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A modest proposal
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PeterParvo



Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saudi definitely isn't for everybody, and it's true that there are risky employers. I guess I was lucky with a good employer, good wife and kids, good location and good friends.

It was a winning situation for all of us. We got the money, it strengthened us as individuals and as a family, and of course the awesome people we met.

Going to Saudi for one year or two almost doesn't make sense. In my opinion you have to do five to make it worthwhile.

Anybody who wants to PM me can as far as directing you towards one decent employer I know of.
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Master Shake



Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 914
Location: Itabashi, Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dynow wrote:
not only that.....but unless you're tied down to Poland somehow, why work in Saudi and "vacation" in Poland? why buy a "vacation" home in Poland? if life totally sucks 8 weeks at a time in Saudi, there are better places to escape to when you need to relax and blow off steam.

for those tied to Poland, it's not a bad idea. think of the 3-4 years there as a college degree. you leave there with enough cash to go to Poland to buy a flat without a student loan to pay off.

This cuts to the chase.

If you want to try teaching in Poland, go to Poland and do it. You will likely earn a modest living the first year or so, but there are opportunities to earn more for those that seek them out. You don't go to Saudi with the dream of one day living in Poland. Smile

I can also think of far more interesting and cheaper places to vacation than PL. I could live for years on 100,000 zloty in Vietnam and Thailand, for example. I'd enjoy nicer beaches, better food and weather.

Your idea, salamiandbacon, really only suits those who must periodically return to PL. But if it's working out for you, great.
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delphian-domine



Joined: 11 Mar 2011
Posts: 500

PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richfilth wrote:
The heat, the isolation, the entrapment and the ex-pat community would kill me; I'd be clawing at the walls of the compound before the first 8-week session was up, and you'd have to pay me a hell of a lot more than 10k for that.


Likewise. I'm sure the heat wouldn't be an issue, but the feeling of being trapped and in an environment that you can't escape easily would soon get difficult.

Out of curiosity, how is the management culture there? Do they order, or do they discuss?

For me - the biggest attraction in Poland is that I work in a very liberal atmosphere where there's a lot of give and take going on - I don't remember the last time I was actually ordered to do something rather than asked my opinion. I get told about problems - but the solutions are very much my responsibility.

From what I read, teaching kids in Saudi is a complete nightmare.
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PeterParvo



Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saudi/Arab management is a complete nightmare and you wouldn't last very long there teaching kids.

I have to wonder if you people who write about enjoying life aren't either in your 20s or 30s and/or are single. Yes your life in Saudi wouldn't be like living two blocks off the Rynek in some Polish city, but doing five years in Saudi can give you something for your future.

It was a wonderful experience to live through something really different and to show us just how good our life in Poland or wherever is. As I've written before, we had awesome friends there (some of the best being Polish) and we had fun. It did take a couple years to get to that point, hence my harping about staying for five as opposed to one or two.

I would do it again. That being said, do not take older kids there. We got out when our kids were just starting elementary school. KSA is okay for little kids, but a nightmare for older ones.
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Richfilth



Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Warszawa

PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So on one hand, KSA isn't for people between 20 and 39 (seeing as you've written off their opinions as invalid), and on the other it's a great place to build up a nest egg for your future. But not if you have kids over the age of 10.

Therefore, if your life has fallen apart and you need a good cash boost to get to where you should be at the age of around 40, then Saudi Arabia will help you.

For other people who are either enjoying life or have already established themselves, it's not viable.
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PeterParvo



Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Generally speaking, you have to be motivated to go and stay there. Usually young and/or single guys aren't motivated. However, married or older ones generally are. When I got to Poland single and at the age of 32, being a barfly was fine but once I got married my motivation changed.

There just aren't that many young single guys in KSA and for good reason; they should be out chasing p***y and drinking beer.

The bottom line is, don't dismiss it out of hand. If your motivation is right, go for it.
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salamiandbacon



Joined: 13 Apr 2012
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The bottom line is, don't dismiss it out of hand. If your motivation is right, go for it.

I think you've summed it up nicely.

You'll hear no argument from me that someone who is having a fulfilling and enjoyable life in Poland, or indeed anywhere else, should drop it and rush off to Saudi.
It might be comforting to know that if Poland is proving a bit of a grind and getting you down, there are places you can go to make some real money. I think a lot of us get trapped as TEFLers, we think it's something we'll do for a bit before we get a "proper job", or we think we're building a life somewhere like Poland and we forget that what makes us happy today doesn't always make for a good long-term plan. Chasing tail and drinking is great fun, but when you realise you're the oldest person in the club you can start to feel that Wiliams might have been right about being young without money is ok, but you can't be old without it.
Then rush off to saudi.

At the moment Saudi is booming and I didn't know if you guys knew that now is a good time to find work.
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iknowwhatiamtalkingabout



Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 64

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've applied for and been offered work in Saudi in the past, and I'm glad I didn't take it.

I currently live in Asia and make (and save) pretty good money while enjoying a good lifestyle with plenty places to go, plenty to do, loads of company etc. I don't have to live in a sandpit with religious police and maniac bosses. My only problem is pretty dull students.

Fair enough, I'm not on Saudi money, but when I leave here I'll have saved plenty money. Enough to allow me pretty much free choice of where I go next. I have holidays every ten weeks and can afford to go good places on them. My next 3 holidays will see me visit Germany, Sweden, Thailand, Hong Kong, Singapore and the Maldives. Financially no problem. I'm racking up air miles, staying in nice hotels, enjoying going to nice places. This year I've been to Australia and Indonesia. The sandpit isn't the only option.

I understand the money makes Saudi worth it for a lot of people. Not me though. A lot of my mates have worked there or still do. None of them like it and the reports are all pretty samey.

You only get one life. You could get hit by a bus/drop dead tomorrow. If that happens to me I'd hate it to have happened after I spent years living in a complete dive planning for a tomorrow that never arrived.

I'm fine financially, and I enjoy a good life. It doesn't have to be a choice. Living in places like Saudi just strikes me as a waste of a life. I understand some people think it's worth it, I just don't think it is.
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Daktari



Joined: 08 Mar 2010
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 11:56 am    Post subject: erm Reply with quote

Long-term, it's a slog in Poland and the kelly is elsewhere. Why does everyone focus on Saudi though? The best money is in the oil field rotations and they can be anywhere there's oil. They're usually 4 on 4 off or 6 on 3 off (weeks) on full pay all the time. Some of these jobs are in Africa, some in the Gulf and some in Asia. You don't even have to pay for your grub and you've got free gyms, home brew, sat tv and if you're lucky, lovely beaches to pass the month by....even totty in some places.
That Sharter had it right. Come to think of it, he hasn't posted in a while-probably too busy having a good time. He was right in much of what he said. Poland is expensive now, wages pitiful and it's a real sh*g after a few years. Most of you lot haven't been teaching 10 years yet.
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salamiandbacon



Joined: 13 Apr 2012
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The rotations are good, but often the headline day rate seems better than it is. You don't get paid when you're not working and you've often got problems with job security. If they don't need you, they can drop you like a stone and then you've got dead time until you pick up more work. Many of the places you end up working are a lot more dangerous too!
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PeterParvo



Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard it many times that I could go to Asia, but with a wife and two kids I don't think it would have worked. My employer in KSA was pretty accommodating with the family.

I would never call our time there a waste of life. It gave us many things, i.e. strength as a family and as individuals, some serious perspective on what's going on in the world and in human relations, among other things.

Speaking specifically about Poland, I was pretty much done with it when we left. I just ain't Polish and can't tolerate things there anymore. Where we are living now, people are so nice and courteous, and my job just kicks the crap out of the work situation I'd have in Poland.

To each his own.
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Richfilth



Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Warszawa

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:04 pm    Post subject: Re: erm Reply with quote

Daktari wrote:
Long-term, it's a slog in Poland and the kelly is elsewhere.


I've never found Poland a slog. From working four days a week, I have my own property, I drive a BMW and I support my partner financially. I'm turning down work left, right and centre.

Daktari wrote:
You don't even have to pay for your grub and you've got free gyms, home brew, sat tv and if you're lucky, lovely beaches to pass the month by....even totty in some places.


Wow, what a stimulating life; slumped in front of the TV with a cold beer. Beaches and b!tches aren't what I want out of life.

Daktari wrote:
That Sharter had it right. Come to think of it, he hasn't posted in a while-probably too busy having a good time. He was right in much of what he said. Poland is expensive now, wages pitiful and it's a real sh*g after a few years.


I presume he was banned for spouting his repetitive spiel once too often.

Daktari wrote:
Most of you lot haven't been teaching 10 years yet.


But some of us have. What's your point?

Daktari wrote:
Poland's only a slog


Utter rubbish.

It's a slog if you have a playboy gimme-gimme-gimme attitude, or if you're not very good at your job. It seems Saudi will take anyone.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12085
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"It seems Saudi will take anyone."

But not everyone can take Saudi !
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Master Shake



Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 914
Location: Itabashi, Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scot47 wrote:
"It seems Saudi will take anyone."

But not everyone can take Saudi !
I don't know about the first part...I think they demand at least a degree and CELTA + medical checks.

I understand the desire to save money, but you can do it in other countries, particularly SE Asia, in a much more comfortable, accommodating location.

It really isn't worth living in Saudi to save 100,000zl/year when you can live in Vietnam, Korea or Japan and save 50,000-70,000zl/year.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12085
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KSA is ok. Some people are just too soft !
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