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Wrong Information that never seems to fade.

 
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:32 am    Post subject: Wrong Information that never seems to fade. Reply with quote

I have noticed something that comes up all the time here on Dave's and elsewhere in Korea.

People ask when do I have to leave Korea by? For those with the know how, it is simple. You have to leave on the date stated on your Alien Registration Card(ARC) by midnight (as ttompatz always states). If you need more time there are a few options. From transfers to extensions and even if really needed a Japan trip. I can understand confusion with start dates, contract dates, stamps in passports and ARC cards. It can get a little confusing

But WHY for the love of all that is holy, how does the following stupid ass common misconception keep coming back. In the many years here, I have heard this repeated as the rule.

"You have up to two weeks (varies) extra past your contract/visa date/start date"

NO! NO! NO! NO! Following this advice, will leave you poorer and any future in Korea more difficult. How the heck does this advice stick around?

Are there any other little bon mots of info, that people have noticed?
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nora



Joined: 14 Apr 2012

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, probably because they've been giving 13 month ARC cards for some time now. So if your contract finishes Feb 28, then your ARC card probably doesn't expire until the end of March.

You're right, you DO have to leave by the date on the ARC card, but the ARC date and the contract finish date are not always (frequently not) the same thing anymore.
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The Cosmic Hum



Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:41 am    Post subject: Re: Wrong Information that never seems to fade. Reply with quote

Skippy wrote:
I have noticed something that comes up all the time here on Dave's and elsewhere in Korea.

People ask when do I have to leave Korea by? For those with the know how, it is simple. You have to leave on the date stated on your Alien Registration Card(ARC) by midnight (as ttompatz always states). If you need more time there are a few options. From transfers to extensions and even if really needed a Japan trip. I can understand confusion with start dates, contract dates, stamps in passports and ARC cards. It can get a little confusing

But WHY for the love of all that is holy, how does the following stupid ass common misconception keep coming back. In the many years here, I have heard this repeated as the rule.

"You have up to two weeks (varies) extra past your contract/visa date/start date"

NO! NO! NO! NO! Following this advice, will leave you poorer and any future in Korea more difficult. How the heck does this advice stick around?

Are there any other little bon mots of info, that people have noticed?

hmm....I'll take a shot at this.
Perhaps it comes from the incidents of those who have been fired early.
They have two weeks from the time immigration is notified by their employer to get back to where they once belonged.
Or something like that.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Wrong Information that never seems to fade. Reply with quote

Skippy wrote:
I have noticed something that comes up all the time here on Dave's and elsewhere in Korea.

People ask when do I have to leave Korea by? For those with the know how, it is simple. You have to leave on the date stated on your Alien Registration Card(ARC) by midnight (as ttompatz always states). If you need more time there are a few options. From transfers to extensions and even if really needed a Japan trip. I can understand confusion with start dates, contract dates, stamps in passports and ARC cards. It can get a little confusing

But WHY for the love of all that is holy, how does the following stupid ass common misconception keep coming back. In the many years here, I have heard this repeated as the rule.

"You have up to two weeks (varies) extra past your contract/visa date/start date"

NO! NO! NO! NO! Following this advice, will leave you poorer and any future in Korea more difficult. How the heck does this advice stick around?

Are there any other little bon mots of info, that people have noticed?



Amen to that. I would add to that...those supposedly "required" hagwon teacher meetings.
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nora wrote:
Well, probably because they've been giving 13 month ARC cards for some time now. So if your contract finishes Feb 28, then your ARC card probably doesn't expire until the end of March.


I think immigrations idea of giving 13 month E2 visas is a great idea. That as you stipulated has been around for a little while. Still the "you have 2 weeks extra" advice has even predated 13 month visa.

nora wrote:
You're right, you DO have to leave by the date on the ARC card, but the ARC date and the contract finish date are not always (frequently not) the same thing anymore.


Yea, as I mentioned people get confused with the dates on the various documents they get. I mean it starts from signing the contract which is dated one way, but may not actually reflect when teacher actually starts. Then add in getting the visa back from the consulate gives another visa date. So people are adding a year to all these different dates. Once again, I could understand people being confused about end date, but why is people keep saying you have extra time past whatever date.

The Cosmic Hum wrote:

hmm....I'll take a shot at this.
Perhaps it comes from the incidents of those who have been fired early.
They have two weeks from the time immigration is notified by their employer to get back to where they once belonged.
Or something like that.


I was thinking a little along that lines. Korean immigration likes to throw around 14 days here or there for certain procedures. So maybe over time the 14 day to get out of country after being fired has morphed to 14 days to get out of country after job finishes.

The UrbanMyth wrote:

Amen to that. I would add to that...those supposedly "required" hagwon teacher meetings.


I beg to differ a little, I do think some of those hagwon teacher meetings are legit. The ones city wide that all teachers have to do once a year. Legit, but a farce. A meeting for a couple of hours with the basic hmmm.. drugs are bad... m'kay" and the "refrain from molesting your students" kind of advice. The last one I went to the one about getting the E2 visa had a multitude of mistakes. I think the officials that do put it on sort want to make useful. Like above, they end up a farce and big waste of time. Throw in the usual Korean style messing up and it makes something that might be useful into worse then a visit to the dentist.

I think the one think that gets thrown around a little too much in the ESL and hagwon world is the ""required". Or the "this has to be done" or "you HAVE to do this". Rarely is there the lateral thinking or the "well, maybe you/we can ..." ability.

In the end, I do expect to get bad information for bosses and managers. Some bad information from recruiters, and pretty much spot on information with the foreign teachers here.
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Squire



Joined: 26 Sep 2010
Location: Jeollanam-do

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A quick glance at my ARC shows I have about three weeks between my contract finishing and me having to leave. Unless my contract started a few weeks out from what I think it did.

Anyway, if anybody is curious about their own situation surely the best course of action would be to have a look at the end date on their contract and then the expiry date of their ARC
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yfb



Joined: 29 Jan 2009

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"It's against the law to teach in public schools without a co-teacher!"
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yfb wrote:
"It's against the law to teach in public schools without a co-teacher!"



Ahh, yes this one.... Good One!

This is less wrong information, more of how ways "things" are supposed to work meeting with reality. Many of the newbies who come and insist that the coteacher has to be there in the class, quickly meet this lesson head on. It might be worth arguing out. In the end, it ends up a political mess and could really mess up a teachers time with school.

I actually tried to find actual laws and contract points stating about this. For the want of a chart and other reasons I really could not. Some of the teachers at waygook.org got testy about this.
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earthquakez



Joined: 10 Nov 2010

PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 1:23 am    Post subject: Just another example of misinformation Reply with quote

nora wrote:
Well, probably because they've been giving 13 month ARC cards for some time now. So if your contract finishes Feb 28, then your ARC card probably doesn't expire until the end of March.

You're right, you DO have to leave by the date on the ARC card, but the ARC date and the contract finish date are not always (frequently not) the same thing anymore.


NO and NO and NO again. Rolling Eyes You don't have to leave Korea - you have the option of applying for a tourist visa or a D-10 that allows you to legally look for work in Korea. Stop doing what this thread understands is giving misinformation.

I wonder how deliberate this misinformation is. It seems some people want less people around because the teachers' market here is saturated at the moment. Hard cheese. You have to compete.

Each Korean Immigration office gives a form that allows application for extension of stay in Korea. If you get turned down for a D-10 you can stay on as a tourist to tidy up loose ends after your contract and ARC residency status expires.
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:38 am    Post subject: Re: Just another example of misinformation Reply with quote

earthquakez wrote:

NO and NO and NO again. Rolling Eyes You don't have to leave Korea - you have the option of applying for a tourist visa or a D-10 that allows you to legally look for work in Korea. Stop doing what this thread understands is giving misinformation.


There are always options from the temp extension to transfers to a D-10. Some are easy, some take work. Yet some people find it too hard to do and want a loop hole. Some people are so irresponsible and let passports expire or do not pay attention to important dates. So when things go *beep* up they like to thorough out those kind of pieces of information. With .... "oh I thought".... Yes since they thought, they should be forgiven.

earthquakez wrote:

I wonder how deliberate this misinformation is. It seems some people want less people around because the teachers' market here is saturated at the moment. Hard cheese. You have to compete.


If I was a bit mean, I would not help anybody and let them find out the hard way. If I was really malicious, I would proceed to perpetrate such disinformation. This misinformation has been around for a whole, even before the market got crowded.


Hmmm, any more disinformation.

There is always the ignorance concerning pension, health insurance, and other things. From "oh, my boss told me that I could not get National health, I had to go private." Wish people read more and tried harder.

Just remembered one more that comes up once in a while. Americans and even some other nationalities are eligible to not pay taxes. Well there is some truth to this. Just some stipulations from being public school and time of first two years. But, time and gain you get some hagwon teacher who insists they should get all their taxes back and how come their boss is stalling and blah and blah.
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schwa



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: sokcho

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A lot of people still buy into the notion (pushed by some schools & recruiters) that its okay to fly in quickly on a tourist visa & to work a few weeks before a visa run. It is not.

You might get away with it, but there are some serious consequences if you get caught.
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

schwa wrote:
A lot of people still buy into the notion (pushed by some schools & recruiters) that its okay to fly in quickly on a tourist visa & to work a few weeks before a visa run. It is not.

You might get away with it, but there are some serious consequences if you get caught.


Good one! This disinformation has probably made life difficult for a few people. This one was a bit the norm a few years ago, then died down when the consulate interview became norm, and back to done.

Key word in your post is it is "okay". No is not okay to work that few weeks before the visa trip? It is against the law. Recruiters and schools never add in that caveat. Of course not they do not want to scare the newbie. They do not need to worry their little heads.

The ok should be changed to "it is done and possible,.... but....". It should be,

It is possible to work before the visa run, but it is illegal. Many people do it and are fine, just be aware of the consequences.

Of course, I love it when this blows up in some persons face. Well not really love... It is that schadenfreude thing

http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=223838

That person who lets themselves be stalled and delayed on getting a visa for WEEKS or MONTHS. Then are surprised, shocked and hurt when they are fired or caught. Some schools really like to use'em and lose 'em.


Okay another piece of disinformation.... Well sort of.

That immigration will allow you to skip submitting another CRC if you come back within 90 days. I have seen it on the immigration site, but this one never or rarely works in practice.
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