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2013 seminar for foreign language institute instructors
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ytide



Joined: 26 Jul 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Politely ask for overtime compensation for this non-mandatory event. I heard it will be four hours, plus transportation time each way (to/from Anyang) may mean, for some people, a time commitment of six hours next Saturday morning.

Example Dialogue:
You: "I will go, but as per my contract, I'd like six hours of pay at the overtime-rate of 30,000/hour. You owe me 180,000 Won."
Boss: "......"

It's worth a shot.
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axelf



Joined: 18 Jun 2013

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, flat out refuse to go. Tell your boss that you know it's not a real government event, and that you know the hagwon association is lying to you and all of the foreign hagwon teachers of Gyeonggi-do.

Tell your boss that you will not help the hagwon association establish itself as an entity that has any de facto power over you.

If he/she keeps pressuring you, tell your boss that you're disappointed to see what kind of filthy, dishonest organization he/she belongs to, and that you will contact the labor board if he/she tries to use non-attendance as an excuse to fire you or fine you. (Can't you totally imagine a bunch of bosses saying: "Oh, you didn't attend, so I have to deduct 800,000 won from your next paycheck for the government fine.")

You have no interest in hearing the unreliable, agenda-tainted information they'll say at the meeting, and in my opinion, it is your ethical duty to refuse to attend.

ytide wrote:
Politely ask for overtime compensation for this non-mandatory event

[...]

It's worth a shot.

No, don't timidly "give that a shot." Bluntly refuse to support the hagwon association's sleazy step towards oppressing you, your colleagues, and the foreign teachers of Gyeonggi-do.
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TDC troll



Joined: 03 Feb 2009
Location: TDC

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After searching around the GOE websites , I have found this meeting
posted on a government board .

If you check the GOE Anyang site ; also the GOE Suwon site , there is a posting of the notice .


Go to : www.goeay.kr

next : 교육 행정 서비스

next : 평생 교육 건강과

next : 2013년도 외국인강사 연수 알림
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hogwonguy1979



Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: the racoon den

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TDC troll wrote:
After searching around the GOE websites , I have found this meeting
posted on a government board .

If you check the GOE Anyang site ; also the GOE Suwon site , there is a posting of the notice .


Go to : www.goeay.kr

next : 교육 행정 서비스

next : 평생 교육 건강과

next : 2013년도 외국인강사 연수 알림


uh mr hogwon apoligist I just ran that through google translate and here is what jumped out at me

Quote:
standard other questions 031-232-4334 (Gyeonggi-do Federation of School), 031-444-6780 (Anyang School Association), 02-503-5083 (Gwacheon School Association), call thank you


all those numbers are for local local hogwon associations not the provincial board of education etc. Nothing related to the MOE or POE.

also why don't univ teachers in the area on E2s have to go to it or even get a notice? Yeah I have my own workshop to go to on Friday but thats my department pulling that crap and its only a recent thing related to my school curric.

folks tell your bosses to stick it
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tob55



Joined: 29 Apr 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

www.goeay.kr is not a government website. It is a regular Korean business website which is called the Gyeonggi-do AnyangGwacheon Office of Education. I am not an E2 resident, but I do understand the discussion going in this particular thread, and this is some association's way of showing they want to present themselves as a formal government website. However, the only way to receive a .go.kr website is to actually be a government entity, which should be a clue that this is nothing more than an organizational website pawning itself off as something they are not. Their links are to official .go.kr websites, which makes it seem more plausible that they are Government run and controlled, but that simply isn't the case. I am guessing that the title is the hook for people. However I did a quick search and there is no DOE or MOE office conntected to the anyang.go.kr website as well as the gwacheon website. Neither location indicates they have an official government DOE office in their regions.

So, if someone is claiming "official" by the website, it is not an official government entity.
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Gnawbert



Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Location: The Internet

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it is a scam, which I absolutely believe it to be, someone should contact the news. I'm not sure it'd be front page material, but getting together several hundred foreigners and making them pay 10,000w in a shakedown might make for a good news story.

At the very least, it'd shine more light on the event.
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TDC troll



Joined: 03 Feb 2009
Location: TDC

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you search on NAVER , for the Gyeonggido Office of Education ,
you'll find that their website is :


www.goe.go.kr

next : 교육청 소개

next : (drop-down menu )
지역교육지원청

next : (map of Gyeonggi Do )


next : click on 안양


next : it will take you to that site ( www.goeay.kr )


Now is that not OFFICIAL for you ?


Now, the entry on that site is posted by the Hagwon Association of Gyeonggi Do .


But the actual site itself is the OFFICIAL site .

If you want just call . There's a few phone numbers .
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No. It is NOT official enough.

The agency in question does NOT have the authority to command anyone to this "workshop".
They are NOT a judicial body.
They are NOT a government agency.
They do NOT have the authority of law to do so.

They cannot terminate your employment, affect your status of sojourn or levy a legally authorized fine for not attending.

You do NOT have to go on your own free time.
You cannot be compelled to attend at your own expense or on your own time.

There are NO LEGAL consequences for not attending.

You cannot be fined or deported for failure to attend.
Your registration at the MOE will NOT be affected.

It is NOT endorsed by the Gyeonggi Provincial Office of Education, by the Ministry of Education, by Immigration or the Ministry of Justice (and they are the ONLY bodes who do have the authority of law in this matter).

Go if you want but you do so of your own volition and expense.

.
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wooden nickels



Joined: 23 May 2010

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:
No. It is NOT official enough.

The agency in question does NOT have the authority to command anyone to this "workshop". They are NOT a judicial body.
They do NOT have the authority of law to do so.

They cannot terminate your employment, affect your status of sojourn or levy a legally authorized fine for not attending.

You do NOT have to go on your own free time.
You cannot be compelled to attend at your own expense or on your own time.

There are NO LEGAL consequences for not attending.

You cannot be fined or deported for failure to attend.
Your registration at the MOE will NOT be affected.

It is NOT endorsed by the Gyeonggi Provincial Office of Education, by the Ministry of Education, by Immigration or the Ministry of Justice (and they are the ONLY bodes who do have the authority of law in this matter).

Go if you want but you do so of your own volition and expense.

.


This information is correct^ I know because my wife and I were at the Education Office, this morning, tending to some business. While there, we asked about this issue.

The Hakwon Association is trying to pass this as some legal matter. It's not! Nor does it have the legal authority to do so!

Don't attend! Carry on as usual.

Being a past member of the Hakwon Association, attending 1 meeting, then dropping it like a dirty diaper, I can assure you that there is no need in pi~~ing away your 10.000 won or time on this event.
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maximmm



Joined: 01 Feb 2008

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gnawbert wrote:
If it is a scam, which I absolutely believe it to be, someone should contact the news. I'm not sure it'd be front page material, but getting together several hundred foreigners and making them pay 10,000w in a shakedown might make for a good news story.

At the very least, it'd shine more light on the event.


I highly doubt that Korean media will cover this - after all, this scam targets foreigners and only foreigners (yep, I'm saying that Korean media is biased - very biased). Besides, they will do a seminar - a service of a sort - so even the 10K Won fee will appear reasonable in hindsight. The only portion of this scam which is really dodgy is the inclusion of the word 'mandatory'.

It is possible that after this event, it will be declared that there was a translation error in the letter - and that the Korean version of this letter did not include the word 'mandatory'.

By the way, I looked at the letter - it says 'Participation Free: 10,000 Won'. Note that they wrote Free instead of Fee -
It also says 'All foreign language instructors who arrived in Gyeonggi , Korea based April 30, 2013'. So.... is this for all language instructors who arrived on, before or after April 30??

It all seems very dodgy - but alas, what do I care? I have just discovered that I have an uncle in Nigeria who has recently passed away and he left me a fortune in the amount of 50 million dollars - I already sent my bank account info and credit card number, so once I get my money, I'm leaving Korea for good! ^^
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TDC troll



Joined: 03 Feb 2009
Location: TDC

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry , I wasn't referring to the (official ) legality of the seminar itself .
I was referring to that website .

The only teachers who are supposed to go there are the ones who work for an institute where the owner is a member of this association .
It has nothing to do with legalility.

In my case , I was given the notice , and asked to go.
Since my boss has been nothing but helpful towards me , I don't feel
that it's that big of a deal .

I'm sure some people will refuse to go , this will probably create animosity and mistrust in their workplace .

In the notice it states that any institute ( which is a member of this association ) whose foreign teacher doesn't attend , can no longer be a member of this association.

In the end I feel like it's doing these little things that pays off in the end (or should I say at the end of the month). $$$

Just think about it like this , the next time you're sick or need some time off
or help with anything that involves your boss , and you did attend this seminar don't you think that they'll be more flexible towards you .

That's all, I'm done .
Do whatever you want .
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And the coercive nature of the "letter" is also a violation of article 7 of the labor standards act (requiring the action of an employee by utterance of an implied threat or coercion) under the supposed auspices of some "official body" that mandates attendance.

Lies, threats and fraud. And people wonder why the hagwon associations have such a bad name. Organized crime by any other name....

.
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tob55



Joined: 29 Apr 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Been here for almost 10 years now, went through the E2 - F2 - F5 all the way to citizenship as a Korean national, and I never once had a hagwon or other "academy" coerce me into going to a non-government sanctioned event like the one which has been discussed in this thread. It really doesn't matter that an OFFICIAL website would post advertisements like the ones mentioned by the OP. I can understand it, becuase the MOE along with the provincial and regional Offices of Education do it as a service to the Hagwon Associations in their areas.

No one was trying to say the meetings aren't sanctioned, but they are not officially sanctioned by some Governmental agency, and as ttompatz said:

Quote:
The agency in question does NOT have the authority to command anyone to this "workshop".
They are NOT a judicial body.
They are NOT a government agency.
They do NOT have the authority of law to do so.


No argument from me, and as the OP said, go if you want, but the bottom line is that whatever the organization is, they are attempting to promote their self as a "Government Agency," which is not the case. I will also add that whomever they are, they have masked their .kr and IP address so that searches cannot be made with regard to the ownership of the domain and website. It took just a few minutes to discover this information. It is for sure that they are not maintained by any government agency hosting educational websites in Korea. Private ownership by some organization is the best call based on what I found, and again that doesn't mean they cannot have advertisements posted on Official government sponsored websites. I am not trying to add fuel to this fire, but just making simple queries to find out who and/or what the organization sponsoring the website mentioned really is.


Last edited by tob55 on Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:59 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Lucas



Joined: 11 Sep 2012

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm sure some ESL'er will go and make it worth their while (cramming 100s of coffee mixes in their pockets).

Don't forget the free bottled water and biscuits too! Very Happy

Stock up!
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RangerMcGreggor



Joined: 12 Jan 2011
Location: Somewhere in Korea

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TDC troll wrote:


I'm sure some people will refuse to go , this will probably create animosity and mistrust in their workplace .


If you're boss is going to hold animosity for you refusing to attend a misleading meeting, then you should refuse to go to prove that you won't take such BS.
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