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wylde
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
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 Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| dogbert wrote: |
LOL...I go to the store but have no interaction with the goods therein or the merchant?
Nice try, though.
In American usage, "going to school" implies being a student. If a fifth-grader says, "I go to school", that has a meaning different from his mother's saying "I'm going to the school to pick up my son".
[I will make an exception for Wylde in this regard in terms of "being in hospital" since he has spent so much time there  ]
Similarly, one is "in prison".
Of course, there is only one Europe, so there is no question of article usage.
"Trunk" (what do y'all call it, a "boot"?) is a logical analogue of "trunk" used in the since of "large suitcase".
Of course, I agree with Ajuma -- I would never use the word "dodg(e)y", just as I would never refer to something as "bloody", unless it were actually bleeding. |
LOL... nice try though! 
zero interaction in a store.. it is a location. you are going to the store
if you are going there with the hope of having something sold to you, you are then going shopping. otherwise, you are walking in, picking something up and giving money over.
whilst a hospital is still a location - i'm going to the hospital, it is also a place that helps you, treats you and changes something about you.
if you are going for it's service you go to hospital, if you are going to the location, you go to the
well.. why do you call it a hood? what does a hood cover? you head maybe?
in oz we say bonnet (bonnet also covers the head) - top or front end.
we say boot cuz it is the bottom or end of the car..
so, what you are saying is... you call it a hood cuz it covers the 'brain' (engine) of the car and then you call it a trunk cuz ya put stuff in it?
bonnet - top / boot - bottom |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 12:40 am Post subject: |
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| wylde wrote: |
| so, what you are saying is... you call it a hood cuz it covers the 'brain' (engine) of the car and then you call it a trunk cuz ya put stuff in it? |
That's my basic understanding. |
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wylde
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 12:48 am Post subject: |
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thanks for replying.. i was happy to see that it was so prompt. 
i'm drinking a lot lately..
i think i might need to go to hospital soon. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 1:44 am Post subject: |
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And I'll be sure to go to the hospital to visit you.
Watch yourself around the candy stripers! |
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wylde
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 1:49 am Post subject: |
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| dogbert wrote: |
And I'll be sure to go to the hospital to visit you.
Watch yourself around the candy stripers! |
perfect english |
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ajuma
Joined: 18 Feb 2003
Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:59 am Post subject: |
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How about the gym/fitness center (or, to make you happy wylde "centre")? You go there for a reason and you have (or CAN have) a membership.
Or bowling alley? You can have a "membership" (be on a team), but you don't say "to bowling alley". |
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wylde
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:04 am Post subject: |
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locations
you are going to bowl at THE bowling alley
you are going to workout at THE fitness center |
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ajuma
Joined: 18 Feb 2003
Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:06 am Post subject: |
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| You're going to ? at the hospital?? VS You're going to ? at hospital?? |
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ajuma
Joined: 18 Feb 2003
Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:08 am Post subject: |
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To follow through a little more:
I'm going to be incarcerated in THE jail.
I'm going to shop in THE store.
I'm going to pray in THE church. |
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wylde
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:17 am Post subject: |
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to BE incarcerated
doesn't fit
verbs baby
never at hospital btw
hal mulliopta..
length of time... you are in high school for 6 years
you are in prison for 6 years
you are in hospital for 6 months
you are in class for 60 minutes
you are a member, you are inside, you must stay for a certain period of time..
there are a bunch of rules for this sucker and i'll be screwed if i can remember how to explain this easily |
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ajuma
Joined: 18 Feb 2003
Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:24 am Post subject: |
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Well, following your "logic",
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| if you are going for it's service you go to hospital, if you are going to the location, you go to the |
WHAT EXACTLY do you do in the hospital when you go the hospital for its service?
Get treated? Have treatment? Be treated? All verbs, baby!! |
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wylde
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:26 am Post subject: |
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| ajuma wrote: |
Well, following your "logic",
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| if you are going for it's service you go to hospital, if you are going to the location, you go to the |
WHAT EXACTLY do you do in the hospital when you go the hospital for its service?
Get treated? Have treatment? Be treated? All verbs, baby!! |
tell me what you do in prison?
if it is ok to say in prison, there is no reason to say in hospital is wrong |
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ajuma
Joined: 18 Feb 2003
Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:36 am Post subject: |
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| Back to this thread tomorrow...I'm off to THE hospital to be admitted to the psych ward!!! |
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matthewwoodford
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Location: Location, location, location.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 5:42 am Post subject: |
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If this is how hard it is to explain a simple difference in definite article usage between American and British English what hope is there of explaining articles to Koreans?
Guys: if we're talking about prisons or schools as institutions built for certain purposes - and not talking about specific buildings - we drop the article. In Britain this also applies to hospital (see how it becomes non-count here because I'm talking about an institution?) but not in America.
So, in America do you say 'the hospital' in the same way as we say 'the store' or 'the swimming pool' because it's one of the standard facilities to be found in any town? Maybe you have more hospitals than we do!! Yet you pay for them! |
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matthewwoodford
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Location: Location, location, location.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:05 am Post subject: |
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| ajuma wrote: |
How about the gym/fitness center (or, to make you happy wylde "centre")? You go there for a reason and you have (or CAN have) a membership.
Or bowling alley? You can have a "membership" (be on a team), but you don't say "to bowling alley". |
It's not about membership: that's a red herring.
It's interesting to argue about this issue to get to the bottom of it, but, as there are rational arguments on both sides, maybe it just boils down to what sounds natural to the individual. [Perhaps how you express it also affects how you think about it - but that doesn't seem to be the case with hospital/the hospital: we mean the same thing.]
For example, to me saying you have 'a membership' also jars. I have 'a membership card' but I merely have 'membership' at the club. It's a concept not a commodity, and it's non-count.
Another usage that grates for me is 'the nature'. Is this standard in North America or was that just another instance of Bush mangling the language that I heard? It always used to be just plain 'nature'. Didn't it?? |
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