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Being a vegetarian in Korea
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Poltergeist



Joined: 03 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote:
I went to What's David in Songdo, Incheon, and ordered the Vegetarian Pasta and an Italian style (appetizer) pizza with a friend on my birthday. Turns out the pasta (with cheshik written in Korean as well as the word vegetarian in English) had chicken stock in the dish. Rolling Eyes


Did you file a complaint? If so, did you get a response?
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Crockpot2001



Joined: 01 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.
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Poltergeist



Joined: 03 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.


You haven't addressed my question. Everyone knows iron from plant sources is harder to absorb, even us laypeople who haven't studied phytates or any of the other -ates. Everyone knows that's why they set the iron requirements higher for non-flesheaters. However, do you have statistical evidence that iron deficiency is a real problem for non-flesheaters, compared with the general population? I know everyone knows someone who knows someone who got sick because they stopped eating flesh and ate nothing but Twinkies, but that's not relevant to the question I'm asking.
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Crockpot2001



Joined: 01 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.


You haven't addressed my question. Everyone knows iron from plant sources is harder to absorb, even us laypeople who haven't studied phytates or any of the other -ates. Everyone knows that's why they set the iron requirements higher for non-flesheaters. However, do you have statistical evidence that iron deficiency is a real problem for non-flesheaters, compared with the general population? I know everyone knows someone who knows someone who got sick because they stopped eating flesh and ate nothing but Twinkies, but that's not relevant to the question I'm asking.


OMG, I know where you are trying to go, claiming that I am stating that all vegetarian/vegan diets are risky, I am not, but you are ignoring where I've been. "improperly executed" has been highlighted just for you. I'm talking about a poorly designed vegetarian diet. I never claimed a well thought out vegan/vegatarian diet WILL be risky. I did claim that adding OJ to non-heme sources could be helpful.
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le-paul



Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

poltergiest -
No, I cant substantiate my claims. I am going from 'here-say' 100 percent. And the fact that Koreans add animal to most foods for added flavour. Like I say, I worked in a korean kitchen and didnt see anything that they didnt add animal/fish stock to.

Ive been a vegetarian since 1990 and have no wish to start eating anything that may contain any kind of gelling agent that may contain animals whether its rennet, gelatin or whatever.

The fact is, I just dont have any information on that subject short of visiting every tofu factory (which I cant be arsed to do).

So, like I said, until I can be proved otherwise, Im not eating it. What everyone else does however, is their buisness.

But please - someone find some evidence so I can happily tuck in again.

sincerely,

le-paul
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Poltergeist



Joined: 03 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.


You haven't addressed my question. Everyone knows iron from plant sources is harder to absorb, even us laypeople who haven't studied phytates or any of the other -ates. Everyone knows that's why they set the iron requirements higher for non-flesheaters. However, do you have statistical evidence that iron deficiency is a real problem for non-flesheaters, compared with the general population? I know everyone knows someone who knows someone who got sick because they stopped eating flesh and ate nothing but Twinkies, but that's not relevant to the question I'm asking.


OMG, I know where you are trying to go, claiming that I am stating that all vegetarian/vegan diets are risky, I am not, but you are ignoring where I've been. "improperly executed" has been highlighted just for you. I'm talking about a poorly designed vegetarian diet. I never claimed a well thought out vegan/vegatarian diet WILL be risky. I did claim that adding OJ to non-heme sources could be helpful.


Why does it have to be OJ? Why not red peppers, or cucumbers, or lettuce? (All of which are readily available in Korea, BTW.)

You joined this discussion to refute a poster who'd joined it to refute the notion that it's "too hard" to get enough of X [iron or whatever nutrients] while in Korea. You haven't jumped into any of the discussions of smoking, drinking or other drug use and called those practices "risky."

I'm not a health professional, but I can say confidently that smoking cigarettes is risky because there's a mountain of death certificates to back that statement up. Tell me, why would you assume that someone who doesn't want to include flesh (or other animal products) in his/her diet is an idiot who needs a stern warning to do it "right"--possibly even a stronger warning than you'd extend to a smoker or alcoholic?
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nathanrutledge



Joined: 01 May 2008
Location: Marakesh

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're looking for beans cheap, I know they can be had. Friend of mine owns a restaurant, gave me loads of black beans for free as he buys them 50kg at a time. IF you get a couple people together and find a restaurant supplier, you can easily get pricey foods for decent prices. I've been going to town on my black beans these days...
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Poltergeist



Joined: 03 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

le-paul wrote:
poltergiest -
No, I cant substantiate my claims. I am going from 'here-say' 100 percent. And the fact that Koreans add animal to most foods for added flavour. Like I say, I worked in a korean kitchen and didnt see anything that they didnt add animal/fish stock to.

Ive been a vegetarian since 1990 and have no wish to start eating anything that may contain any kind of gelling agent that may contain animals whether its rennet, gelatin or whatever.

The fact is, I just dont have any information on that subject short of visiting every tofu factory (which I cant be arsed to do).

So, like I said, until I can be proved otherwise, Im not eating it. What everyone else does however, is their buisness.

But please - someone find some evidence so I can happily tuck in again.

sincerely,

le-paul


LP, I didn't realize until recently that tofu in Korea isn't always vegan--however, it isn't, and my reason for posting that message wasn't to say tofu should be eaten no questions asked. But I seriously doubt the additive that makes SOME tofu unacceptable is rennet, and that claim made your post (which was otherwise right on target IMO) look questionable. Most importantly, it isn't ALL tofu that contains animal products.

I think a tofu-based dish at Loving Hut is trustworthy because I've talked to the staff of several Loving Hut restaurants and I know they make every effort to check ingredients. Recently they told me that Pulmuone and a few other brands were vegan but many others aren't, and to look for something without "소포제" and "유화제." (At least I think that's right--my Korean is terrible but I'd know it if I saw it again.)
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Crockpot2001



Joined: 01 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.


You haven't addressed my question. Everyone knows iron from plant sources is harder to absorb, even us laypeople who haven't studied phytates or any of the other -ates. Everyone knows that's why they set the iron requirements higher for non-flesheaters. However, do you have statistical evidence that iron deficiency is a real problem for non-flesheaters, compared with the general population? I know everyone knows someone who knows someone who got sick because they stopped eating flesh and ate nothing but Twinkies, but that's not relevant to the question I'm asking.


OMG, I know where you are trying to go, claiming that I am stating that all vegetarian/vegan diets are risky, I am not, but you are ignoring where I've been. "improperly executed" has been highlighted just for you. I'm talking about a poorly designed vegetarian diet. I never claimed a well thought out vegan/vegatarian diet WILL be risky. I did claim that adding OJ to non-heme sources could be helpful.


Why does it have to be OJ? Why not red peppers, or cucumbers, or lettuce? (All of which are readily available in Korea, BTW.)

You joined this discussion to refute a poster who'd joined it to refute the notion that it's "too hard" to get enough of X [iron or whatever nutrients] while in Korea. You haven't jumped into any of the discussions of smoking, drinking or other drug use and called those practices "risky."

I'm not a health professional, but I can say confidently that smoking cigarettes is risky because there's a mountain of death certificates to back that statement up. Tell me, why would you assume that someone who doesn't want to include flesh (or other animal products) in his/her diet is an idiot who needs a stern warning to do it "right"--possibly even a stronger warning than you'd extend to a smoker or alcoholic?


Oh, I'm supposed to address every health concern here? I never called anyone an idiot. I never offered a stern warning. are you mixing me and Le-paul up?

I'm not sure I've ever posting anything HERE on the risks of smoking, drinking or drugs....and for this very reason. I'm not interested in furthering this circle jerk.
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Crockpot2001



Joined: 01 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nathanrutledge wrote:
If you're looking for beans cheap, I know they can be had. Friend of mine owns a restaurant, gave me loads of black beans for free as he buys them 50kg at a time. IF you get a couple people together and find a restaurant supplier, you can easily get pricey foods for decent prices. I've been going to town on my black beans these days...


This is good. Making friends with restaurant owners can help. Did you get the Western style black beans or the K-style? I was given some of the K-black beans by a Korean friend who knows I like Mexi food. I soaked and cooked the beans FOREVER and they never got soft. Not the right type I suppose.

I have had good luck finding a good variety of beans by going to the industrial areas of Korea and looking for Hallal grocers. The immigrant workers are their main customers. I also get cilantro and sometimes limes there.
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Poltergeist



Joined: 03 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.


You haven't addressed my question. Everyone knows iron from plant sources is harder to absorb, even us laypeople who haven't studied phytates or any of the other -ates. Everyone knows that's why they set the iron requirements higher for non-flesheaters. However, do you have statistical evidence that iron deficiency is a real problem for non-flesheaters, compared with the general population? I know everyone knows someone who knows someone who got sick because they stopped eating flesh and ate nothing but Twinkies, but that's not relevant to the question I'm asking.


OMG, I know where you are trying to go, claiming that I am stating that all vegetarian/vegan diets are risky, I am not, but you are ignoring where I've been. "improperly executed" has been highlighted just for you. I'm talking about a poorly designed vegetarian diet. I never claimed a well thought out vegan/vegatarian diet WILL be risky. I did claim that adding OJ to non-heme sources could be helpful.


Why does it have to be OJ? Why not red peppers, or cucumbers, or lettuce? (All of which are readily available in Korea, BTW.)

You joined this discussion to refute a poster who'd joined it to refute the notion that it's "too hard" to get enough of X [iron or whatever nutrients] while in Korea. You haven't jumped into any of the discussions of smoking, drinking or other drug use and called those practices "risky."

I'm not a health professional, but I can say confidently that smoking cigarettes is risky because there's a mountain of death certificates to back that statement up. Tell me, why would you assume that someone who doesn't want to include flesh (or other animal products) in his/her diet is an idiot who needs a stern warning to do it "right"--possibly even a stronger warning than you'd extend to a smoker or alcoholic?


Oh, I'm supposed to address every health concern here? I never called anyone an idiot. I never offered a stern warning. are you mixing me and Le-paul up?

I'm not sure I've ever posting anything HERE on the risks of smoking, drinking or drugs....and for this very reason. I'm not interested in furthering this circle jerk.


No, I don't think so. I think LP's intention was to dispel the fearmongering and disinformation that usually surround this subject. He gave us an example of what he might eat in a given day to get enough iron. He's probably not a woman, and his body probably doesn't have an inborn tendency to reject iron. So what? It's not his job to plan everyone's meals for them every day. It's funny that you get so rude and defensive when asked for information.
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Crockpot2001



Joined: 01 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:
Crockpot2001 wrote:
Poltergeist wrote:

Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.


Please re-read my post more carefully. I've highlighted some phrases to help you. The content has not changed.


You haven't addressed my question. Everyone knows iron from plant sources is harder to absorb, even us laypeople who haven't studied phytates or any of the other -ates. Everyone knows that's why they set the iron requirements higher for non-flesheaters. However, do you have statistical evidence that iron deficiency is a real problem for non-flesheaters, compared with the general population? I know everyone knows someone who knows someone who got sick because they stopped eating flesh and ate nothing but Twinkies, but that's not relevant to the question I'm asking.


OMG, I know where you are trying to go, claiming that I am stating that all vegetarian/vegan diets are risky, I am not, but you are ignoring where I've been. "improperly executed" has been highlighted just for you. I'm talking about a poorly designed vegetarian diet. I never claimed a well thought out vegan/vegatarian diet WILL be risky. I did claim that adding OJ to non-heme sources could be helpful.


Why does it have to be OJ? Why not red peppers, or cucumbers, or lettuce? (All of which are readily available in Korea, BTW.)

You joined this discussion to refute a poster who'd joined it to refute the notion that it's "too hard" to get enough of X [iron or whatever nutrients] while in Korea. You haven't jumped into any of the discussions of smoking, drinking or other drug use and called those practices "risky."

I'm not a health professional, but I can say confidently that smoking cigarettes is risky because there's a mountain of death certificates to back that statement up. Tell me, why would you assume that someone who doesn't want to include flesh (or other animal products) in his/her diet is an idiot who needs a stern warning to do it "right"--possibly even a stronger warning than you'd extend to a smoker or alcoholic?


Oh, I'm supposed to address every health concern here? I never called anyone an idiot. I never offered a stern warning. are you mixing me and Le-paul up?

I'm not sure I've ever posting anything HERE on the risks of smoking, drinking or drugs....and for this very reason. I'm not interested in furthering this circle jerk.


No, I don't think so. I think LP's intention was to dispel the fearmongering and disinformation that usually surround this subject. He gave us an example of what he might eat in a given day to get enough iron. He's probably not a woman, and his body probably doesn't have an inborn tendency to reject iron. So what? It's not his job to plan everyone's meals for them every day. It's funny that you get so rude and defensive when asked for information.


Maybe it seems rude to you, if so, I apologize, I don't mean to project that. I AM certainly frustrated at being asked to substantiate a claim I've not made and would have a hard time backing up.

If I seem rude to you, I appologize,
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nathanrutledge



Joined: 01 May 2008
Location: Marakesh

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crockpot2001 wrote:
nathanrutledge wrote:
If you're looking for beans cheap, I know they can be had. Friend of mine owns a restaurant, gave me loads of black beans for free as he buys them 50kg at a time. IF you get a couple people together and find a restaurant supplier, you can easily get pricey foods for decent prices. I've been going to town on my black beans these days...


This is good. Making friends with restaurant owners can help. Did you get the Western style black beans or the K-style? I was given some of the K-black beans by a Korean friend who knows I like Mexi food. I soaked and cooked the beans FOREVER and they never got soft. Not the right type I suppose.

I have had good luck finding a good variety of beans by going to the industrial areas of Korea and looking for Hallal grocers. The immigrant workers are their main customers. I also get cilantro and sometimes limes there.


IDK what kind they are. They are black. I soak and then pressure cook them, so I have no trouble getting them right.

In this vein, does anyone know of a good market with beans in bulk? I've just got my black beans from my friend, and I'd love to have some refried beans to go with my tacos...
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NYC_Gal 2.0



Joined: 10 Dec 2010

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poltergeist wrote:
NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote:
I went to What's David in Songdo, Incheon, and ordered the Vegetarian Pasta and an Italian style (appetizer) pizza with a friend on my birthday. Turns out the pasta (with cheshik written in Korean as well as the word vegetarian in English) had chicken stock in the dish. Rolling Eyes


Did you file a complaint? If so, did you get a response?


They apologized, and the next time I went they offered to make a few of the non vegetarian things (Mexican food) vegetarian for my party, as a few of us were vegetarians. It's a decent place, but it was a little annoying that first time. I'm vegetarian (well, I eat some seafood when in Asia to make life easier so I'm technically pescatarian) only for health, and not because I love animals. Burgers taste amazing, I just don't want the meat in my system. A little chicken stock accidentally wasn't going to ruin my birthday out. The pizza was great, though sometimes they undercook the thin crust. I prefer mine a little more on the well done side.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poltergeist wrote:
[q
Do you have any proof that vegetarians and/or vegans have higher rates of iron deficiency anemia than the general population? If so, I'd like to see a credible link.



According to the Mayo Clinic vegetarians are a higher at risk group.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/iron-deficiency-amemia/DS00323/DSECTION=risk-factors
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