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question about doing a runner...
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miwi



Joined: 13 Jun 2012

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:14 am    Post subject: question about doing a runner... Reply with quote

I'm hoping it doesn't come to that ... but like those of you who have just left your jobs.

does your boss ever try to track you down? and do you need to like leave the country right away?
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, there are hunts for runners. Everyday bounty hunters go down to city hall to check the posters of midnight runners. I was almost caught once, but thanks to some while timing with a taxi, I was able to escape after a short chase.


Joking aside. If you are not working you need to cancel your visa. Same with schools too. If they have a missing worker, they HAVE to report it. So in general people have 15 days to report that change. Article 21 of the Immigration Control Act.

Quote:
Article 21 (Change and Addition of Work Place)

(1) If a foreigner sojourning in the Republic of Korea intends to change or add his/her work place within the scope of his/her status of sojourn, he/ she shall obtain prior permission from the Minister of Justice: Provided, That a person prescribed by Presidential Decree who has expert knowledge, skill or ability shall report to the Minister of Justice within 15 days from the date on which he/she changes or adds his/her work place.


Not doing so, can lead to fine and possible blackmarks on your record, which can effect future applications for visas.

It is best to get out of the country and get the visa canceled by handing it in to immigration at departure. One simple way is a trip to Japan via ferry. Another option is going into your local immigration office and say you quit your job. You will be given 14 days to leave the country or find another job (if permissible LOR and all that).

Bosses, well ex-bosses can sort of track down you down. But their options on what they can do to you is limited. They can not force you back to work or hold on to you. They can raise stinks about any money owed or possible crimes committed by teachers. But a scorned ex boss can easily get in your face and yell at you. Throw in some possible threats. They can also kick you out of the apartment, too.

So if there is a time between running and actual leaving the country, then you best bet is to get out the area. Pack up your stuff and move away from the neighborhood. You may also consider getting rid of your phone too. Reduce the chances of running into coworkers and the boss.

Still, do not leave it more then a week, I say.

As to consequences on coming back, well that is another story.
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miwi



Joined: 13 Jun 2012

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thank you^^; I guess I'll just resign ... it amounts to the same thing except if I resign I won't be tracked down.

the stress is killing me and really don't know how much more I can put up with.
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Skippy wrote:
They can raise stinks about any money owed or possible crimes committed by teachers.


They can only raise a stink about possible crimes committed if they have actual proof, by which I mean something the prosecutor's office will accept as proof. Contrary to what a number of hagweon owners tell their foreign employees, just saying something happened won't cut it.

Quote:
But a scorned ex boss can easily get in your face and yell at you. Throw in some possible threats.


Owing to a completely impossible school to which I got transferred, I pulled a runner* in June, and this is after working for six years for the BMOE. Scorned supervisor and principal tried that "get in my face" stunt. I simply refused to let them into the building.

Quote:
They can also kick you out of the apartment, too.


Ah, there's the rub! This kind of falls into two situations. The first is if you rented the apartment yourself and the second is if the school provided the apartment. If you rented the apartment (as I did, thanks to the school's colossal inefficiency), then they can't do jack about it.

If the school provided you the apartment, on the other hand, that also falls into two situations. The first is if you did not use the apartment address as your home address on the ARC and you did not inform, in writing, the owner of the apartment--not the lease-holder (your school)--that you are living in that apartment. In that case, the school can simply call the police and you can be taken off the premises for trespassing. I don't know of anyone who's had that happen to them, but it is in the realm of possibilty.

Now, if you did use the apartment address for the ARC and you did inform, in writing, the apartment owner that you are living there and you're feeling a bit vindictive, change the locks and have the school go to the trouble and expense of having you evicted. Make sure you've gotten your stuff moved elsewhere, though, because they can have you evicted--but it takes time.

Quote:
So if there is a time between running and actual leaving the country, then you best bet is to get out the area. Pack up your stuff and move away from the neighborhood. You may also consider getting rid of your phone too. Reduce the chances of running into coworkers and the boss.

Still, do not leave it more then a week, I say.


Sound advice. For the phone, though, you can block the school's number.

Quote:
As to consequences on coming back, well that is another story.


Yep. I shall find out next year about that.

*I'm not sure that, technically, I actually pulled a runner. I did inform the lunatic supervisor and the principal that I was done with their stupidity and walked off the premises. I then notified both Immigration and the Pension Office with my departure information. I also swung by the BMOE office to explain, verbally, why I left. It was to my advantage financially to not give them written notice.
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EZE



Joined: 05 May 2012

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CentralCali wrote:
Skippy wrote:
They can raise stinks about any money owed or possible crimes committed by teachers.


They can only raise a stink about possible crimes committed if they have actual proof, by which I mean something the prosecutor's office will accept as proof. Contrary to what a number of hagweon owners tell their foreign employees, just saying something happened won't cut it.


Actually, they can just say whatever they want and the Korean government will automatically assume the foreigner is guilty.

My former employer, Wonderland, reported me to the authorities five months after I pulled a midnight runner, saying I didn't pay unemployment. Whenever I pass through Incheon Airport, I get detained over this frivolous and fabricated allegation.
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EZE wrote:
Actually, they can just say whatever they want and the Korean government will automatically assume the foreigner is guilty.


Not in my experience or the experience of many of my friends who've had "issues" with cruddy employers. That's not to say that there aren't vicious scum employers out there, though.

Quote:
My former employer, Wonderland, reported me to the authorities five months after I pulled a midnight runner, saying I didn't pay unemployment.


That's the 2nd-most laughable stunt any hagweon employer's pulled yet. E-2 visa holders don't pay unemployment. It's not even on the radar. The 1st-most laughable cruddy hagweon owner stunt is telling the employee at the end of the employee's contract, "I can't pay you what I owe you because you have to pay the temporary teacher's salary while I'm looking for a new permanent teacher."

Quote:
Whenever I pass through Incheon Airport, I get detained over this frivolous and fabricated allegation.


Please agitate with the prosecutor's office or take that jerk of an ex-boss to court for defaming you.

I see that you're another victim of Wonderland. Seriously, why are people still working for those bastards?
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

miwi wrote:
thank you^^; I guess I'll just resign ... it amounts to the same thing except if I resign I won't be tracked down.

the stress is killing me and really don't know how much more I can put up with.


Careful with that too. Even doing the right and honest way can so back fire. Please read some of the other threads on midnight runs. Use google at the words site:forums.eslcafe.com/korea

You need to be careful and consider the consequences of the different quite scenarios.

    Be honest and give notice.
    Wait for pay day and then run.
    Tough it out.
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miwi



Joined: 13 Jun 2012

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why? If I just hand in my notice and leave immediately, how will that backfire?

Like literally hand in letter and walk off premises? Okay I know I'm not getting the pay owed, but I'm done with this school.

It's not worth the stress of dealing with them anymore. I'm sick of being treated like this.

But I will do some more research before I do anything.
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Handing in your notice and leaving immediately avoids what the above poster may have been referring to. More than a few people have tried to go with the "30 day" or "60 day" notice to the employer only to be summarily fired and not even paid what was owed to them.

If you're going to leave Korea straightaway, just do it. Call the bums from the airport right before the plane takes off or don't even bother calling them. Why do you need to give them written notice? After all, there's not a darn thing in your letter to them that will get them to even consider changing their ways.

Now, if you're going to leave in the middle of the workday, then, yes, you really should tell them you're done. Make sure you already have the stuff you can't take with you disposed of/placed with friends, your traveling bags packed and ready for immediate--and I mean immediate--departure, and your flight ticket paid for and in hand. If your boss is one of those scum who's holding your passport, that's a whole 'nother round of crud being pulled.

You sound to me like you want to honor the contract to the "T". Well, the contract provision that says you must provide X numbr of days notice when quitting is bogus; it simply doesn't match with what the labor law says. You can quit instantly and there's naught the boss can do about it. You are not their slave, even if that's the way they've been treating you.

If you don't mind sharing, what's the issue? Perhaps it's something posters here can advise you on how to deal with it short of quitting or even getting into any kind of confrontation with your employer.
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young_clinton



Joined: 09 Sep 2009

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're running from a public school position, you won't get another public school position again. As for your Hogwan owner or boss keeping you from getting another job, it's very unlikely. Immigration usually doesn't care about runners. You won't be able to list the job on a resume (at least I don't think so) so you will have to come up with a reason for the dates that you are unemployed.
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I saw the thread where the OP discusses the situation at their school. In short, the owner is an utter moron. He's firing Korean teachers at the drop of a pin because some demonic child's parents (your choice if it's the child or the parents are demonic) whine about how their kids are faring at the school.

OP: It costs a great deal more to get a foreign teacher (legally) to work at a hagweon than it does to hire a Korean teacher. For the Korean teachers, it's just the salary and, if the employer is being completely honest, national health, pension, tax, and unemployment insurance. For the foreign teacher, it's salary, airfare, housing, national health, pension, and tax. If your employer's pulling unemployment insurance from you, that's not right. You're in a better position in some ways than the Korean teachers at your school.

A number of posters have advised in other threads that the best way to handle whining parents is SNIP: Smile, Nod, Ignore, Proceed. Try that. But under no circumstances should you sign anything whatsoever. Let me repeat that:

SIGN NOTHING!

If you sign something, especially if it's in Korean, then you have just submitted your own resignation and you will get nothing. Nothing, nada, zilch. You might even have agreed to pay the employer for a bunch of stuff you know nothing about and it will come out of your very last payment, which of course, will be zero owing to what you just signed.


Last edited by CentralCali on Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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EZE



Joined: 05 May 2012

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CentralCali wrote:
Please agitate with the prosecutor's office or take that jerk of an ex-boss to court for defaming you.

I see that you're another victim of Wonderland. Seriously, why are people still working for those bastards?


I can only blame myself for working there when I knew its reputation. I'm actually not all that disappointed with Wonderland since it lived up to its reputation. It's the banana republic behavior by the South Korean government that is disappointing. I consider South Korea to be a developed country, so it is somewhat surprising to see how easily Wonderland has been able to enlist the South Korean government as a partner in its fraudulent extortion schemes.

To the OP, don't turn in a notice. The chances are practically zero that you will receive any compensation for any work done after that moment, and you won't receive your apartment deposit either. You would be setting yourself up to do a month or two of free labor. You're not in Kansas anymore. I lost ten or eleven days of pay when I pulled a midnight runner. If I would have turned in a thirty day notice, I would have lost thirty days of pay.
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miwi



Joined: 13 Jun 2012

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I was planning to say that whatever day I handed in my resignation letter was my last day and then just leave.

So yeah I wasn't really planning to give any real notice.

And I won't sign anything^^; thank you for the advice, it really helps.

Yeah I'm working at a hagwon not public school. You can guess the name very easily...
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EZE



Joined: 05 May 2012

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was it the one in Anyang?
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

miwi wrote:
Well I was planning to say that whatever day I handed in my resignation letter was my last day and then just leave.


Waste of time to write anything to the school. Also, it could come back to haunt you, depending on what you put in that letter. Remember that Korea has a very strange take on slander and libel. It's best to not give anyone any ammunition.

Quote:
So yeah I wasn't really planning to give any real notice.


Are you planning on returning to your country or going to another country to work immediately? If you're planning on working in Korea, take tom's advice and get your stuff (new documents) ready in advance.

Quote:
And I won't sign anything^^; thank you for the advice, it really helps.


Friend of mine ended up resigning by accident when his supervising co-teacher at an elementary school in Gyeonggi-do took an instant dislike to him. The co-teacher handed him a stack of papers, then informed him, "There is a document you must sign." She indicated he must sign all of them, not a one of which was in English or even had an English translation attached. One of the documents my friend signed was his immediate resignation. In fact, he was escorted off the school grounds immediately.

Quote:
Yeah I'm working at a hagwon not public school. You can guess the name very easily...


CDI or Wonderland?
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