad en el territorio nacional.

Artículo 125. Los criterios de selección podrán incorporar, entre otras, las siguientes categorías:

I. Nivel educativo;
II. Experiencia laboral en áreas de interés para el país que tengan gran demanda y poca oferta;
III. Experiencia laboral en otras áreas;
IV. Inversionista;
V. Aptitudes en ciencia y tecnología;
VI. Reconocimientos o premios internacionales;
VII. Dominio del idioma español, y
VIII. Conocimiento de la cultura mexicana.


Thanks for the encouraging words, MotherF. Now if I could just find my Nobel Prize medal, I know it's around here somewhere, that might help me too!
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Tretyakovskii



Joined: 14 Aug 2009
Posts: 462
Location: Cancun, Mexico

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I don't believe this is correct information for a Temporary Resident. Could you provide your source, please?

If you know something we don't know, then please share it. My preliminary conclusions were inferences based on the information published in the INM website, not on reading the law and regulations, so I don't have complete confidence in what I said, and so indicated.

So far, I don't have any reason to believe these remarkably high numbers will be applied to renewals, giving breathing room for those who are already here on Visitante Rentista migratory documents, if it turns out I'm right.

These new financial requirements remove the welcome mat for many people who will be retiring with scant resources, as will be the case in the U.S., where some 60% say they will have little other than social security to rely on in old age.
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Isla Guapa



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tretyakovskii wrote:
Quote:
I don't believe this is correct information for a Temporary Resident. Could you provide your source, please?


If you know something we don't know, then please share it. My preliminary conclusions were inferences based on the information published in the INM website, not on reading the law and regulations, so I don't have complete confidence in what I said, and so indicated.

So far, I don't have any reason to believe these remarkably high numbers will be applied to renewals, giving breathing room for those who are already here on Visitante Rentista migratory documents, if it turns out I'm right.

These new financial requirements remove the welcome mat for many people who will be retiring with scant resources, as will be the case in the U.S., where some 60% say they will have little other than social security to rely on in old age.


Everything I have read says that the new much higher numbers will be applied to everyone applying for residente temporal status, whether for the initial application or a change from No Inmigrante to the new status. Retirees on limited fixed incomes are very worried that they may not be able to stay in Mexico once their current visas expire.
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Samantha



Joined: 25 Oct 2003
Posts: 2038
Location: Mexican Riviera

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All the other stuff aside, many retirees have lived here for years on a simple tourist card. Most of them travel north frequently enough that they can get new tourist visas easily.
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Tretyakovskii



Joined: 14 Aug 2009
Posts: 462
Location: Cancun, Mexico

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Everything I have read says that the new much higher numbers will be applied to everyone applying for residente temporal status, whether for the initial application or a change from No Inmigrante to the new status.

My inference that proof of resources was not required for a renewal, as opposed to an initial application, or change of status, was based on the listed requirements in the INM website for renovacion.

Until I have time to look further at the law, this negative inference is what I´m relying on- an admittedly slim reed....
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notamiss



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 905
Location: El 5o pino del la CDMX

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Samantha wrote:
All the other stuff aside, many retirees have lived here for years on a simple tourist card. Most of them travel north frequently enough that they can get new tourist visas easily.


The open question that has been raised, debated and not definitively answered is whether they will be allowed to keep on doing so, now that electronic records are being kept of comings and goings.

Until the first stage of the reforms began in 2010, the only record of border crossings by holders of (what was then) an FMT was a piece of paper, so it was easy to stay in Mexico permanently and rely on border runs or short visits back home to get a new FMT every 180 days. There has been a lot of speculation that this may have changed.
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Isla Guapa



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tretyakovskii wrote:
Quote:
Everything I have read says that the new much higher numbers will be applied to everyone applying for residente temporal status, whether for the initial application or a change from No Inmigrante to the new status.

My inference that proof of resources was not required for a renewal, as opposed to an initial application, or change of status, was based on the listed requirements in the INM website for renovacion.

Until I have time to look further at the law, this negative inference is what I´m relying on- an admittedly slim reed....


I don't have links handy, but I have read accounts online of retirees already in Mexico who have just applied for a change from No Inmigrante to Residente Temporal (not a renewal), and they did have to prove minimum monthly income with the new, higher amounts.
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Tretyakovskii



Joined: 14 Aug 2009
Posts: 462
Location: Cancun, Mexico

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There has been a lot of speculation that this may have changed.

It may be true that there has been a lot of speculation on this, but I´ve seen nothing in the law or regulations to suggest a change in the privileges conferred by visa free entry, for up to a 180 day stay, as a tourist.
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Tretyakovskii



Joined: 14 Aug 2009
Posts: 462
Location: Cancun, Mexico

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On other threads, I´ve posted the link to the law, and the regulations. Now, the link to the instructions to INM employees, as I understand it.

For those with inquiring minds....

http://dof.gob.mx/nota_detalle.php?codigo=5276967&fecha=08/11/2012

I won´t even have time to skim these anytime soon, but some answers surely can be found in them.
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notamiss



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 905
Location: El 5o pino del la CDMX

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thing is, even before 2010, when record-keeping of border crossings consisted only of bits of paper, there was speculation and debate as to whether people were allowed to reside permanently on FMT’s. There were impassioned arguments (and many citations of first-person experiences) around the question claiming one side or the other. Various people were told different things by their local authorities (as always, but you’d think such a basic question would have a single definitive answer. It did not.)

But whether permanent residence on a tourist visa was sanctioned or not, there was no way to prevent it because of the lack of a database. Now that one exists, it would not require a change in the laws and regulations, merely enforcement of a policy (if such a policy exists).
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