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Belinda Stronach is a Liberal
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The Lemon



Joined: 11 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
I suspect the reason why is that subconsciously they don't think the self-serving actions of a female politician should be condemned as severely as those of a self-serving male politician. It's just a form of reverse discrimination.


Suspect all you want. The fact is, most critical opinion columns and editorial cartoons fixate on her gender in ways they didn't with Scott Bryson, who made a similar move last year.
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Lemon wrote:
The fact is, most critical opinion columns and editorial cartoons fixate on her gender in ways they didn't with Scott Bryson, who made a similar move last year.

This statement can be neither proved nor disproved, without a careful analysis by content of all opinion columns and editorial cartoons which have mentioned Belinda Stronach. The politically correct will always see what they want to see, and merely move from preconceived notions to foregone conclusions. Given the current mix of seats in the House of Commons, a male PC MP -- from as equally wealthy a family, and involved with an equally important female member of the Conservative Party -- would have gotten just as much attention.
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If she is a politician, then she is, by definition, a hooer. Everbody knows that. Rolling Eyes
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turtlepi1



Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi, UAE

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 2:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Lemon wrote:
Manner of Speaking wrote:
I suspect the reason why is that subconsciously they don't think the self-serving actions of a female politician should be condemned as severely as those of a self-serving male politician. It's just a form of reverse discrimination.


Suspect all you want. The fact is, most critical opinion columns and editorial cartoons fixate on her gender in ways they didn't with Scott Bryson, who made a similar move last year.


I'm not taking sides as I haven't made up my mind yet, but I DO suspect that one reason why "whoring" is OK with a woman and not OK with a homosexual makes some comment about the status of women vs the status of homosexuals.
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Homer
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 2:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There has been a definite gender bias in the way her party switch was treated.

There were a few political cartoons that portrayed her as a street hooker trying to turn a trick from a Liberal in a car.

This is down in the mud bad and is indicative of the gender bias.

However, what she did (while a savy political move) was betrayal and sefl-serving to the utmost and for that she deserves the ribbing she is getting.
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The Lemon



Joined: 11 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
The politically correct will always see what they want to see, and merely move from preconceived notions to foregone conclusions.

As would anyone west of Saskatchewan, or any ideologue who had been waiting years for this big break and was salivating at the imminent fall of the Liberals.

Quote:
Given the current mix of seats in the House of Commons, a male PC MP -- from as equally wealthy a family, and involved with an equally important female member of the Conservative Party -- would have gotten just as much attention.


Would he have had so much emphasis placed on his appearance and his gender? Who are you trying to fool here?

I have no qualms with those who criticise her for making public comments this week that completely contradict those she made last week while a Conservative. I also have no problem with people who rightfully mock the placement of a political newbie into a senior Cabinet position (though if we were in her shoes, having just been summoned for a chewing out by the leader of the party we helped form, I bet we'd seriously consider the same move). And, what she did to her boyfriend, who seems like a genuinely nice though naive guy, shows a serious lack of personal ethics. She made a fool out of him. And, it was greasy of her to show up at that Tory strategy convention on the weekend, all ears, while secretly negotiating her switch to the government.

There's plenty to throw at her without resorting to language that ultimately reenforces the worst in Canada's right wing.
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Cthulhu



Joined: 02 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Lemon wrote:

Quote:
I have no qualms with those who criticise her for making public comments this week that completely contradict those she made last week while a Conservative. I also have no problem with people who rightfully mock the placement of a political newbie into a senior Cabinet position (though if we were in her shoes, having just been summoned for a chewing out by the leader of the party we helped form, I bet we'd seriously consider the same move). And, what she did to her boyfriend, who seems like a genuinely nice though naive guy, shows a serious lack of personal ethics. She made a fool out of him. And, it was greasy of her to show up at that Tory strategy convention on the weekend, all ears, while secretly negotiating her switch to the government.


As far as her decision is concerned that covered all the bases for me, Lemon. Though I'm not impressed with her action, I do agree with your point about Harper's actions blasting her (and having everyone find out about it) providing some of the push. I doubt Harper ever thought she'd jump ship over it--his ego probably didn't expect it either, at a time when he thought he had the opportunity to grasp the brass ring. Poor timing on his part as well.
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The Man known as The Man



Joined: 29 Mar 2003
Location: 3 cheers for Ted Haggard oh yeah!

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

canuckistan wrote:
Gwangjuboy wrote:
canuckistan wrote:


The sex issue would NEVER be raised if you were talking about a man in the same situation.


PC madness. If God wanted men and women to be the same he would have equipped them both with tackle.


The Great Wall of Whiner wrote:

Quote:
Yes, bad choice of words. Sexual opportunist. Peter McKay is reported to be devastated to have the love of his life leave him for political ambition.



He's "reported to be devastated" but she's a "sexual opportunist".....see what I mean? Such puerile speculation about Stronach's private life is 100% sexist.

It's not about women "being the same" as men, it's about leaving the tired old schtick of women's sexualities out of discussions about their public lives.


Read some of the Canadian dailies online. You will see that the majority of columnists by far writing about the private side/love affair are women.


HTH
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Free World



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Drake Hotel

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I have to hand it to Martin. He had to buy 3 or 4 votes in the House to do it but it worked out for him so his government is safe for a year or so.
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FUBAR



Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: The Y.C.

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to see the budget get passed through. If the budget had failed to pass, many things in this country would have grinded to a stand still. At least, the budget is passed and some of the provinces can get some badly needed funds.

Now Martin needs to keep his word and call the election 30 days after the Gomery report is released.
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Moldy Rutabaga



Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Now Martin needs to keep his word and call the election 30 days after the Gomery report is released.

I'll believe it when I see it. Right now, I don't.

Ken:>
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The Man known as The Man



Joined: 29 Mar 2003
Location: 3 cheers for Ted Haggard oh yeah!

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Free World wrote:
Well, I have to hand it to Martin. He had to buy 3 or 4 votes in the House to do it but it worked out for him so his government is safe for a year or so.


This talk of hores is apt, but not towards Belinda Stronach. I'll try to find a link, but John REynolds said, and I paraphrase


"The Liberals are a bunch of hores. That's unfair to some as there are probably nice people who are hores."

So let's get rid of these sexist slams towards Belinda Stronach, as she should be sainted before Pope John Paul 2-Paul Martin Junior has hored himself out to the NDP, and the BS, Belinda Stronach.


I am glad Chuck Cadman gave the finger to the conservatives as they didn't want him as their member in his riding-I was hoping Carolyn Parrish would also give the up yours to her former party.
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Lemon wrote:
Manner of Speaking wrote:
The politically correct will always see what they want to see, and merely move from preconceived notions to foregone conclusions.

As would anyone west of Saskatchewan, or any ideologue who had been waiting years for this big break and was salivating at the imminent fall of the Liberals.


Well, I'm from Nova Scotia, and I've voted NDP in every federal election I've ever participated in, and I still think she's a hooer. I don't now what the relevance of your comment is, other than to demonstrate how quickly and often you deal in stereotypes.

Quote:
Quote:
Given the current mix of seats in the House of Commons, a male PC MP -- from as equally wealthy a family, and involved with an equally important female member of the Conservative Party -- would have gotten just as much attention.

Would he have had so much emphasis placed on his appearance and his gender? Who are you trying to fool here?


Well, if she placed so much emphasis on her appearance and background in order to advance her political career, why shouldn't it be taken into account to a certain extent when passing judgement on her actions? And who are YOU trying to fool? WHAT editorial comments or cartoons are you talking about that are so sexist? I haven't seen any. And by no means can I assume that the majority, or all, seem to be placing so much emphasis on her appearance and gender. There is no evidence of this, and you haven't provided any.

And apparently, from what one poster described above, the majority of editorials which are so critical of her are written by women. Where's the sexism in that? You've merely moved from preconceived notions to foregone conclusions.

She's a liar and a hooer. On her website, she claimed she crossed the floor of the House because she was concerned about the Conservative Party's association with the BQ and that she did it "for the good of the country". If she did it for the good of the country, why did she making getting a cabinet post a condition of her move? If she believed what she was doing was right, and good for the country, then she should have done it on principle alone, and not as a condition of getting a cabinet post.

She used the Conservative Party, her constituents, and Peter McKay as far as they could take her, and then she sold her a** to the next highest bidder. If that's not whoring yourself out -- regardless of your gender -- I don't know what is.
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On the other hand



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There has been a definite gender bias in the way her party switch was treated.

There were a few political cartoons that portrayed her as a street hooker trying to turn a trick from a Liberal in a car.

This is down in the mud bad and is indicative of the gender bias.


Back when the Tories were still in power, I saw a cartoon of Mulroney, dressed as a mother, pulling a child(representing his Quebec caucus) away from a leering Jacques Parizeau, who was offering the kid a lollipop. It was a comment on Quebec seperatists trying to woo Quebec Tory MPs over to their side. And it could be arged that THAT was an example of gender bias, because we commonly think of child molestors as being male, and so a female politician is not likely to be drawn that way.

True, Mulroney was portrayed as a mother, but he actually had to be put in drag for the effect to work. For Parizeau's "dirty old man", it was enough to have him dressed in everyday male clothes and holding a lollipop.
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tommynomad



Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Location: on the move

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
She used the Conservative Party, her constituents, and Peter McKay as far as they could take her,

Let's not all cry too hard for McKay. Stronach did to him what he did to Orchard.
Shocked
(you know what I mean, you dirty birds)
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