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The Korean Language Question And Answer Thread
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joesp



Joined: 16 Jan 2008

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FYI, the 국어 사전 (Korean-korean dictionaries) mark the long sound with the ː mark, as you can see in the following (I underlined it):
naver dictionary wrote:
간구-하다 懇求--[발음 : 간ː구하다]

.....
Fox wrote:
How do you even find the answers to these (long and short sounds) without buying some sort of test study book anyway?

Nowhere else I could find.
They even say "our ideas about long and short sounds may differ from that used in dictionaries as we have compiled our own list."

I tried to listen to newscasters -- arguably the best Korean pronunciation -- to tell, but couldn't. I asked people, they couldn't tell either.
I honestly don't know what the purpose of this section (or this supposed aspect of the Korean language) is about.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thatkidpercy wrote:
but I'm curious how you keep the information fresh if you're studying hanja for Korean? Do you have some texts that use hanja for Sino-Korean words?


1) Anki.
2) 한문 / 한시
3) Occasionally you can find things written in 국한혼용.

My pocket dictionary also includes the hanja for sino-Korean words, so some practice can come from that as well.
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joesp



Joined: 16 Jan 2008

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:52 am    Post subject: how to not forget your hanja Reply with quote

Fox wrote:
1) Anki.

I know this is a memorization flash-card program, but have never actually used it myself.
Fox wrote:
2) 한문 / 한시

Actually, all the hanja test is about is the hanja. To write all the Korean in hanja requires knowledge of what specific hanja do grammitically, which is not on the exam. They simply say that the meaning of those hanja is 어조사 particle-of-speech but don't specify which one.
I never see 한문 and couldn't read it if I did.
Fox wrote:
3) Occasionally you can find things written in 국한혼용.

Ah, that must be like newspapers using hanja with hangul? Doesn't happen too often.
Using hanja in daily life in fact happens so rarely that it mostly becomes the simple application of what I have studied in a more concentrated manner via the hanja textbooks. It is such a rare thing that without separate hanja study, I would forget the hanja.
Fox wrote:
My pocket dictionary also includes the hanja for sino-Korean words, so some practice can come from that as well.

Yes, I agree. The dictionary is where I encounter hanja the most. This is because while studying Korean, I spend lots of time in the dictionary, and the dictionary shows me the hanja for a word.
I expect that in the future the dictionary will be the only thing that will allow me to try to not forget my hanja knowledge.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:24 am    Post subject: Re: how to not forget your hanja Reply with quote

joesp wrote:

Fox wrote:
2) 한문 / 한시

Actually, all the hanja test is about is the hanja. To write all the Korean in hanja requires knowledge of what specific hanja do grammitically, which is not on the exam.


Kind of. The definitions of the hanja correlate to their usage in 한문, not just the grammatical particles, but all of them. You complained earlier up about not caring about a hanja's major meanings, but to me, that's of value, and it's also the easiest part, because I get practice using those definitions in context; knowing the 강 you mentioned above is 벼리 강 would be useful to me. He asked how to get practice with hanja and keep your knowledge fresh, and 한문 is a potential method, since it forces active recall of both sound and meaning. You might not need to know 한문 to pass most of the hanja tests, but that doesn't mean it can't help.

You say you can't read 한문, but if you take a glance at some, I bet you'd be able to get a rough feel for its meaning even with no grammatical practice (the word order is similar to English).
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javis



Joined: 28 Feb 2013

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

joesp wrote:
FYI, the 국어 사전 (Korean-korean dictionaries) mark the long sound with the ː mark, as you can see in the following (I underlined it):
naver dictionary wrote:
간구-하다 懇求--[발음 : 간ː구하다]

.....
Fox wrote:
How do you even find the answers to these (long and short sounds) without buying some sort of test study book anyway?

Nowhere else I could find.
They even say "our ideas about long and short sounds may differ from that used in dictionaries as we have compiled our own list."

I tried to listen to newscasters -- arguably the best Korean pronunciation -- to tell, but couldn't. I asked people, they couldn't tell either.
I honestly don't know what the purpose of this section (or this supposed aspect of the Korean language) is about.

You'll hear a distinction in vowel lengths in certain dialects outside of the Seoul metropolitan area, for example 호남 지방어 and 평안도 사투리, which is basis for North Korea's 표준말 (should you ever speak with any of those... lol).
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thatkidpercy



Joined: 05 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies to my question. I'm already a daily Anki user (pushing 5,000 cards in my Korean deck) and always include the hanja for unknown words. I can still passively recognise a lot of characters and it's nice to have an extra hook to help memorise words, but I seriously doubt I could produce more than a couple of hundred if I was asked to write them down.

The problem for me would be that I really struggle to keep interest if I'm learning something without any context - I can't deal with vocabulary lists, for example, and all of my Anki cards are complete sentences which show a word used in context. I guess I'd have to make cards prompting me to write a hanja for a particular word in a given sentence - studying the hanja one by one in isolation would drive me mad. I've never looked at 한시 or 한문 but will do so later this afternoon! Thanks for the information.
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joesp



Joined: 16 Jan 2008

PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fox wrote:
국한혼용.

what is that?? Some old book from 1900 which is a mix of hanja + hangul ?? before they moved all the way to hangul??I don't know.

thatkidpercy wrote:
I can still passively recognise a lot of characters and it's nice to have an extra hook to help memorise words, but I seriously doubt I could produce more than a couple of hundred if I was asked to write them down.

You should be prepared for a room filled of 69 elementary kids (with their parents) and then you, the foreigner adult! when you go for that level 7 exam. My level 5 test was like that. What a funny experience for me.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

joesp wrote:
Fox wrote:
국한혼용.

what is that?? Some old book from 1900 which is a mix of hanja + hangul ?? before they moved all the way to hangul??I don't know.


Korean Mixed Script.
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Seoulman69



Joined: 14 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm studying the Sogang books and I'm having difficulty understanding when to use 에 or 에서 after a location.
I understand 에 is used to indicate a location where someone or something exists and 에서 indicates an action/state taking place but i don't know when to use each one.

Can anyone make this a bit clearer for me?
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Privateer



Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Location: Easy Street.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone know any 'cool' Korean words or phrases? For instance, I like '얄미워' or '재수얿다'. I think proverbs go down better in conversation here too - provided you know when they're situationally appropriate, of course - nothing worse than the cliched foreigner messing up a phrase or using it wrong.
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joesp



Joined: 16 Jan 2008

PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seoulman69 wrote:
I'm studying the Sogang books and I'm having difficulty understanding when to use 에 or 에서 after a location.
I understand 에 is used to indicate a location where someone or something exists and 에서 indicates an action/state taking place but i don't know when to use each one. Can anyone make this a bit clearer for me?


We answered this back on page 57 of this thread

Privateer wrote:
Anyone know any 'cool' Korean words or phrases? For instance, I like '얄미워' or '재수얿다'.


Not sure if this will help: Korean spoken expressions
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Zackback



Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: Kyungbuk

PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meshisoyo means delicious (food). I'm not sure of the correct spelling.


Can it be used as a compliment?

What if a woman looked seductively at a man and said "meshisoyo".

Is that really sexual or just simply a compliment?
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javis



Joined: 28 Feb 2013

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zackback wrote:
Meshisoyo means delicious (food). I'm not sure of the correct spelling.


Can it be used as a compliment?

What if a woman looked seductively at a man and said "meshisoyo".

Is that really sexual or just simply a compliment?
what you're hearing in the second sentence is just a similar sounding word to the first. The vowel in the first syllable sounds like "ah" in the first sentence, and like "uh" in the second sentence. The second one means cool, stylish, sexy, etc. when said to a man like that.
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Zackback



Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: Kyungbuk

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok thanks very much!
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eikztot



Joined: 16 Feb 2013

PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:26 pm    Post subject: Great thread! Reply with quote

Hello guys, can you help me translate a message that I receive from a certain site? I've been struggling to know about it..

"미사용으로 비활성화된 계정은 차단일로부터 3개월후 DB에서 모든 데이터를 삭제합니다.
자신의 과거 데이터가 모두 삭제되었다면 다시 가입이 가능하고 이전의 계정으로 인해 불이익을 받지 않습니다. (단, 레이쇼가 최소 1.0이상일 경우)
가입일로 부터 4주동안 업로드,다운로드 기록이 없는 계정은 미사용 계정으로 판단하고 시스템에서 자동 차단합니다."

Here is the google translation:
"The account is disabled blocking unused after three months from the date to delete all the data from the DB.
If your past deleted data can rejoin the old account will not be penalized because of. (However, if the ratio is greater than at least 1.0)
From the four weeks since upload, download history in account that does not have a free account, judgment, and the system automatically turns off. "
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