Site Search:
 
TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Korean Perception of Foreign English Teachers
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Discussion Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
JustinC



Joined: 10 Mar 2012
Location: We Are The World!

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Resorting to insults usually means you're not winning, I'd give up now mate.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tiger fancini



Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most of the Koreans I know are able to distinguish between a good foreign teacher and a bad foreign teacher, and act accordingly. I've also been exposed to a rather large cross section of Korean society, having spent numerous years teaching adults in various locations.

From my observations, good foreign teachers are still respected and given opportunities to make decent money. Bad foreign teachers are shunned, and will often be questioned of their motives for being here and also their employment prospects back home.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Moondoggy



Joined: 07 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:45 am    Post subject: Re: Korean Perception of Foreign English Teachers Reply with quote

MetaFitX wrote:
I was having an interesting conversation with a good (Korean) friend of mine and we kind of drifted into talking about Korean perceptions of all things foreign here. I asked her about what many Koreans thought about foreign English teacher and her answer kind of surprised me. She straight up told me that many of them see foreign English teachers as incompetent, lazy and unable to get a job back in their home country. So, they come to Korea...

I asked her that if that is the only reason they come here what does that say about Korea....but it didn't seem to register.

I don't know, I've always gotten the impression that although I'm somewhat low on the totem pole here, most people seem to give me a good amount of respect when I'm out and about (perhaps not in the workplace but that is a different story).

Do many Koreans really see the foreigners teaching English here that way????


Not entirely true. I personally know a few girls from Berkeley (one from Stanford) who moved to Korea to teach English BECAUSE they're so interested in the country and the culture. And you bet they're having a blast. They're not losers and could definitely find jobs in the bay area if they wanted to.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Peace Train



Joined: 01 Nov 2012

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JustinC wrote:
Resorting to insults usually means you're not winning, I'd give up now mate.


I'm genuinely perplexed by your response. Do you mean I took what they said out of context? If that's what you're driving at, every interaction has pretty damn cut and dry. There are no gray areas. Young and old, male and female, VP, secretary and all shades in between, were adamant that english teachers are "no good" and "bad for Korea." Sorry if that stings but it seems to be popular opinion.

The issue here isn't if there are right or not. Personally I don't think so. Most of the English teachers i've met have seemed professional and have their heads screwed on pretty straight -- or so it seemed.

My whole point is WHY do they think this? And the answer is, quite clearly, the barrage of negative PR spewed by the Korean media since, from my experience, none of the people I spoke to had a direct negative experience with an English teacher. That, to me, would be serious cause for concern.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
aq8knyus



Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Peace Train wrote:
JustinC wrote:
Resorting to insults usually means you're not winning, I'd give up now mate.


I'm genuinely perplexed by your response. Do you mean I took what they said out of context? If that's what you're driving at, every interaction has pretty damn cut and dry. There are no gray areas. Young and old, male and female, VP, secretary and all shades in between, were adamant that english teachers are "no good" and "bad for Korea." Sorry if that stings but it seems to be popular opinion.

The issue here isn't if there are right or not. Personally I don't think so. Most of the English teachers i've met have seemed professional and have their heads screwed on pretty straight -- or so it seemed.

My whole point is WHY do they think this? And the answer is, quite clearly, the barrage of negative PR spewed by the Korean media since, from my experience, none of the people I spoke to had a direct negative experience with an English teacher. That, to me, would be serious cause for concern.


It is just the same old story of people thinking that those damn foreigners are taking their jobs and stealing their women. In 2002 when the deaths of those young girls were the spark for massive anti-American protests 82 children were killed on Korean roads. There were no vigils or monuments for them. That is not a bash against Korea, it is the same thing everywhere.

Also it doesn't take much to get a job here and yet the rewards are better than those on offer for many Koreans.

That and English is so important for every decent job and it must be an expensive and frustrating thing to learn. In an already highly competitive society where 82% of school leavers go on to university the mania for English is going to cause a backlash.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dodge7



Joined: 21 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savant wrote:
aq8knyus wrote:
Millions of Koreans spend a lot of money on sending their kids to be taught by the waygook. Why would they do that if they thought we were incompetent and/or lazy?


Babysitting service to make up for the parents' own incompetence and/or laziness?

This is rather funny to me. Stay-at-home mothers in Korea got pissed at the government because mothers who worked got free money to send their kids to day care. So, the government now gives free money to stay-at-home moms to send their kids to daycare bc they bi$%^ed about it--now the day cares are filled up with kids whose mothers are too lazy to take care of them and working mothers are finding it hard to find open spaces for their children.

THAT is the height of laziness. Can't even take care of their damn kids. Pathetic.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Babysitting service to make up for the parents' own incompetence and/or laziness?

This is rather funny to me. Stay-at-home mothers in Korea got pissed at the government because mothers who worked got free money to send their kids to day care. So, the government now gives free money to stay-at-home moms to send their kids to daycare bc they bi$%^ed about it--now the day cares are filled up with kids whose mothers are too lazy to take care of them and working mothers are finding it hard to find open spaces for their children.

THAT is the height of laziness. Can't even take care of their damn kids. Pathetic.


How long are these classes it is being claimed are used for babysitting purposes? I've heard people on here talking about twenty to forty minute classes. Hardly worth the hassle to get them to the school is it if they want a babysitting service for that length of time?


Last edited by edwardcatflap on Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:50 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
nicwr2002



Joined: 17 Aug 2011

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:48 am    Post subject: Yep Reply with quote

I think it is just their experience with a bad English teacher or an uninformed opinion about foreigners. Everyone has different opinions, but just because you have talked to some people and they feel that foreigners are bad, doesn't mean that "most" Koreans think the same way. For example, if someone who has never lived in Korea were to visit this forum, they would think Korea is the worst place on the planet. Even though this forum only represents a fraction of the total foreign population.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think it is just their experience with a bad English teacher or an uninformed opinion about foreigners


I remember talking to an adult student (about mid twenties) about her previous experience of English teachers and she told me how she'd gone to an adult hagwan and on the first day the teacher asked the students (who were all young females) to put their hands up if they were still a virgin. I asked her what she'd done, wanting to know if she'd complained about it or not and she told me she'd put her hand up. Laughing There's no way she would have made something like that up is there?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
nicwr2002



Joined: 17 Aug 2011

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:09 am    Post subject: wow Reply with quote

edwardcatflap wrote:
Quote:
I think it is just their experience with a bad English teacher or an uninformed opinion about foreigners


I remember talking to an adult student (about mid twenties) about her previous experience of English teachers and she told me how she'd gone to an adult hagwan and on the first day the teacher asked the students (who were all young females) to put their hands up if they were still a virgin. I asked her what she'd done, wanting to know if she'd complained about it or not and she told me she'd put her hand up. Laughing There's no way she would have made something like that up is there?


Wow, see now that gives us all a bad name. That's what I'm talking about though, the one foreigner who has to make everyone look bad. I just hope people have enough sense and realize that not every foreigner is like that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
coralreefer_1



Joined: 19 Jan 2009

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

edwardcatflap wrote:
Quote:
I think it is just their experience with a bad English teacher or an uninformed opinion about foreigners


I remember talking to an adult student (about mid twenties) about her previous experience of English teachers and she told me how she'd gone to an adult hagwan and on the first day the teacher asked the students (who were all young females) to put their hands up if they were still a virgin. I asked her what she'd done, wanting to know if she'd complained about it or not and she told me she'd put her hand up. Laughing There's no way she would have made something like that up is there?



Interesting story. My fiance is currently doing a TESOL certification course, and on the first day of class they were doing a warm up exercise/game where the teacher gave an example sentence, where the underlined parts were to be replaced by students (similar to MAdLibs)

The example sentence he chose (of ALL the billions of possibilities was....

"I want to HAVE SEX because IT FEELS GOOD"

And guess what...teacher is old Korean man.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Interesting story. My fiance is currently doing a TESOL certification course, and on the first day of class they were doing a warm up exercise/game where the teacher gave an example sentence, where the underlined parts were to be replaced by students (similar to MAdLibs)

The example sentence he chose (of ALL the billions of possibilities was....

"I want to HAVE SEX because IT FEELS GOOD"

And guess what...teacher is old Korean man.


Yeah sure there are plenty of pervs of all nationalities around, but the foreigner is obviously going to have more of an impact - human nature being what it is. And I still think the example I gave was worse. The student involved actually said to me, when I asked her why she'd put her hand up, that she felt she had to do what the teacher said because he was in a position of authority.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tiger fancini wrote:
Most of the Koreans I know are able to distinguish between a good foreign teacher and a bad foreign teacher, and act accordingly. I've also been exposed to a rather large cross section of Korean society, having spent numerous years teaching adults in various locations.

From my observations, good foreign teachers are still respected and given opportunities to make decent money. Bad foreign teachers are shunned, and will often be questioned of their motives for being here and also their employment prospects back home.


+1
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Paddycakes



Joined: 05 May 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most Koreans don't think about ESL teachers... they don't care...

Or they care about as much as as the average middle aged white guy back home cares about Vietnamese cooks. This means - not much.

However, some do care, and it's usually those from my experience who have worked or dealt with foreigners usually in educational settings.

Much of the negative perception of ESL teachers stems from some basic things:

1. Korea is a very image centered society, and while it may not apply to everyone in ESL, most ESL teachers look like slobs.

A lot are obese to morbidly obese.

In a society where people are generally thin and care about their appearance and make an effort to dress up, this is an issue.

2. A lot of ESL teachers make no effort to respect or fit in with the culture, but you could probably make that argument among the expats in professional occupations... in fact, they're probably worse since they have the money to not live like average locals.

3. ESL is generally a low paid, non-professional job, and we all know how obsessed Koreans are with income and status (ie., being a Doctor and a graduate of SNU... blah blah blah...).

I know some ESL teachers, especially those who work in universities, genuinely believe in their own minds that they are "professionals", but the reality is you're only a professional if you're a member of a self-regulating body and you're legally responsible for your work. Also, 'professional' jobs are generally high income (plus $100,000 per year).

I know everyone like to think they are "professionals", but those who hark on it usually come across looking insecure and trying to compensate for a reality they don't like.

4. A lot of ESL'ers would be loathe to admit it, but the reality is most are here because they can't get a job back home, or they just don't function socially very well back in their home countries. Or they're here for a fun working holiday... a gap year.

Some generally care about teaching ESL, but most don't.


So, yes, there is a stigma against English Instructors.

But who cares.

You're only here as a transient guest. Make some money. Pay off some student loan debt. Date some cute K-girls.

Have a good time.

Don't fret over how other people perceive you... you can't change their opinions.


Last edited by Paddycakes on Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:18 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paddy was a bit harsh but a lot of what was said in his post was pretty close to the mark.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Discussion Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Page 2 of 8

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2013 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International