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Man accidently carries weapon into US Protectorate
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Kuros



Joined: 27 Apr 2004

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 4:58 am    Post subject: Re: Man accidently carries weapon into US Protectorate Reply with quote

young_clinton wrote:
Kuros wrote:
young_clinton wrote:
ttompatz wrote:


They indeed need to put a fence around America.

.


He tried to get the border guards to let him turn around and go back. In your mind that doesn't change things around as far as his intending to break the law? With your apparent rapid dislike of Americans' I guess not.


Well, maybe he dislikes Americans. But this accusation is rich because you labeled Canada a 'US Protectorate.'

You're an ugly American, and your behavior is shameful to others in your country.


You're a disgrace to anything that can walk and remotely reason. What about all the stinking Canadians, Brits etc coming online and spewing their anti American filth. Their mindless and a disgrace just like you, to humanity.

Who the **** in their right mind would give a damn about their country being called a protectorate. That is how ridiculous you are.


What about all those spewing anti-American filth, Kuros, also, you are too sensitive to insults!

I am not going to feed you anymore.
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rollo



Joined: 10 May 2006
Location: China

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stupidity. is stupidity. Perhaps this guy is too stupid to be left to roam around unattended. Then Canada is doing us a favor locking him up,

Shame!, Shame! for calling Canada a U.S. protectorate! It is and will always be a British colony!!! The U.S only notices it when they have to tell its politicians what Canada's correct policies should be. .
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Smithington



Joined: 14 Dec 2011

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is the height of arrogance to cross the border into another country without considering its position on such (minor) things as guns. He wasn't carrying a box of chocolates. He was carrying a loaded weapon, one which inflicts untold suffering on the American populace every day of the week. Not a few Canadians have also been killed by guns smuggled in from the US. It is only the most arrogant type of American who thinks that America is the world, and American laws can be taken with them across the border. The world doesn't work that way. The Canadian border guards have a responsibility to enforce Canadian laws at the border, and to punish and deter those who break them. Same applies with regard to American border guards and Canadians coming South. Border guards are not decoration. They are there for a reason. In this case they were only doing their job, as will the judge who sentences this character to jail time.

The sooner America gets rid of its gun culture the better. Until that time, let's not be so arrogant as to think that other countries attitudes towards guns can just be shrugged off. Their country; their rules. You don't like it, don't visit that country. If you visit that country (even 'by accident') with a loaded weapon, and deny having it in your possession, you're a criminal. If you simply forgot where you put your gun, you're a fool. At the very least, legal matters aside, the man is guilty of irresponsible 'storage' of a weapon. "Honey, did you see my gun?" "No honeycakes, did you check the laundry basket? Maybe one of the kids is playing with it...Did you leave it in the car?"

Honestly, what kind of fool doesn't recall where he put his friggin' gun? And he's supposedly ex-military. You show that kind of disregard for the whereabouts of your firearm in the military and you got some serious 'splainin to do.

I'm glad this story is getting wide-spread coverage. Hopefully it'll remind some people that, in all the countries that constitute Western civilization, only the US has such a complacent attitude towards guns. Canadian rules are the norm; American rules emphatically are not.

So yeah, as the wiseguy who started this thread noted, the driver "wasn't in Kansas anymore." Brilliant observation there, Sherlock.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smithington wrote:
It is the height of arrogance to cross the border into another country without considering its position on such (minor) things as guns. He wasn't carrying a box of chocolates. He was carrying a loaded weapon, one which inflicts untold suffering on the American populace every day of the week. Not a few Canadians have also been killed by guns smuggled in from the US. It is only the most arrogant type of American who thinks that America is the world, and American laws can be taken with them across the border. The world doesn't work that way. The Canadian border guards have a responsibility to enforce Canadian laws at the border, and to punish and deter those who break them. Same applies with regard to American border guards and Canadians coming South. Border guards are not decoration. They are there for a reason. In this case they were only doing their job, as will the judge who sentences this character to jail time.

The sooner America gets rid of its gun culture the better. Until that time, let's not be so arrogant as to think that other countries attitudes towards guns can just be shrugged off. Their country; their rules. You don't like it, don't visit that country. If you visit that country (even 'by accident') with a loaded weapon, and deny having it in your possession, you're a criminal. If you simply forgot where you put your gun, you're a fool. At the very least, legal matters aside, the man is guilty of irresponsible 'storage' of a weapon. "Honey, did you see my gun?" "No honeycakes, did you check the laundry basket? Maybe one of the kids is playing with it...Did you leave it in the car?"

Honestly, what kind of fool doesn't recall where he put his friggin' gun? And he's supposedly ex-military. You show that kind of disregard for the whereabouts of your firearm in the military and you got some serious 'splainin to do.

I'm glad this story is getting wide-spread coverage. Hopefully it'll remind some people that, in all the countries that constitute Western civilization, only the US has such a complacent attitude towards guns. Canadian rules are the norm; American rules emphatically are not.

So yeah, as the wiseguy who started this thread noted, the driver "wasn't in Kansas anymore." Brilliant observation there, Sherlock.


I see your point, but I really don't think the Canadian people have anything to gain by incarcerating this fellow at taxpayer expense. He was foolish, and probably even arrogant, but he didn't hurt anyone and didn't intend to hurt anyone. Using the trial to make a point and then letting him go would be more than enough. Society in general needs to move away from mass-incarceration ideology.
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Smithington



Joined: 14 Dec 2011

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's likely what will happen. He's unlikely to do three years' jail time. They'll probably incarcerate him for a month, fine him, and place his name on a 'mandatory vehicle search list' should he even wish to visit Canada again.

But we shouldn't take his explanation as gospel truth. We've all made up stories to try and get out of trouble before. I'd be interested to know if he had his passport in his possesssion. That might give some clue as to whether he intended to cross the border. Or did he misplace that, too? I honestly don't think one can 'accidentally' find themselves on bridge to a foreign country. These things are clearly marked, and designed so that 'mistakes' like these are highly unlikely to occur. Are we to believe he is as incompetent at driving (and reading signs) as he is at remembering where he puts his guns? Something doesn't add up, and it's just possible that a judge will not buy his story.

But if the judge concludes that he was just dumb, he's not likely to hand down a three year sentence. Either way, guns are not toys and are to handled with the utmost seriousness. The driver did not remember that. Unfortunately for him, the border guard did.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smithington wrote:
I honestly don't think one can 'accidentally' find themselves on bridge to a foreign country. These things are clearly marked, and designed so that 'mistakes' like these are highly unlikely to occur.


Well, I don't know the specifics, but I do know that I've often ended up on roads where a single wrong turn forced to me to a huge distance out of my way, with absolutely no ability to turn around. Some people really are just oblivious. He'll get his chance in court to prove he was being foolish rather than malicious, and until then I think we can safely reserve judgment.
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Smithington



Joined: 14 Dec 2011

PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fox wrote:
Smithington wrote:
I honestly don't think one can 'accidentally' find themselves on bridge to a foreign country. These things are clearly marked, and designed so that 'mistakes' like these are highly unlikely to occur.


Well, I don't know the specifics, but I do know that I've often ended up on roads where a single wrong turn forced to me to a huge distance out of my way.


Into a foreign country?
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Leon



Joined: 31 May 2010

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If he is as foolish as he seems, he will actually show up for his court date, otherwise all he has to do is just not go back to Canada.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smithington wrote:
Fox wrote:
Smithington wrote:
I honestly don't think one can 'accidentally' find themselves on bridge to a foreign country. These things are clearly marked, and designed so that 'mistakes' like these are highly unlikely to occur.


Well, I don't know the specifics, but I do know that I've often ended up on roads where a single wrong turn forced to me to a huge distance out of my way.


Into a foreign country?


I've driven in three places in my entire life: Wisconsin, Illinois, and Korea. None of those places really have casual roadway entry into other countries (you can't just drive into North Korea in a private capacity, right?), so fortunately my own driving incompetence has never been tested to quite that limit!
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catman



Joined: 18 Jul 2004

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reminds me of this story a couple of years ago about a Michigan cop who lamented the fact that he couldn't carry his handgun in Canada:

Quote:
An off-duty Michigan police officer's public lament about not being able to carry a handgun in a Calgary park has him taking cyber fire from both sides of the border.

Walt Wawra of Kalamazoo, Mich., wrote a letter to the Calgary Herald this week complaining about a recent daylight encounter he and his wife had while visiting Nose Hill Park, a vast expanse of hilly grassland on the city's north side.

Wawra says the two men asked twice in a "very aggressive tone" whether the couple had been to the Calgary Stampede yet. They were "disrespectful" and had a "menacing manner," he recalls.

He says he ignored the two men at first, but when they moved closer he responded: "Gentlemen, I have no need to talk with you. Goodbye."

Everyone walked away peacefully. But in his letter to the editor, Wawra laments that a man should have the right to protect himself when he needs to and says it felt strange not to be able to carry his handgun off duty.

"I thank the Lord Jesus Christ they did not pull a weapon of some sort, but rather concluded it was in their best interest to leave us alone," Wawra writes.

"Would we not expect a uniformed officer to pull his or her weapon to intercede in a life-or-death encounter to protect self, or another? Why then should the expectation be lower for a citizen of Canada or a visitor? Wait, I know -- it's because in Canada, only the criminals and the police carry handguns."


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bababooey



Joined: 14 Aug 2013

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He was lucky he got caught in Canada, if the Border Services Officers would have turned them around with his gun they would have called down to the USCBP to let them know one of their citizens is returning to the US with a gun they did not declare on export as required by US law. Unlike Canada where the court is likely to give this guy a slap on the wrist (if he even comes back for his court date), when the USCBP charges people for not declaring on export they hit them with the full weight of the law.

Best case scenario for these people would have been to get their gun seized by CBSA, pay the conveyance penalty issued against their vehicle and return to the US without the gun so that USCBP couldn't charge them. What happened to them is middle of the road in terms of consequences because even though they have been issued a Canadian court date at least they don't face the wrath of the laws of their own country.

And for the record USCBP is way less tolerant than CBSA and their enforcement will not be overturned by their higher ups as so often happens in Canada.
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Steelrails



Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I tried to enter the US with a pound of pot in my car.


Its legal to carry around a pound of pot in Canada?

Dude, if you can't make sensible analogies because you are so blinded with disgust towards America, you really need to chill. Your emotions are clouding your judgment.

Quote:
t is only the most arrogant type of American who thinks that America is the world, and American laws can be taken with them across the border. The world doesn't work that way.


Well the individual involved seemed to understand that guns are illegal in Canada and he can't carry it across the border but was just trying to get turned around. Still, the whole ranting didn't help his case.

Quote:
Honestly, what kind of fool doesn't recall where he put his friggin' gun?


Well if someone goes hunting on a very frequent basis, I can see it happening. You're coming back and starting to unload the car when maybe your kid drops something or the phone rings or something or maybe your wife starts arguing with you and you get caught up in something. Next day you drive off and don't even realize you forgot to finish unloading the car.

Quote:
I honestly don't think one can 'accidentally' find themselves on bridge to a foreign country.


I don't know about this particular crossing but it very well could be that he thought there was a highway exit for a town close to the border and through a wrong turn got on the stretch to the border. This isn't the Chunnel here.

Speaking from experience, navigating Detroit and getting a little lost I've come darn close to ending up at the Windsor Tunnel or the Ambassador Bridge.

The point is that if indeed it is true that he simply took a wrong turn, we should be able to exercise mercy and restraint. Justice that isn't tempered with those two qualities is poor justice. Reflexively throwing the book at people who have caused no harm or damage simply because you have a personal loathing for their hobby is not sensible in my opinion.

What if its you next time, only instead of guns, its something else? What if you forget a magazine that has a few naked pics (and it isn't even a nudie mag, just an edgy one) and get busted in the Middle East for violating pornography laws? What if you forget to declare cigs or alcohol or merchandise at customs because you're jet lagged and distracted? What if you forgot to unpack the firecrackers from some party a month ago and are trying to cross the border and they're banned in that country?

You'd want mercy and understanding for yourself. Show it to others.
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