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US 'turned blind eye to Iraq oil'
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hypnotist



Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 2:51 am    Post subject: US 'turned blind eye to Iraq oil' Reply with quote

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4554507.stm

Quote:
Last Updated: Tuesday, 17 May, 2005, 10:06 GMT 11:06 UK

US 'turned blind eye to Iraq oil'

The US turned a blind eye to the former Iraq regime's $8bn trade in smuggled oil, a new US Senate report says.

The report says the US was well aware of both the smuggling and the kickbacks Iraq solicited from players in the UN's oil-for-food programme.

Published by Democrat minority members of a key committee, it follows charges levelled against several Russian politicians and UK MP George Galloway.

[...]

In all, US buyers paid more than half the $224m in total kickbacks, the report estimates.

But it also said that the far bigger smuggling trade was carried out with tacit US approval.

[...]

"The US was not only aware of Iraqi oil sales which violated UN sanctions and provided the bulk of the illicit money Saddam Hussein obtained from circumventing UN sanctions," the report said.

"On occasion, the US actually facilitated the illicit oil sales."



... so the US was the only country upholding sanctions, then?
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 4:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think everyone knows this.

The US needed Jordan for the ME peace process and they needed Turkey for no fly zones. Both are were right.

Kind of shows how difficult it was to contain Saddam Hussein.

Yes other countries were not helping the US keep no fly zones or contain Saddam in fact they were willing to set Iraq free of sanctions. Cause they wanted to make money from Iraq trade but also cause he was an enemy of the US. and they liked to see the US pinned down containing Saddam.

It seems a lot of countries enjoy the US in trouble cause they are afraid of being eclipsed by the US.


The US did more than anyone else to contain Saddam.

and containing Saddam Hussein was a big problem for the US.
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Wangja



Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:
I think everyone knows this.

The US needed Jordan for the ME peace process and they needed Turkey for no fly zones. Both are were right.

Kind of shows how difficult it was to contain Saddam Hussein.

Yes other countries were not helping the US keep no fly zones or contain Saddam in fact they were willing to set Iraq free of sanctions. Cause they wanted to make money from Iraq trade but also cause he was an enemy of the US. and they liked to see the US pinned down containing Saddam.

It seems a lot of countries enjoy the US in trouble cause they are afraid of being eclipsed by the US.


The US did more than anyone else to contain Saddam.

and containing Saddam Hussein was a big problem for the US.


Ah, now I understand. If other countries do it, it's "sanction busting" but when the US does it. it's OK.

Thanks, Joo, it's all clear now.
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What sanctions busting are you talking about?

Show us sanction busting by the US.

There was no sanction busting by the US.

The US allowed Turkey and Jordan to do it.

Not like the US had any choice.

But other nations were just as responsible for the sanctions busting. They turned a blind eye just as much as the US.

but the motives were different the US allowed sanction busting by Jordan for the sake of the mid east peace process.

And allowed it by turkey so the US could save the Kurds from genocide.

France and Russia did it for money and because they don't want to see the US better off.

You do the comparison.

Please show sanction busting by the US govt if you can.

From the article the US company involved was indicted


Quote:
Kickbacks

It takes the example of Bayoil, a US oil firm which was indicted by US authorities in April and was allegedly used by the three Russian politicians as a go-between with the Iraqi authorities.


I hope it is clear.

By the way from another thread it is not like the US ever helped out England on anything. W/o the US you wouldn't even have your job. Just a thought.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without the US there would be no contract disputes to mediate? Please explain, Joo.
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mithridates wrote:
Without the US there would be no contract disputes to mediate? Please explain, Joo.


I don't understand the Q

but as I know w/o the US there SK would have been conquered by NK and then there would be no teaching in SK though there might be stuff teaching in Norkland. But I doubt they would let you go to Po Jang Ma Chas
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hypnotist



Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 6:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:
What sanctions busting are you talking about?

Show us sanction busting by the US.

There was no sanction busting by the US.

The US allowed Turkey and Jordan to do it.


They not only allowed Turkey and Jordan to do it, they were also the source of over half the kickbacks paid to Saddam in order to make it happen. Paying Saddam for that privilege is just as much sanctions busting as the actions of Turkey and Jordan were.

It's worth repeating that, just to be clear - the US was responsible for over half the kickback payments to Saddam Hussein's horrific regime.

I don't see how you can say the US actions were somehow more worthy than those of Russia and China. The US Government was condemning those countries for making kickbacks, whilst being the biggest source of them. In addition, the result of all the kickbacks was the same - strengthening Saddam (you don't contain someone by paying them $100m). It's just base hypocricy to try to claim that it's somehow ok if the US does it, Joo. All the countries had valid geopolitical reasons to do it - that doesn't make it right for any of them.

The US was sanctions busting, and it was letting other countries get away with it - and unlike Russia and France, it was claiming that sanctions were working, and that they needed to be maintained!
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R. S. Refugee



Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Location: Shangra La, ROK

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wangja wrote:


Ah, now I understand. If other countries do it, it's "sanction busting" but when the US does it. it's OK.

Thanks, Joo, it's all clear now.


Whew. You Brits. Wanja, there only two words that you always need to keep in mind when you're faced with American behavior that, if engaged in by others, might be labeled completely arrogant, cynical, hypocritical, dishonest, immoral, or illegal. And those two words are:

























American Exceptionalism



You'll never hear Joo use that term but it is guiding principle behind every explanation he gives about why it is good and noble and just and altruistic when the USA does it, but damnable when anyone else does. And if you point out such hypocracy, you're just trying to bring down the good ole USA, the saviour of the world. Right, Joo?
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
They not only allowed Turkey and Jordan to do it, they were also the source of over half the kickbacks paid to Saddam in order to make it happen. Paying Saddam for that privilege is just as much sanctions busting as the actions of Turkey and Jordan were.


Quote:

Why were US firms paying the surcharges? Please answer the question.


Because they were buying Iraqi oil.

Quote:
It's worth repeating that, just to be clear - the US was responsible for over half the kickback payments to Saddam Hussein's horrific regime.


and that means what?


Quote:
I don't see how you can say the US actions were somehow more worthy than those of Russia and China. The US Government was condemning those countries for making kickbacks, whilst being the biggest source of them. In addition, the result of all the kickbacks was the same - strengthening Saddam (you don't contain someone by paying them $100m). It's just base hypocricy to try to claim that it's somehow ok if the US does it, Joo. All the countries had valid geopolitical reasons to do it - that doesn't make it right for any of them.


US companies bought Iraqi oil and paid surcharges to do it.

while Russia and China helped Saddam evade the sanctions for the purpose of weaken them to get them off.


Quote:
The US was sanctions busting, and it was letting other countries get away with it - and unlike Russia and France, it was claiming that sanctions were working, and that they needed to be maintained!


The US didnt' claim the sactions were working. That is the reason the US wanted to switch to smart sanctions.

So please tell me this . US companies paid surcharges on Iraqi oil cause they were buying Iraqi oil.Why did France and Russia help Saddam try to evade the sanctions what was their reason?


Last edited by Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee on Tue May 17, 2005 2:44 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Whew. You Brits. Wanja, there only two words that you always need to keep in mind when you're faced with American behavior that, if engaged in by others, might be labeled completely arrogant, cynical, hypocritical, dishonest, immoral, or illegal. And those two words are:


Quote:
You'll never hear Joo use that term but it is guiding principle behind every explanation he gives about why it is good and noble and just and altruistic when the USA does it, but damnable when anyone else does. And if you point out such hypocracy, you're just trying to bring down the good ole USA, the saviour of the world. Right, Joo?


Lets see US companies payed surcharges because they were buying Iraqi oil and if you bought Iraqi oil you paid surchages,

France and Russia helped Saddam violate the sanctions becaue they wanted the sanctions off Iraq.
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igotthisguitar



Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:
Lets see US companies payed surcharges because they were buying Iraqi oil and if you bought Iraqi oil you paid surchages, France and Russia helped Saddam violate the sanctions becaue they wanted the sanctions off Iraq.

According to the US Senate commission British MP George Galloway recently appeared in front of, "surcharges" were used synonymously with "KICKBACKS" Idea
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2005 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At any rate the US put an end to the practice when they took out Saddam Hussein.
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Konundrum



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Boston

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
France and Russia helped Saddam violate the sanctions becaue they wanted the sanctions off Iraq
.

Perhaps they wanted the sanctions off Iraq because they weren't working the way they were supposed to. They were putting money into Saddam's coffers while many Iraqi citizens were being deprived of life essentials, and America and its allies make off like bandits.
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You think the US was making off like bandits having to spend billions of dollars a year to contain Saddam Hussein?

There was 224 million payed in surcharges to the regime of Saddam but the US spent Billions every year containing Saddam.

anyway it seems the US has been prosecuting US companies that paid paying the surcharge.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/04/14/oilfood.indictment/
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Nowhere Man



Joined: 08 Feb 2004

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 8:23 am    Post subject: ... Reply with quote

Joo,

So you're explaining why they "turned a blind eye", right?

Are you saying they didn't?
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