Site Search:
 
TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The Best Article I've Ever Seen on the Korean Beer Industry
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Discussion Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Seoulman69



Joined: 14 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Hey I've been reading this thread and I need to put in my 2 cents about the USA's world beer standing. They are definitely the best beer country in the world, without a shadow of doubt. Sure, the macro stuff there is awful and the macro stuff in other European countries is comparably better, but.........Germany, Belgium, England and even Ireland tend to limit themselves to certain traditional styles. German brewers stick to only making German styles, Belgian brewers only make Belgian styles, etc... The American breweries make every style and there are hundreds of breweries there that produce many different styles and do an excellent job at all of them. Breweries like Dogfish Head, Sierra Nevada, Alesmith, North Coast, Bells, etc... make literally EVERY style. I guess what I am saying is that the enormously wide variation of beer in the USA is unparalled by any country, which in my opinion makes it the best beer country.


Only an American could post something so ignorant and dismissive.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HapKi



Joined: 10 Dec 2004
Location: TALL BUILDING-SEOUL

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Only an American could post something so ignorant and dismissive.

Wow. Someone posts their opinion, and backs it up with thought out examples, and you decide to go with an anti-American attack. Classy Rolling Eyes
It's like some posters want to be seen as idiotic haters. Lighten up.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Seoulman69



Joined: 14 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Wow. Someone posts their opinion, and backs it up with thought out examples, and you decide to go with an anti-American attack. Classy


His examples and opinion is ignorant and dismissive of anything outside of the USA. The rest of the world are sick and tired of this kind of attitude. Get over yourself. It's not being a hater to point out when you and your countrymen are embarrassing yourselves, which you are.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kcmo



Joined: 24 Nov 2011

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adventurer wrote:
kcmo wrote:
Hey I've been reading this thread and I need to put in my 2 cents about the USA's world beer standing. They are definitely the best beer country in the world, without a shadow of doubt. Sure, the macro stuff there is awful and the macro stuff in other European countries is comparably better, but.........Germany, Belgium, England and even Ireland tend to limit themselves to certain traditional styles. German brewers stick to only making German styles, Belgian brewers only make Belgian styles, etc... The American breweries make every style and there are hundreds of breweries there that produce many different styles and do an excellent job at all of them. Breweries like Dogfish Head, Sierra Nevada, Alesmith, North Coast, Bells, etc... make literally EVERY style. I guess what I am saying is that the enormously wide variation of beer in the USA is unparalled by any country, which in my opinion makes it the best beer country.


I understand what you're saying, but that's only a minority of the beer consumed in the U.S. So you could say most of the beer in many European countries is definitely better than most of the beer in the U.S.
Yes, you can get great flavors in the U.S., and the many beer masters are very creative, but they have had to because the regular beer is not so good, and we have a more open economic system in the US when compared to a place like Korea. Many of Europeans haven't really felt the need to come up with so many microbreweries because they enjoyed what they had. I don't know if you could say the microbreweries are better than everything in Belgium. It gets hard once you have very excellent beers to really compare them. Comparing two excellent beers is not so simple. You can like two different excellent beers for different reasons without saying one is better than the other. It is safe to say that the US has more variety. I love Sierra Nevada. I've had it before. I like the fact that America has a lot of that said variety, but it's hard to say it has the best beer in the world. It has some of the best beer. It has improved leaps and bounds when compared to even the 1990 or something. You didn't have much of a choice back then in comparison to today.


Hm yeah that is true what you are saying-----the quality of the everyday beers in the European countries are much better than the USA's. I guess I just like having more variety with my beer. Your point is taken. Sometime within the next year or two I will be going on (mostly) a brewery tour throughout Germany and Belgium for a couple weeks, so I definitely love those countries' traditional styles. Something we can agree on though is that Korea's beer isn't very good Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kcmo



Joined: 24 Nov 2011

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seoulman69 wrote:
Quote:
Wow. Someone posts their opinion, and backs it up with thought out examples, and you decide to go with an anti-American attack. Classy


His examples and opinion is ignorant and dismissive of anything outside of the USA. The rest of the world are sick and tired of this kind of attitude. Get over yourself. It's not being a hater to point out when you and your countrymen are embarrassing yourselves, which you are.


Maybe it sounds like I was being dismissive of other countries' beers but that wasn't my intention. I love the European countries' beers too.............I just think the USA is the best beer country.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Seoulman69



Joined: 14 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Maybe it sounds like I was being dismissive of other countries' beers but that wasn't my intention. I love the European countries' beers too.............I just think the USA is the best beer country.


The more you travel the more you will realize that it's not just the US breweries who are doing exciting and new brews. And while it's nice that the US has more breweries, when you consider the massive population it is still incredibly low compared to the amount of breweries in my home country.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kcmo wrote:
Hey I've been reading this thread and I need to put in my 2 cents about the USA's world beer standing. They are definitely the best beer country in the world, without a shadow of doubt. Sure, the macro stuff there is awful and the macro stuff in other European countries is comparably better, but.........Germany, Belgium, England and even Ireland tend to limit themselves to certain traditional styles. German brewers stick to only making German styles, Belgian brewers only make Belgian styles, etc... The American breweries make every style and there are hundreds of breweries there that produce many different styles and do an excellent job at all of them. Breweries like Dogfish Head, Sierra Nevada, Alesmith, North Coast, Bells, etc... make literally EVERY style. I guess what I am saying is that the enormously wide variation of beer in the USA is unparalled by any country, which in my opinion makes it the best beer country.


You are aware that there is a vast variety of beers brewed in the UK, Belgium and Germany, right?

In any case, you make it sound as if everybody drinks good beer in the US. Fact is, as fine as American microbrews can be it remains that microbreweries have a hard time placing their products on the shelves. That's because large breweries have come up with some pretty creative ways to keep their competitors' products off the shelves. For example, they package their beer in a variety of formats. It's no longer just a simple 6-pack, a 12, or a 2-4. A direct consequence of this variety in packaging is that the consumer ends up with a large, overwhelming billboard of the same brewery's products before their eyes while somewhere hidden on a bottom shelf there might be a few relatively timid 6-packs of microbrew. They'll also give a few cases for free to the manager of a store (free money) to sweeten the deal, which microbreweries can't afford to do. That's why 95% of the beer sold in the US is your typical mass-produced Bud, Miller, and Coors. That's what the average American beer drinker drinks.

I strongly suggest you watch this movie:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1326194/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
orosee



Joined: 07 Mar 2008
Location: Hannam-dong, Seoul

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just adding two newly discovered beers that are better than Korean beers (there must also be beers worse than Korean beers, to be fair):

- San Miguel Pale Pilsen

- Myanmar Lager Brew

(both from the bottle, not tap)

Highly recommended even though you may have to be in-country to get them.

Coming next: North Korean beer better than OBCassHiteMax?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dairyairy



Joined: 17 May 2012
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some of you keep saying that cheap beer is what Koreans want. I don't know how many of you understand economics and statistical analysis, but cheaper products always sell in higher volume because more people can afford them. More people drink cheaper beer because that's what they can afford.
That also means that the way to keep people away from those other beers is to tax them so that their prices are too high for most people. That's exactly what the Korean government does and why the Korean consumers are suffering under the current system. The free market isn't being allowed to establish itself.
Also, it's not fair to judge what Koreans drink against what sells in the USA. As for what Americans drink, well that again is decided by a number of factors. On the same street you may find a college bar, a blue collar bar, and a sports bar and all may have different beers depending on what they can sell to their customers. But it goes deeper than just what people can afford. There are regional beers plus different races tend to drink different beers. Do you have that kind of diversity in the Korean beer market? Think about it.

I don't understand why the Korean beer bottlers don't try to develop better beers so that they can capture some of the foreign market. They seem so content to be big fish in a small pond that they are missing out on huge profits overseas. If they could develop winning beers for export then they could make big money. The way they do it in the USA is to let the smaller breweries take all of the risks and once they develop a winning formula the bigger ones buy them out and market the newer beer to the larger markets. That would work in Korea, too, but they have to lighten up on those excessive taxes and give the little guys a chance. The way they're doing it now is such small thinking.


Last edited by dairyairy on Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dairyairy wrote:
Some of you keep saying that cheap beer is what Koreans want. I don't know how many of you understand economics and statistical analysis, but cheaper products always sell in higher volume because more people can afford them. More people drink cheaper beer because that's what they can afford.
That also means that the way to keep people away from those beers is to tax them so that their prices are too high for most people. That's exactly what the Korean government does and why the Korean consumers are suffering under the current system. The free market isn't being allowed to establish itself.
Also, it's not fair to judge what Koreans drink against what sells in the USA. As for what Americans drink, well that again is decided by a number of factors. On the same street you may find a college bar, a blue collar bar, and a sports bar and all may have different beers depending on what they can sell to their customers. But it goes deeper than just what people can afford. There are regional beers plus different races tend to drink different beers. Do you have that kind of diversity in the Korean beer market? Think about it.


You're saying that's what Koreans want? Based on what we've seen, Koreans who would want something else made locally don't have much of a choice, so they're buying a lot of imported beer. So a portion of the population is voting with their lips, I guess. You could say that Americans wanted pretty much Miller, Coors, and Bud in the 1980s because that's what was pretty much available.

Correct me if I'm wrong, we didn't have explosion of microbrews until years later. I doubt the culture just changed to where the population all of a sudden just wanted better beer whereas Europeans are just more discriminating. Some people will generally be apathetic and are not going to riot for more variety when it comes to beer if the beer is not fantastic. I don't know what to make of the statement of different races drink different beers. I wouldn't use the word races. You mean various countries have various varieties. The Germans drink beer that might be different than Belgian beer does it make them a different race? Geography affects things maybe more than race.

This reminds me of someone maybe saying Americans have a two party system maybe because they simply just want that. One cannot ignore economic and political barriers when it comes to competition and changes in industries or political systems.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HapKi



Joined: 10 Dec 2004
Location: TALL BUILDING-SEOUL

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The more you travel the more you will realize that it's not just the US breweries who are doing exciting and new brews. And while it's nice that the US has more breweries, when you consider the massive population it is still incredibly low compared to the amount of breweries in my home country.


What do you mean by this? One needs to travel to Europe to understand fine beer? (I'm American, so It's far away, because I'm over there/here, you know? Like USA/ or even Korea.). I assume you are a Brit...
An American, like me or others who like good beer, by far, knows ALL they need to know***full stop. without hanging out in some Brit or Eruo pub or whatever.
And the population ratio...so what!? (My country has 300 million people)Do I want to defend everyone that drinks Bud/miller/ etc.. in my country. N,o I don't). But I will play Devils Advacate/ defense, because why?
(I'm American.) But, they do...and for them, beer is the beer they want to drink. When you finish mowing the grass/when you want a cold drink after playing one-one in basketball (or any other sport) blah blah..or something else...beer serves a thirst quenching need for drinking (I'm right, or No?)
I for one, think that life is too short to drink bad beer.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Seoulman69



Joined: 14 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hapki - i dont know how to respond to your post because it reads like a rant posted by a loon buoyed by nationalist ignorance. The original poster of the post i replied to has moved on, as have i. I suggest you do the same.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bucheon bum



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: DC area

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seoulman69 wrote:
Hapki - i dont know how to respond to your post because it reads like a rant posted by a loon buoyed by nationalist ignorance. The original poster of the post i replied to has moved on, as have i. I suggest you do the same.


I think his point was the beer selection in America is excellent and you can find pretty much get anything here. Sure, there are tons of fantastic beers in Europe (although Germany is more limited in experimenting due to regulations), but is there that BIG of a difference between the EU and USA beer markets? I mean in what's easily accessible, not what your average joe six pack drinks.

In short: both the EU and the USA have robust, progressive beer producers.

I really can't take sides since I have spent very little time in Europe. All I know is the US beer market is 10x better than it was even from 2000. San Diego alone has over 50 breweries and they are a dime a dozen on the West Coast. The East Coast is a little behind, but even here in DC, there has been a flourish of breweries that have opened in the last 2-3 years. And even if it doesn't measure up to the EU or Europe in general, it certainly is a hell of a lot better than Korea's beer market (and probably most if not all of Asia)!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NQ



Joined: 16 Feb 2012

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The taste of Korean beers is fine, it's just that they give me massive runs later on in the night. I've never had this happen to me from any other beer from any other country. The runs factor makes me reconsider the cheapness factor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Seoulman69



Joined: 14 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I really can't take sides since I have spent very little time in Europe.


I think this is the crux of the disagreement. It seems that the Americans with very little knowledge are making comments that are incorrect.

When someone posts

Quote:
They are definitely the best beer country in the world, without a shadow of doubt.


Quote:
Germany, Belgium, England and even Ireland tend to limit themselves to certain traditional styles


and

Quote:
the enormously wide variation of beer in the USA is unparalled by any country


then one would expect them to be well traveled and versed in the beer market for each country.
The poster is clearly not well traveled or versed in the beer market of these countries or he would never had posted such ignorant comments. To suggest these countries limit themselves to traditional styles is nonsense obvious to anyone who has visited Europe.

You will also find in my posts that at no time have I argued that my home country or any other is the best beer country in the world. I lived in the US for a while and enjoy a lot of the microbrews coming out of America but for you and your countrymen to start beating your chests and bleating about being the "best beer country in the world", despite never having been to many of the countries you dismissed as anachronistic, then to brand anyone who speaks out against such ignorant claims as "haters" is stereotypically American.

If a Korean made a similar claim about Korea being the "best electronics company in the world" this whole board would shake its head in disbelief. Perhaps the Americans on this board making similar claims to those noted earlier would do well to take as critical a look at themselves as they seem to do to others.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Discussion Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2013 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International