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Just curious as to reactions of others...
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:41 pm    Post subject: Just curious as to reactions of others... Reply with quote

Hello all:)

I'm wondering...if you were told you would be in one location in Korea (to teach, obviously) but when you showed up, it was in fact, NOT were you were told you would be?

For example...you were told you would be in the city and when you arrived, you found yourself pretty much, by Korean standards, in the country.

Would speculation of recruiter/school collaboration be out of line, on this matter be out line?

How would you folks handle this?
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Milwaukiedave



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Location: Bucheon

PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It does not surprise me in the least. Last minute changes are common in Korea. In this case I would go back to the recruiter and tell them that they need to place you somewhere else pronto. They pulled a fast one on you. Be ready with a backup plan if they say no. Make sure to point out that this is NOT on you. Do it firmly and respectfully. Use the word disappointed a lot. "I'm really disappointed that you put me in this situation." It's a little bit of a guilt trip, but it may work. Give them a deadline and hold to it.
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beentheredonethat777



Joined: 27 Jul 2013
Location: AsiaHaven

PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:27 am    Post subject: Re: Just curious as to reactions of others... Reply with quote

trueblue wrote:
Hello all:)

I'm wondering...if you were told you would be in one location in Korea (to teach, obviously) but when you showed up, it was in fact, NOT were you were told you would be?

For example...you were told you would be in the city and when you arrived, you found yourself pretty much, by Korean standards, in the country.

Would speculation of recruiter/school collaboration be out of line, on this matter be out line?

How would you folks handle this?


In the West, we call it a" blatant lie."
Here, it's called "Sorry.misunderstanding"

Not much you can do, pretty common. Especially for "fresh faces."
This happens daily. If your housing is okay, count it an awesome blessing and try your best to endure. Lies are generally told about the type of housing, locations, schools, students,scheduling, benefits, and...fill-in-the - blank, just to get teachers to come here. Yes, schools and recruiters collaborate on this stuff.

But if its unbearable for health reasons or something else major,make some noise about it. Not sure it'll help anything.

My friend was told that she'd be in walking distance to two beautiful sandy beaches on an island. She was so excited about relaxing on the beach on the weekends. Upon arrival, she was placed in an isolated place near a slab of mud that HAD been a beach 50 years ago!
She was horrified and eventually ran away one weekend to Taiwan and has never looked back!
What I know for sure is this:The school needed a teacher and the recruiter needed the cash!
They both got you and now they're both happy! It's business my dear, just business. Please don't take it personally.
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, to be upfront, this is not my first experience in Korea.

In all honesty, it is not really all that bad, regarding where I ended up.

I was, however, rather upset that school did bit address my complaint other than a casual " stuff happens"....

I will post about it more, later on. It surely is bot an epic drama, in which all fell apart. But, it is worth talking about.

I will return to this, perhaps, tomorrow.


Thank you:)
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ontheway



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 7:33 am    Post subject: Re: Just curious as to reactions of others... Reply with quote

trueblue wrote:
Hello all:)

I'm wondering...if you were told you would be in one location in Korea (to teach, obviously) but when you showed up, it was in fact, NOT were you were told you would be?

For example...you were told you would be in the city and when you arrived, you found yourself pretty much, by Korean standards, in the country.

Would speculation of recruiter/school collaboration be out of line, on this matter be out line?

How would you folks handle this?


Standard E2 contracts in Korea, other than many public school jobs where the location is determined later, have the school name and the city or town where they are located at the beginning of the contract.

Did your contract have a name and location?
Are you in a different location than your contract stated?
Did you research the location?
What city was listed in your contract?
Where are you actually located?
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honestly, I made a rookie mistake regarding the point of having the physical address on the school.

But...you know...it is not a bad situation. The contract itself, is rather decent. The housing is nice, along with the view. I am pretty much left alone by the Korean teachers...though...I have to admit, it was not a very welcoming atmosphere when I walked in the door (shirt, tie.slacks) and being the only foreign teacher is somewhat of...a drag. Though, I was told I am a novelty because I actually like to prepare, plan and teacher (there is more to the story regarding that...but, it has to do with contract matters, which I will not discuss here).

Anyway...it is a bit isolating. The places I WANT to go are a lengthy bus ride away but a 15,000 won cab ride away. That adds up...however, it is not really the big issue.

I was rather heated, in regards to the casual manner in which the school received my opinion on NOT being where I was told I would be (along with working hours and age group). I showed them the emails from the recruiter (whom I will not mention) and they just...gave me a subtle air of "oh well".

Now, the reason this rookie mistake happened, was becasue I had sent all of my documents to another agency for a different school, PRIOR to this one. But, at the very last minute, I find out that my position was terminated due to the director not having enough students. So, the agent representative suggested that I go with school, in which I had already turned down (a religious chain school)....nope. I was very upfront when I told him that it would behoove him to send my documents back to me.

He did, fortunately.

But time was running out...I had already made arrangements at home (and dropped out of graduate school....well, more like, taking a break) so I had to do something. Reflecting on the first misshap, I think that was trully a classic bait and switch.

This situation...I must confess, it is not too bad.

I did not start the thread to complain. I was just curious to know how others would reacrt. Though...I did almost hand in my resignation over the matter. It was all typed, with a posted dated LOR and I was ready to help the school find another teacher, as long as they gave me that LOR. If not, I was prepared to leave on pay day...pure and simple.

I was talked into staying. I don't think it is because I'm bursting with awesomeness as a teacher (though I can hold my own), but it is an issue of trying to get someone out here.

Oddly enough, a buddy of mine in this town had the same experience...with the same agency.

Interesting times. IT is not my first experience in Korea. I could have done MUCH worse, I realize that.
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ontheway



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trueblue wrote:
Honestly, I made a rookie mistake regarding the point of having the physical address on the school.


trueblue wrote:
I was rather heated, in regards to the casual manner in which the school received my opinion on NOT being where I was told I would be (along with working hours and age group). I showed them the emails from the recruiter (whom I will not mention) and they just...gave me a subtle air of "oh well".


You can't blame the school. You signed the contract with no location. Recruiter's promises are worth nothing. Recruiters lie. You had no contract with the recruiter. You bought a pig in a poke and have no one to blame but yourself for not having a location in the contract and for trusting a recruiter's promises. The reaction of the school makes sense since according to your account they did nothing wrong.

trueblue wrote:
Now, the reason this rookie mistake happened, was becasue I had sent all of my documents to another agency for a different school, PRIOR to this one. But, at the very last minute, I find out that my position was terminated due to the director not having enough students. So, the agent representative suggested that I go with school, in which I had already turned down (a religious chain school)....nope. I was very upfront when I told him that it would behoove him to send my documents back to me.

He did, fortunately.

But time was running out...I had already made arrangements at home (and dropped out of graduate school....well, more like, taking a break) so I had to do something. Reflecting on the first misshap, I think that was trully a classic bait and switch.


This does not sound like bait and switch. It sounds like a classic case of a school changing its mind about hiring a teacher. Maybe they were having financial trouble. Maybe they found a better teacher and wanted to "save face" - yours that is - by not telling you the real reason.

There are more teachers available than jobs these days - still 10 teachers per job at a minimum. The recruiter offered you an alternate job, but you can be sure it's been filled by now. Being a religious school, unless you have similar personal inclinations you were probably better off turning it down.

trueblue wrote:
This situation...I must confess, it is not too bad.

I did not start the thread to complain. I was just curious to know how others would reacrt. Though...I did almost hand in my resignation over the matter. It was all typed, with a posted dated LOR and I was ready to help the school find another teacher, as long as they gave me that LOR. If not, I was prepared to leave on pay day...pure and simple.

I was talked into staying. I don't think it is because I'm bursting with awesomeness as a teacher (though I can hold my own), but it is an issue of trying to get someone out here.

Oddly enough, a buddy of mine in this town had the same experience...with the same agency.


A lot of recruiters are dishonest, crooks and liars.

Since the job and the school are "not too bad" and since it was the second recruiter who apparently "mislead" you - with the assistance of your own casual inattention to detail - it sounds like you should make the best of your good fortune to be at a decent school, albeit in a location you would not have chosen, and make the best of it. You could probably resign with notice, obtain a release letter and get back in the long lines for another job, but there's no guarantee that you'll find another teaching job in Korea without a long period of unemployment, if at all.

Make lemonade.
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le-paul



Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

trueblue wrote:




I did not start the thread to complain. I was just curious to know how others would reacrt. Though...I did almost hand in my resignation over the matter. It was all typed, with a posted dated LOR and I was ready to help the school find another teacher, as long as they gave me that LOR. If not, I was prepared to leave on pay day...pure and simple.

I was talked into staying.


I hope, for your sake that was by a friend and not someone from the school. About the biggest way to insult your boss would have been to discuss quitting.
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I hope, for your sake that was by a friend and not someone from the school. About the biggest way to insult your boss would have been to discuss quitting.



Negative Ghost-rider...it was not a friend. It was the boss.

It is not that I went out of my way to insult him but...if his feelings are hurt, so be it. I am not worried about how the school is potentially looking for another teacher. I can understand, if they were. In fact, I would consider doing the same, if I were in his position, being unsettled whether or not my foreign teacher is going to stay or leave.

I can empathize with that point of view, truly. In fact, he may HAVE considered the conversation, despite the fact I tore up the written form in front of him, to BE my notice of resignation.

Yes, it was my fault regarding the address issue on the contract. And, yes ...I do feel I was "mislead" (thank you for that) with the first attempt. I do not hold a grudge on the matter but it was a bit stressful.

Either way, the school knows that I KNOW, they collaborated with the recruiter on the matter. Yes, I know recruiters do not work for teachers, but the schools.

However, one point I forgot to mention, is when I arrived, I met one foreign teacher (who lived in the building next to me) who was on is way out, finishing his contract. He inquired as to where I was working and I mentioned the school. Based on his conversations with teacher I replaced, his immediate and unequivocal advice was to, and I quote..."Get the F#$@ out, while you can".

Oh well...what's done is done. Either way, I'll be OK. A vertical power has my back.

But..as I said...they consider me to be a novelty because I actually go in there to do my job. But, one thing that bothered me a bit when arrived, was the fact that classes were only 25 minutes long...and the contract calls for 120 hours per working month, each defined as 60 minutes. Their explanation for that, was, in the past, the foreign teachers could not control the kids. So, they gave me a trial on scheduling classes to be 55 minutes. That is something I did notice in the contract. However, after going through contract after contract....and asking questions regarding various details to be clearly defined, the more I did that, the less response I received. So...I had to take a chance.

Alas, it worked out.


So...as I said, I was just curious to know how others would react.

I have my answer...make lemonade.

(the good thing is...according to the contract, I don't have to pay back the airfare if they let me go...Smile

Anyhow, thank you for sharing. What may happen, will eventually play out. As I said, the housing is nice, the view is nice, the locals are OK, my students are a handful but in a good way (except a couple middle school classes) that just makes me have more fun with them...

...(and, having recently spent four years in the military, I can use my "big boy" voice, if needed. In which case, is actually supported, along with "push-up" parties. I saw my assistant director give a PROPER, a** chewing's to students. Wow...I was impressed, honestly)...

So...what's done is done and I think we can move on from the thread. Again, thank for the comments.
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tob55



Joined: 29 Apr 2007

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The recruiter's reputation generally has to do with them putting people in places on an ASAP situation. Same thing happened to me 10 years ago when I arrived in Korea. I was all set to work in a public high school close to Incheon, but instead the recruiter drove me two hours south to a private hagwon in Pyeongtaek. It did work out for me though. I met my wife in Pyeongtaek, and now 9 years later with a beautiful wife and daughter who is pushing 3 years old, I laugh about it. At the time it was very upsetting and angered me a lot, but sometimes things do work out differently than we plan them to. Hope it doesn't put a cramp into your overall plans OP. Cheers Cool
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The recruiter's reputation generally has to do with them putting people in places on an ASAP situation. Same thing happened to me 10 years ago when I arrived in Korea. I was all set to work in a public high school close to Incheon, but instead the recruiter drove me two hours south to a private hagwon in Pyeongtaek. It did work out for me though. I met my wife in Pyeongtaek, and now 9 years later with a beautiful wife and daughter who is pushing 3 years old, I laugh about it. At the time it was very upsetting and angered me a lot, but sometimes things do work out differently than we plan them to. Hope it doesn't put a cramp into your overall plans OP. Cheers


Was the school a Land of Wonder?
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Lucas



Joined: 11 Sep 2012

PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
...(and, having recently spent four years in the military, I can use my "big boy" voice, if needed. In which case, is actually supported, along with "push-up" parties. I saw my assistant director give a PROPER, a** chewing's to students. Wow...I was impressed, honestly)...


Children are not soldiers, they are children.

You can scream at them to make them quite, (this may even arouse you a little), or you can read up on classroom management and have your classroom be a little oasis of learning and peace (mutual self-respect). Cool
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tob55



Joined: 29 Apr 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

trueblue wrote:
Quote:
The recruiter's reputation generally has to do with them putting people in places on an ASAP situation. Same thing happened to me 10 years ago when I arrived in Korea. I was all set to work in a public high school close to Incheon, but instead the recruiter drove me two hours south to a private hagwon in Pyeongtaek. It did work out for me though. I met my wife in Pyeongtaek, and now 9 years later with a beautiful wife and daughter who is pushing 3 years old, I laugh about it. At the time it was very upsetting and angered me a lot, but sometimes things do work out differently than we plan them to. Hope it doesn't put a cramp into your overall plans OP. Cheers


Was the school a Land of Wonder?


I cannot say yes or no to the question, but to let you know, I certainly knew I wasn't in Kansas anymore once I arrived. It left me 'wondering' what land I had entered Laughing
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Children are not soldiers, they are children.

You can scream at them to make them quite, (this may even arouse you a little), or you can read up on classroom management and have your classroom be a little oasis of learning and peace (mutual self-respect).


Lucas, I hope you are not suggesting that I do this every day.

There is a difference between "if needed" and a consistent practice. In addition, a "big boy" voice does not equate to yelling and screaming.

Please stop polarizing the issue. If you took what I said in the wrong context, than realize that, that is not what I meant.

BUT...your comment of
Quote:
(this may even arouse you a little),
, is just, down right creepy.

So, keep the insults and speculations to yourself. I'm not here looking for an internet fight.
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trueblue



Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines

PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I cannot say yes or no to the question, but to let you know, I certainly knew I wasn't in Kansas anymore once I arrived. It left me 'wondering' what land I had entered Laughing


We may know the same people... Cool
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