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Is Amy Chua trolling now?

 
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stilicho25



Joined: 05 Apr 2010

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 1:17 am    Post subject: Is Amy Chua trolling now? Reply with quote

I thought this was pretty interesting. I would not have expected cuban americans or mormons to make the list. I guess old school wasps don't make the cut though. You guys reckon she believes it, or is Chua saying more controversial things to continue raking in cash? I notice she credits cultural factors rather than genetic. I figure that is her nod to PC standards.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/entertainment/controversial-tiger-mom-back-with-list-of-superior-culture-groups-1.1619432
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ghostrider



Joined: 27 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"It may be taboo to say, but some groups in America do better than others. Mormons have recently risen to astonishing business success. Cubans in Miami climbed from poverty to prosperity in a generation. Nigerians earn doctorates at stunningly high rates. Indian and Chinese Americans have much higher incomes than other Americans; Jews may have the highest of all."
http://www.amazon.com/The-Triple-Package-Groups-America/dp/1611762464

According to her, the three traits that make these groups successful are:

1) having a superiority complex
2) being insecure enough to always be striving for more
3) impulse control (self discipline)

It sounds like an interesting read. She could probably add Koreans to the list. I think they have all those traits and have gone from being the poorest nation on the Earth (1950s) to the one of the richest.
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Kuros



Joined: 27 Apr 2004

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had suspected from her previous work that she knew little about China, but her thesis in this one proves it.
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Titus



Joined: 19 May 2012

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 6:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Cubans in Miami climbed from poverty to prosperity in a generation


White Cubans. The ones that live in Pinecrest, Coral Gables and South Miami. Dark Cubans, of whatever mix, who live in Little Havana are poor. The middle working class (who are usually slightly mixed) live in Hialeah and are decent plumbers, mechanics etc. I'm not normally one for nuance, but Chua is obnoxious. If you go to Miami and end up at fancy restaurants in Brickell and Coral Gables you'll walk away thinking that all Cubans have blue eyes and BMW's. If you live there and have to get your car fixed you'll end up with a slightly more informed position.

...

Basically, her thesis is that some groups become market dominant minorities. I will read her book, but I'm not expecting a strong discussion of ethnic networking/nepotism and how some groups take advantage of white individualism/universalism better than others.
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:13 am    Post subject: Re: Is Amy Chua trolling now? Reply with quote

stilicho25 wrote:
I thought this was pretty interesting. I would not have expected cuban americans or mormons to make the list.


Curiousity question: Why would you not expect Cuban-Americans or Mormons to be on that list? She has her reasons for including them, so no doubt you have your reasons for not expecting them to be on the list. Care to elucidate?
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ghostrider



Joined: 27 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chua is already being called a racist and attacked for promoting model minority nonsense even before the book has been released. Her message is not something a lot of people want to hear. When you praise the culture and accomplishments of certain minority groups then you're implying there is something wrong with other minorities.
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stilicho25



Joined: 05 Apr 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Living in Boston I did not meet many mormons and so did not perceive them as superior, although I admire the way they handled the US army in their showdown after settling in Salt Lake. The exception to that was Mitt of course, but he was governor after I left.

As for cubans, besides the voting block they established in Florida, my impression was based on the boat people in the 80s and Dexter.

I was most just curious as to what Chua was getting at. She cites psychological reasons in her summary of her book, but I was curious if it was a stealth genetic thing. Anyhoo, I will pick it up from the library when I can. Her first book about the Chinese in the Philippines was decent.
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yodanole



Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: La Florida

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many of the original Cubans in Miami started their trip to success on 3rd base, with the proceeds of looting and pillaging under the Batista regime. The Marielitos got a reasonable deal, what with being freed from prison for felonies not related to any Anti-Communist sentiments. All Cubans have experienced a warm welcome at the hands of immigration. Of course, some of them did have to take a 90 mile boatride.
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ghostrider



Joined: 27 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did read the book. It is very well referenced. The end notes are longer than the book itself. Some of the main points I remember:

Cuban Americans have been much more successful that the rest of the Hispanic population. Most successful Cuban Americans are white and were highly educated in their homeland. They fled Cuba before 1980 to escape communism. Cubans that have immigrated to America since 1980 haven’t been as successful. Cubans Americans don’t like to be called Hispanic. They like to distance themselves from other Hispanics who they look down on.

Indian Americans have been the most successful Asian American group. They’ve done extremely well in Silicon Valley. Chinese Americans are closely behind. Asians Americans spend a lot of money on private tutoring for their children.

Iranian Americans have done very well in America. Iranians are very proud of their history. They feel very insulted when they are called Arabs. They think they are better than Arabs.

Most black students at Ivy League universities are immigrants or the children of immigrants. Obama’s father was from Kenya. Colin Powell’s parents were from Jamaica. Nigerian Americans have been the most successful out of all the African immigrant groups.

Mormons have done very well in politics and business. Their church is the richest church per capita in America by far and owns more land than the state of Delaware. Mormons are very well disciplined: no drinking, no smoking, and no sex outside of marriage.

Jewish Americans have earned a disproportionate number of Nobel Prizes. They make up only about 2% of the US population but have been awarded about one third of the Nobel Prizes that America has received. They’ve done well in numerous fields but not in golf.

Upward mobility is a reality in America but not all groups take advantage of it.
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Leon



Joined: 31 May 2010

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 4:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ghostrider wrote:
I did read the book. It is very well referenced. The end notes are longer than the book itself. Some of the main points I remember:

Cuban Americans have been much more successful that the rest of the Hispanic population. Most successful Cuban Americans are white and were highly educated in their homeland. They fled Cuba before 1980 to escape communism. Cubans that have immigrated to America since 1980 haven’t been as successful. Cubans Americans don’t like to be called Hispanic. They like to distance themselves from other Hispanics who they look down on.

Indian Americans have been the most successful Asian American group. They’ve done extremely well in Silicon Valley. Chinese Americans are closely behind. Asians Americans spend a lot of money on private tutoring for their children.

Iranian Americans have done very well in America. Iranians are very proud of their history. They feel very insulted when they are called Arabs. They think they are better than Arabs.

Most black students at Ivy League universities are immigrants or the children of immigrants. Obama’s father was from Kenya. Colin Powell’s parents were from Jamaica. Nigerian Americans have been the most successful out of all the African immigrant groups.

Mormons have done very well in politics and business. Their church is the richest church per capita in America by far and owns more land than the state of Delaware. Mormons are very well disciplined: no drinking, no smoking, and no sex outside of marriage.

Jewish Americans have earned a disproportionate number of Nobel Prizes. They make up only about 2% of the US population but have been awarded about one third of the Nobel Prizes that America has received. They’ve done well in numerous fields but not in golf.

Upward mobility is a reality in America but not all groups take advantage of it.


So basically, rich immigrant groups that already tend to be educated do well?
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Kuros



Joined: 27 Apr 2004

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leon wrote:
ghostrider wrote:
I did read the book. It is very well referenced. The end notes are longer than the book itself. Some of the main points I remember:

Cuban Americans have been much more successful that the rest of the Hispanic population. Most successful Cuban Americans are white and were highly educated in their homeland. They fled Cuba before 1980 to escape communism. Cubans that have immigrated to America since 1980 haven’t been as successful. Cubans Americans don’t like to be called Hispanic. They like to distance themselves from other Hispanics who they look down on.

Indian Americans have been the most successful Asian American group. They’ve done extremely well in Silicon Valley. Chinese Americans are closely behind. Asians Americans spend a lot of money on private tutoring for their children.

Iranian Americans have done very well in America. Iranians are very proud of their history. They feel very insulted when they are called Arabs. They think they are better than Arabs.

Most black students at Ivy League universities are immigrants or the children of immigrants. Obama’s father was from Kenya. Colin Powell’s parents were from Jamaica. Nigerian Americans have been the most successful out of all the African immigrant groups.

Mormons have done very well in politics and business. Their church is the richest church per capita in America by far and owns more land than the state of Delaware. Mormons are very well disciplined: no drinking, no smoking, and no sex outside of marriage.

Jewish Americans have earned a disproportionate number of Nobel Prizes. They make up only about 2% of the US population but have been awarded about one third of the Nobel Prizes that America has received. They’ve done well in numerous fields but not in golf.

Upward mobility is a reality in America but not all groups take advantage of it.


So basically, rich immigrant groups that already tend to be educated do well?


I agree with Leon. He is describing parallel mobility not upward mobility. The poor and uneducated from India and China never make it here. These people are invisible to Amy Chua.
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