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A sad end to my "Returning after a midnight run" s
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stew1988



Joined: 04 Apr 2011

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 1:30 am    Post subject: A sad end to my "Returning after a midnight run" s Reply with quote

Hello guys. If you've read some of my previous posts, you will find out that I have been trying to get back in to South Korea following a previous midnight run...I'll give you a brief overview so you get the idea...

- Ran away from Korea because I was being treated like an animal. (Two choices, stay and give up basic human rights or leave and start afresh). Of course, the restrictive nature of the E2 makes Korea a breeding ground for events like this and I'm sure many of you have done or encountered somebody who has done something similar.
- Being married to a Korean, myself and my wife faced many troubles. We returned to the UK and everything was hopeless. No matter what way we looked at it, she could not find work and needed to finish her education back in Korea in order to ever achieve anything in life.
- I set my sights on getting back in to Korea and teaching again. I have nothing against Korea as a country and the people, well I respect them as much as anybody else in the world. Some advised on getting an F2, but we could not meet the financial requirements.


So, I decided to go back and here's what I did...

1. Got all my documents together. This took up the last of my money essentially so I was putting all my eggs in one basket.
2. I applied through recruiters but eventually decided to find something off my own back. I found an adult position and everything was in place. They liked me, my professional and academic references were immaculate, my police check was clean. The interview went well and soon after the sending off documents process began.
3. I told them that I taught privately in Korea before, but I did not tell them that I worked for a school or was issued an E2. Some people on the forums told me to be transparent with employers and i completely understand why. Unfortunately that is the double edged sword of it all. If I tell them that I had to do a midnight run, regardless of the reasoning, they will throw me out the window and go onto candidate number two. The ones that will look twice at me are the desperate acts that will most likely treat me like an animal once again...it's a nasty catch 22.
4. I contacted immigration in Korea and they told me that I would be able to go back, however I "may encounter difficulties". From what they told me and what I researched, I could return as long as my VISA is cancelled and I did not commit any criminal acts. I didn't and my VISA is indeed cancelled.


Here is the unfortunate and quite frankly devastating outcome for me...

- My school contacted me saying that there has been a hold up in the E2 VISA process.
- Immigration will issue my VISA issuance number, however they also informed my prospective employers about my previous record in South Korea.
- Finding out about this, they contacted me asking me to explain.
- I explained everything and they contacted my previous employer and recruiter. (Of course, these are the same characters that did not pay me my wages, abused me in the work place and threatened me with physical violence upon leaving my job early).
- I imagine they called me every name under the sun and now my school has taken back the offer and cut contact with me.
- My documents will not be returned, I'm here in the UK and my partner is in Korea and I have no money.

I just wanted to let people know because the question often comes up..."can I return to South Korea after a Midnight Run"...there is no one single answer to this. YES you can, however you may be forced into returning to the same ordeal once again because of your history in the country. There is no scope for common sense and you will always be judged on your time in South Korea. This period will always be perceived as the most important factor, irrespective of your professional and academic background.

I hope this may help anybody who is thinking of returning. Of course, if anyone has any questions just let me know and I'll try and give some advice.

Cheers.
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YTMND



Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are leaving out essential information and giving us too much drama. Leave the emotions out and give us the Dragnet facts, just the facts.

Quote:
Ran away from Korea


Knowing when this happened would be useful because you could have switched to a D10 possibly and found another job instead of returning home.

Quote:
Some advised on getting an F2, but we could not meet the financial requirements.


What were those requirements? How can we help you if we don't know? It seems like an strange excuse. You use the F2 to get a job. So, does that mean you have to work illegally first before getting an F2? Or do you have to work on an E2 first and graduate to an F2? Why can't you just go to F2? What did those in power suggest you do? Major gap here, we need more info.

Quote:
If I tell them that I had to do a midnight run


Why do you need to say that at all? How long did you work? If you worked somewhere 3 months or longer, just say you worked there for whatever amount of time. I worked 3 months, moved my stuff into a goshiwon. I was threatened by the hagwon and came back with some verbal agreements, after 4 months I was out of there and in a new job. GEPIK didn't care, I worked there for 1 year. Why would I need to tell them I moved into a goshiwon? I just said I worked there for 3 months (at the time of the interview, and they didn't care because they wanted a teacher).

That's why you need to leave the drama out of it. It will get you nowhere.

Quote:
I could return as long as my VISA is cancelled and I did not commit any criminal acts


Normal procedure. Can you have 2 passports? Same line of thinking. If it wasn't cancelled, look into the D10. You can cancel this stuff on your own, you know this right?

Quote:
they also informed my prospective employers about my previous record in South Korea


Informed them of what? A hagwon went to immigration and cried that a teacher did a midnight run, now immigration is informing a new school? If that is true, this is the first of its kind. Immigration doesn't care, at least up until now.

Quote:
I explained everything and they contacted my previous employer and recruiter.


I am getting the impression this might be more if a recruiter issue than immigration.

Quote:
I'm here in the UK and my partner is in Korea and I have no money.


Amazing story thus far. Now, get a job, you could easily work in China, save up, and then go to Korea if you can't go directly to Korea. Doing everything back in your home country is ridiculous. The only benefit is that you get your documents more easily. After that, you should have packed up your stuff and gone to Korea looking for a school. You should have interviewed in person. The school would then not care about your past and hired you on the spot. By doing all this abroad, you are limiting your chances because the school is going to hire someone that does what I mentioned instead. If you ever come to Beijing you will see how much of a reality this is. In Korea it's about 80%. It's possible to get a job from abroad, but not as easy.

Go hagwon shopping then. Get new documents, save up money, and then GO TO KOREA!!!

The way you played this midnight run was not really smart in my opinion. When I left Korea, I already made plans for the next thing.


Last edited by YTMND on Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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modernseoul



Joined: 11 Sep 2011
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel for you mate as you unlike many others who just run without reason, left because there was no other option. I think that your experience is sadly an example of the darker side of ESL teaching in Korea.

I hope this will show to those who run for no good reason that it will come back to bite you, but sadly for those who run with a good reason it can also cause harm.

My advice in the short term is to get your partner to try and retrieve your visa documents. Then sadly try again.
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YTMND



Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, forget saving up money. Get a credit card, charge it. Come to Korea immediately. Get a job, pay off the credit card. It's a gamble if you are a spender, but after 2 months you will be in the same situation you are now but with a job.

How good is that? Wink
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stew1988



Joined: 04 Apr 2011

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for that reply YTMD, sorry for the dramatic nature of my reply, I'm quite a dramatic person to be honest, in fact I got an A* in Drama at school, maybe that explains it?

1. The dragnet facts...my employer did not pay me money in return for my services...my employer was firing members of staff due to financial difficulties, laying certain members of staff of a few weeks before maternity leave, without severance...my employer used God as justification for her actions and prayed to God in front of me that she would be able to pay me next time...my boss was having individuals spy on my private life...my boss was constantly belittling me and undermining me at every given opportunity...half of my accommodation was broken, including air conditioner, cooker, washing mashing and microwave, none of which was ever addressed or fixed...I could go on, but they are some dragnet facts to get you going...

2. Believe it or not, I did not know about D2 VISA conversions at the time...throw into the equation my recruiter was threatening me with violence upon leaving my role...seeing as I did not know about the conversion, how about I do not dwell on this fact?

3. I do not require your help with anything and if I did I would ask for it...take some time out of your busy schedule and you will discover the nature of the F2 VISA, something that I have researched thoroughly. I am entitled to an F2, yes...the embassy in London is terrible...they inform me that I have to look on the website and they will provide no information over the phone...they say I will need ALL documents listed on the website or it will not be issued...one of those requirements is 10,000 shiny American Dollars sitting in a bank account, how's that for drama?

4.This is my entire point, I DO need to inform them of the midnight run...if I DO NOT inform them of the midnight run, then they may find out and I lose the job...trouble is, if I DO tell them, I will have to settle for the desperate dregs...back to square one...

5. Don't tell me what is and what isn't the first of it's kind. I am telling you the facts of my situation as they are in black and white. My school has reported me as a midnight runner...I have reapplied...Immigration has waved a red flag to my prospective employers and they are no longer offering me the job...such is life...

The way I played the midnight run was not smart and I am the first to admit that. I do intend to get a job and save up now, however I though I would just post on here as advice for people in a similar situation, I'm sure there are many.

I would continue, however I have a drama seminar to attend.

Cheers.
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ED209



Joined: 17 Oct 2006

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Some advised on getting an F2, but we could not meet the financial requirements.


What are the financial requirements? and hasn't the visa changed to an F6. Can't you come over on a tourist visa and apply for your F6?
Call Kimmi again, they don't always know what they're talking about any better than I do.
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stew1988



Joined: 04 Apr 2011

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Korean Embassy in London are nothing short of non responsive and rude...

The website says that I need to provide 10,000 dollars in a bank account, supported by 3 months worth of consecutive statements...they say they will not bend on this, all documents required..

As of March 2011, one cannot apply for an F2 on a tourist VISA, apparently.
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stew1988



Joined: 04 Apr 2011

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In addition, the marriage needs to be registered in Korea.
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radcon



Joined: 23 May 2011

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Come to Korea and apply for your F2 (now called an F6) visa from here. More often than not immigration does not ask for any financial info. They probably did in your case because you were applying from overseas.
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YTMND



Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
one of those requirements is 10,000 shiny American Dollars sitting in a bank account, how's that for drama?


An E2 job will get you 2,000 per month, at least. After 5, give it 6 or 7, you can do it. Earlier if you use the credit card idea. Problem solved. Next...


Quote:
if I DO NOT inform them of the midnight run, then they may find out


If you interview in person, they won't care. If you interview abroad, of course they won't know. I am going to use Beijing again because I have worked in Japan, Korea, and China. Beijing recruiters are the most ridiculous. They want you to come to them for a face to face interview first to make sure you are a native English speaker. Then they arrange an interview with the school. This should drive home the point you haven't addressed yet, going to Korea. Why are you so obsessed with doing all this drama script writing abroad?

If I had to do that, I wouldn't be trying to secure a job ESL teaching. I would be sending letters to Wall Street.

Go to KOREA. For heaven's sakes, your wife is there right? Boggles the mind.

Quote:
Immigration has waved a red flag to my prospective employers


How exactly can you prove this? First of all, immigration is different depending on which area you work in. Let's say you are right and that Seoul immigration has put you on a "no hire" list, what about going to immigration in Gyeonggido or Incheon? If you want to go work in the south, then you have Daegu and Busan. I highly doubt immigration has this magic wand bondage with one hagwon to treat you ALWAYS unfairly. I have never heard of this. If I am mistaken, fine. Again, this would be the first of its kind. I have been in Asia since July 2003, and I have only finished one 1 year contract. I even left a school after 3 weeks because of the cockroaches, sewer smells from the bathroom, and overall terrible management of the school. I sent out resumes the night I left, interviewed the next day in person in a new city, was hired that day and worked the next.

I missed 1 day's pay. To say immigration has control over every facet of your ESL teacher life is unbelievable. I will leave it at that.

As others stated, come to Korea. Your wife, remember.
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am mixed about this. One part of me is rolling my eyes at the hard done by waygook story. Another part of me is shocked and feels bad about the story, and a whole lot confused.

Some details are confusing. As many people are saying is your wife is Korean. Yes to get an F-2 (I am not expert) sometimes you have to show money. But sometimes you do not have too. I would take the peoples advice and come here. Get a E-2 if possible and then work towards you F-series. Yes the Embassy will not be the best to get it processed. But I would do the end around them and go straight to the hikorea site and reading and searching Dave's, Waygook, and AFEK.

Once again how did you get flagged as a runner. I have heard pretty much that immigration does not care. Schools can complain but generally immigration does not care unless the teacher did something bad like left without paying back plane ticket or abusing children. Your school sounds like they never paid you and have no cause to say you owe them.

More later have to go. Good Luck
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schwa



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: sokcho

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YTMND wrote:
I have been in Asia since July 2003, and I have only finished one 1 year contract.

Please do share the secret of your success.
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soyoungmikey



Joined: 29 Jun 2009

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 10,000 dollar rule is NOT truly a rule. I got my F-2 visa with a 1/4 of that. Immigration rules are meant to be bent here. Also, renewed my F-2, now an F-6, two years ago and got one year, and last year got only another year, and this year we lied and said she was pregnant and got 2 years. You should of just stayed in the country and you could of solved everything. Do your research next time. And if you leave the country have an exit plan instead of doing it by the seat of your pants as it looked like you did. I have sympathy but it looks like you shot yourself in the foot.
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stew1988



Joined: 04 Apr 2011

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the comments, I do appreciate it!

So, you guys reckon I would have more chance by coming to Korea as a tourist and scoping out a job and potentially getting an E2 by exiting vis Japan and applying for the VISA there? Would this give more a better chance than the old, application from the UK route? Of course my eventual aim was to pursue an F2...potentially finish a year E2 and then with the funds and status, apply for the F2 then.

Cheers.
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meangradin



Joined: 10 Mar 2006

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i get that you have no money, but your wife has family here, right? stay with them for a few months if you have nowhere to go? seriously, just get here and hit the bricks. don't worry about the "requirements", just apply and see what happens and go from there. Again, get on the plane, then once in korea, work your ass off. in no time you'll get ahead. irregardless of any type of visa, this is a place where those who are willing to work hard can get ahead. as a bonus, once you do get you f-6, then will never be tied to a job as you own your own visa, so if someone mistreats you, then you can just walk away.

i just read your last post and need to hit you over the head with the facts. you are entitled to apply for your f visa, so come to korea as a tourist, then apply immediately for your f visa. once you get it, which you will, then you wont have to worry about doing a "visa run." you may have to work under the table for a bit, but as you are in the process of applying it is a bit of a grey area. as you plan on staying in korea for a while, i doubt someone will try to screw with you. a way to cut down on the chances of someone cheating you is to ask to be paid weekly/daily. if you are in korea and have a place to say, then schools will be happy to hire you, trust me on this one, so make sure you ask for a decent wage.
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