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dokdashima
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le-paul



Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:19 am    Post subject: dokdashima Reply with quote

how do you deal with 'the island' when it comes into discussion in the classroom? my personal feelings are that i dont care at all and would treat it much the same way i would religion. but as im teaching, i try not to let my personal feelings get in the way too much if i can help it.
however, ignoring the issue doesnt seem to work (ive tried pleading ignorance but that just fuels it more) either.
any advice would be much appreciated. anything tried and tested? thanks
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YTMND



Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Religion is a personal choice, whereas land is a national "asset" like oil or economical influence.

It is also similar to rooting for a sports team. If you go to a game and don't root for either party, of course it is going to make you stand out.

You are best to root for the Korean side while in Korea and the Japanese side when you are in Japan if you don't care either way.

If you get a smarty pants, teenager or older who challenges you, you can say something like, "Ok, if we call it Dokdo, will it help remove the division between North and South Korea?"

Japan is not divided, but Korea is. So, you can throw that wrench if they get on your nerves. If they are simply wanting you to root for the Dokdo team, then just do that. Japan is not going to come invade your apartment Razz

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0d-O5PjTbU
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Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's see.

Ignoring - Somebody comments, continue on with topic.

Apathy - "Ok, Dokdo is Korea, Whatever....." Nothing can short circuit a conversation of the general I don't not care

The Brush off - "Ahh Dokdo! Yep, I know. They are Korea territory. Now please turn to page ...."

And? Why? - "Teacher do you know about Dokdo? "No?" Chattering away....When they pause for your reaction. Reply with non committal answers and for more information. They will eventually run out of steam.

The Lesson- Oh yes, I have heard about Dokdo. I have a lesson on that! "Children le's repeat the world "Island" What is strange about it the spelling of Island. No "JinYoung "Japan Bad" is not proper English." Repeat after me "The Japanese are evil and despicable people!"
Eventually after a couple run through of the lesson within lesson, the kids will get the point of dropping it.

Light the Fuse - See if you can start a revolution. Really the Japanese are claiming the Island as their own. The bastards. Something should be done. Build it up. Get those emotions going. WARNING: THIS CAN SO BACK FIRE


The two things overall you should not do. First is try to speak about it rationally or logically. They are kids and the topic is emotional, you will not change their minds.
Second, if your opinion is anything but "Dokdo is Korea" do not say it.
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nautilus



Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't disrespect them, but do try to give them perspective.

Mention to them that many countries in the world have similar territorial disputes over islands. Japan and the Kurils, for example.

Or bring up the current disputes such as the thousands dying in Syria or whatever.

Anything you can do to make them realise that Korea is only one of a large community of nations, and that their problems are very minor compared to many others.
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Otherside



Joined: 06 Sep 2007

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nautilus wrote:
Don't disrespect them, but do try to give them perspective.

Mention to them that many countries in the world have similar territorial disputes over islands. Japan and the Kurils, for example.

Or bring up the current disputes such as the thousands dying in Syria or whatever.

Anything you can do to make them realise that Korea is only one of a large community of nations, and that their problems are very minor compared to many others.


I think it depends on the level of the class. What you mention could definitely work (if handled well) with a class of upper-intermediate adults. Having that conversation with a grade 5 elementary school class, half of which can't spell their own names, might be less successful.
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ewlandon



Joined: 30 Jan 2011
Location: teacher

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Show them a map of the United states that shows the land desputes of natives and the first european settlers. Then show another map that shows the land that is now for natives.

Then explain how outsiders are really bad and will take over the entire country if you allow them to take even a small piece just like that...


Down with Japan!
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le-paul



Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the replies, its given me something to think about. i think ill have a lesson plan made up just in cAse this comes out in class again (re pointing out the insignificance of what theyre getting upset about/regurgitating).
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nora



Joined: 14 Apr 2012

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

le-paul wrote:
thanks for the replies, its given me something to think about. i think ill have a lesson plan made up just in cAse this comes out in class again (re pointing out the insignificance of what theyre getting upset about/regurgitating).


I wouldn't.

As stated before, this is an emotional issue. Groupthink sets in during a class. You will not succeed in changing minds or getting the students to look at this in any rational way

Remember, you're an English teacher, not a culture/history/political science teacher. What language focus would you be using when talking about Dokdo?

My personal experience - I had a student call me "culturally insensitive" on my review. Turns out, it was about Dokdo! He had asked me my opinion on it and I said that, while I thought it was definitely Korean and that Korea physically possessed it with Marines, the constant bickering with Japan was counterproductive - it is Korean, let Japan be a baby about it. Mind you, this conversation was AFTER class, between him and me. He agreed with my point of view and that was that. Until the review.

I am all for teaching students about the world. Bringing in social issues that they don't know about is great. But this is one issue that they already have an opinion on, you will not change it, you will not convince them to relax on it, you will not do anything except make them love you with an absolute acceptance of THEIR position, or hate you with ANY deviation from it.

I just cannot see a positive outcome to this.
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kinship



Joined: 24 Jan 2013

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:55 pm    Post subject: Re: dokdashima Reply with quote

le-paul wrote:
how do you deal with 'the island' when it comes into discussion in the classroom? my personal feelings are that i dont care at all and would treat it much the same way i would religion. but as im teaching, i try not to let my personal feelings get in the way too much if i can help it.
however, ignoring the issue doesnt seem to work (ive tried pleading ignorance but that just fuels it more) either.
any advice would be much appreciated. anything tried and tested? thanks


All you have to say is, it belongs to Korea and that will keep your students happy. If you want to investigate it further and see the evidence then do so. There is a nice book out called, Historical Evidence of Korean Sovereignty Over Dokdo which provides evidence via maps from Japan, Korea, and some other countries that Korea has owned the two islets for millenia.
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Allthechildrenareinsane



Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Location: Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scenario #1:

Student: Teacher, who you think Dokdo belong?
Me: (wry smile) The Chinese, of course. China number one!
Student: NO, TEACHER!!! Korea number one! 아, 진짜. . .
Me: Now, who can tell me the answer to number four?


Scenario #2:

Student: Teacher, do you know Dokdo?
Me: (deadpan) Sure, he's my best friend.
Student: Oh, teacher! You. . .
Me: Turn to page thirty-two, everybody. . . .


Scenario #3:

Student: Teacher, who do you think Dokdo is belong to?
Me: (wry smile) The Dokdo-ites. Dokdo should be free, I say. FREE DOKDO!
Student: 아, 진짜! No, teacher, really. . .
Me: Turn to page forty-two, everybody. . . .
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le-paul



Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nora wrote:


I just cannot see a positive outcome to this.


pretty much my feeling.
i was accused by my school last year for being a racist because i taught 3 boys about the craftsmanship of the samurai sword. it seems its better to say nothing than try to point out a neutral or world perspective on things.
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happiness



Joined: 04 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I berate them for saying anyone is bad, not mentioning Japan or anything else. Then I ask if they are a good person, and then I ask the other kids if hes a good person, and they always say "noooooo."

Always works.

Kids dont care about Dokdo, its a power thing. So then I take the power(focus) away from them. Back to the book.
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kinship



Joined: 24 Jan 2013

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

le-paul wrote:
nora wrote:


I just cannot see a positive outcome to this.


pretty much my feeling.
i was accused by my school last year for being a racist because i taught 3 boys about the craftsmanship of the samurai sword. it seems its better to say nothing than try to point out a neutral or world perspective on things.


That is like going to America to teach and telling the American students that Canadian craftsmanship is far superior to their own. You do realize that many Koreans hate the Japanese don't you and teaching them that would be an insult to them?
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T-J



Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yonshinnae

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kinship wrote:
le-paul wrote:
nora wrote:


I just cannot see a positive outcome to this.


pretty much my feeling.
i was accused by my school last year for being a racist because i taught 3 boys about the craftsmanship of the samurai sword. it seems its better to say nothing than try to point out a neutral or world perspective on things.


That is like going to America to teach and telling the American students that Canadian craftsmanship is far superior to their own. You do realize that many Koreans hate the Japanese don't you and teaching them that would be an insult to them?



You have some reading comprehension issues.

How do you equate "teaching about craftsmanship" with "A being far superior to B"?

Seriously. Are you naturally dishonest or are you just daft? Either way you probably should not be teaching.

Speaking of dishonest, you have an interesting posting history. You post continuously. Either you are unemployed or you post from work. If it's the latter, you understand you're stealing don't you?
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comm



Joined: 22 Jun 2010

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kinship wrote:
That is like going to America to teach and telling the American students that Canadian craftsmanship is far superior to their own. You do realize that many Koreans hate the Japanese don't you and teaching them that would be an insult to them?

Amazing.
"You should know that Koreans are spiteful and petty, and that teaching them that another country does ONE THING better than Korea is irresponsible. We should all just accept that Koreans are racists with inferiority complexes, and never teach them the fact that other countries do some things better than they do."

I think you'd be pretty hard pressed to find an American student who "hates Canada" and would be insulted by the idea that Canada makes better maple syrup than the U.S. On a related note, no one in the U.S. gets their panties bunched over the fact that the "Gulf of Mexico" is not the "Gulf of America".
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