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University Position.

 
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Real Reality



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 4:10 am    Post subject: University Position. Reply with quote

Salaries and Benefits :
- First Year, B.A : 1,600,000 won. M.A : 1,750,000 won.
BA + MA = 3,350,000
Wink
Of course NOT.
Rolling Eyes


Last edited by Real Reality on Sat Aug 23, 2003 9:24 pm; edited 2 times in total
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RR. Are you working in a university? If so, you choose to do so. If not, why bother posting about it, as (presumably) you make more than 1.6 million at your hakwon or school?

Bottom line. Most foreigners are only going to be here one year or two. Many others will leave eventually. Why hire somebody and give them tenure and other perks, when the chances are that person will leave someday?

I guess I don't see the point of complaining. So what? It may be unfair, but that happens all over the world.
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Real Reality



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 8:45 am    Post subject: well, life is short Reply with quote

TheUrbanMyth,
"the chances are that person will leave someday"

What if you want to stay in Korea for several years?
What if you want to live the rest of your life in Korea?

Yes, we all leave someday. We all die.
If you do not try to raise the awareness of the discrimination
and prejudice in society, who will? Why not try to make the system fair in the place you live?

Foreign scholars merit equal status
The foreign professor -- colleague or hired hand?
Foreign professors do most of the heavy lifting in terms of course loads, devoting themselves almost exclusively to teaching. Nevertheless, they tend to be treated as hired hands, without academic standing, and lacking the possibility of career advancement or tenure. They must submit to yearly contracts (compensated at a rate only 60 percent of their Korean peers) while walled off from the permanent Korean faculty who benefit from travel, research funding, sabbaticals, etc. Moreover, when hundreds of Korean scholars enjoy such perks at American and other foreign universities, something is obviously amiss.
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200206/14/200206142349223599900090109011.html

Country Reports on Human Rights Practices - 2002
Released by the Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights, and Labor
March 31, 2003

The use of the National Security Law (NSL) continued to infringe upon citizens' civil liberties, including the right to free expression. In 2001 a foreign citizen was convicted under the NSL for the first time. Domestic violence, rape, and child abuse remained serious problems. Women continued to face legal and societal discrimination. Ethnic minorities, very small in number, faced legal and societal discrimination. Many public sector employees did not enjoy the right of association. Trafficking in persons was a problem; the country was considered a major transit point for alien smugglers, including traffickers of primarily Asian women and children for the sex trade and domestic servitude.

Foreigners working as language teachers have complained that the language institutes frequently violated employment contracts, for which the legal system provided insufficient redress.

http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2002/18250.htm
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hellofaniceguy



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: On your computer screen!

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It still comes down to this: no one forces anyone to come to korea and sign bad contracts. Why someone would sign for 1.6 teaching 6/7 classes a day at a hokwon is beyond reasoning! Whose the fool? The teacher or the owner? It's not the owner. The owners KNOW that some fool will sign a bad contract. And then he/she complains about this that and the other thing. I use to think that the foreign ESL teachers were getting shafted often. Not anymore. The Japanese teachers who teach in korea get shafted far more worse! They get around 1.0, split shifts, shared housing and teach 7/8/9 classes a day! Plus when they have a holiday off (a korean national holiday) they are required to work another day to make up for it! Then again, why they would agree to it is beyond me.
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BTM



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Back in the saddle.

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The contact hours for the job he's talking about (if I'm right about the one he's seen) are 15 per week.

Although 1.6 is definitely on the low end of things, if the workplace is a good one and the housing reasonable, I'd certainly consider taking the position. I've applied for it, in fact.

There are more important things than gross income.
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mishlert



Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Location: On the 3rd rock from the sun

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do not know where the sum of 1.6 million came, but I work at a university and make 2.5 million with a decent 2 room and 4 months off a year. When I was looking to work at a university all the offers I would see were 1.8-2.1million; the low end was from a university on Jeju island.
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waterbaby



Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Location: Baking Gord a Cheescake pie

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think he's taken it from a job ad recently posted on the job board.
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TECO



Joined: 20 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the ad was for positions at Jeonju university.

Anyone know what the conditions are like at this university?
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Real Reality



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 8:55 pm    Post subject: yes Reply with quote

Yes, it is from a recent job ad.

Mishlert seems to have a decent university position.
Most or all university positions need to be similar or better.

Review:
Foreign professors do most of the heavy lifting in terms of course loads, devoting themselves almost exclusively to teaching. Nevertheless, they tend to be treated as hired hands, without academic standing, and lacking the possibility of career advancement or tenure. They must submit to yearly contracts (compensated at a rate only 60 percent of their Korean peers) while walled off from the permanent Korean faculty who benefit from travel, research funding, sabbaticals, etc. Moreover, when hundreds of Korean scholars enjoy such perks at American and other foreign universities, something is obviously amiss.

According to the Samsung Group's chairman, Lee Kun-hee, to succeed globally, Korea must forgo the thought that Korea and being Korean is superior, and foreign specialists must be treated with respect.
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200206/14/200206142349223599900090109011.html
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TECO



Joined: 20 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2003 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone here get the job at Jeonju University?

BTM - You get it?
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BTM



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Back in the saddle.

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2003 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, no call-back thus far, which surprises me mildly, and unpleasantly. I did get an email from the contact person telling they'd received my application, though, which is more than you usually get!
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TECO



Joined: 20 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2003 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, people don't usually respond if they're not interested. So that might indicate that they're a descent school to work for.

If I see that position up again, I'll definitely throw my resume in and see
what comes of it.

Money didn't sound to good but 15 hours a week isn't much, is it.

I wonder if you can negotiate a higher salary or if it's pretty much fixed, anyone know about negotiating salaries in Korea? In Taiwan you can negotiate to a certain extent.
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intergalactic



Joined: 19 May 2003
Location: Brisbane

PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2003 5:29 am    Post subject: jj university Reply with quote

I don't think the selection process is over yet, unless a decision was made tonight. The school has an administration that makes you tear your hair out, feel the need to strangle someone, or quit. But the housing is mostly decent, a little hit and miss but usually pretty good. That pay is terrible but the hours are super! And the other foreigners are a delight to work with! Laughing
Whether or not you think the package is good enough depends on what you're used to and what kind of lifestyle you want here.
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