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Qinella



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 2:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

While you're on the topic, can you tell me the best way to build lower chest without any weights? I can't stand going to the gym, it's just ultra boring for me, so I work out at home. The only part of my body I'm unhappy with is my lower pecs because they aren't completely firm, so should I be concentrating more on incline pushups, or would standard pushups be best?
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Demonicat



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Location: Suwon

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Inclines hit the upper chest, Straights focus on the middle and lower. I'd try diamond (also called marine) pushups to really blast it.Simply bring your hands together and make a diamond with your thumbs and forefingers. Its bitchin'. Do them to failure, wait a minute, do it again, repeat for 4 or five sets. Do this 3 or 4 times a week. Enjoy.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should not workout when you are sick. A light cold (maybe). Flu or more serious sickness no. Working out lowers your immune system at the very time it needs to be boosted. This in turn allows the virus to gain a firmer hold on your body. This in turn could lead to long-term impairment of your immune system. Not a good idea.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Demonicat wrote:
Inclines hit the upper chest, Straights focus on the middle and lower. I'd try diamond (also called marine) pushups to really blast it.Simply bring your hands together and make a diamond with your thumbs and forefingers. Its *beep*'. Do them to failure, wait a minute, do it again, repeat for 4 or five sets. Do this 3 or 4 times a week. Enjoy.



There is no upper chest. Nor is there a middle or lower. The pectoral is ONE muscle. It has one point of origin which means that the entire muscle is worked when you do any chest exercise. Try attempting to flex JUST your "upper" chest. Now try to flex just the "lower". The whole muscle flexes as one. An anatomy textbook will make this clear.
It is possible to focus (slightly) more on one part than the rest. However ANY chest exercise works the entire muscle. And as for the extra focus it should not make any noticeable difference unless you are a pro bodybuilder or extremely genetically gifted.
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Demonicat



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Location: Suwon

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not so sure myth. The concept that there is no upper or lower chest kinda goes against the entire theory of modern bodybuilding. Further, if this was true how could one explain the high develkopment of the lower pectoral region in trainees who focus on flat or decline bench presses V. trainees who focus upon the upper pectoral region.
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Qinella wrote:
While you're on the topic, can you tell me the best way to build lower chest without any weights? I can't stand going to the gym, it's just ultra boring for me, so I work out at home. The only part of my body I'm unhappy with is my lower pecs because they aren't completely firm, so should I be concentrating more on incline pushups, or would standard pushups be best?


one trick I used to do when I trained at home was "kitchen dips". I'm not sure how well it'd work in Korea but in my (strong) Canadain kitchen I was able to use the -V- corner of my counter for dips.

Bangs of some decent sets with that and you'll have breasts that rivals Dolly's.
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As per the upper chest argument: this went on for quite some time in the "ESL Fitness challenge thread" back in 2004 (man, that was a great thread). Anyways, I draw your attention to this photo for proof of the "great divide"




And here is one of me from quite some time ago. I told you Demonicat, that I used to be into training. Wink



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Demonicat



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Location: Suwon

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

my captain, my captain...lookin' good!
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Freezer Burn



Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Location: Busan

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool thread,
Im 71 kgs, and I want to get to 75-76kgs I have a goal of 10 months to so, but if i can do it faster I will try. when I left China last year I wasnt working out and I dropped to 61 kgs, I used to be really small, I put on 9 kgs in six months.

I workout 4 times a week, mostly upper body i.e incline, bench, flyes as well as lat pulldown, row, hammer curls etc all the groups.

my question is, I usually lift to about 8-10 or 12 when It feels good I want to make the most of every workout, to do this do I have to lift more each time or just keep slogging away at what Im doing, changing the exercises every month.

Also with diet, I checked out bodybuilding.com for protein powders, cheap stuff but the delivery kills is there any cheaper options.

any advise you give will be appreciated
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Demonicat



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Location: Suwon

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

While consistency is good (go at the same times every week), intensity is the key. One of the key works of bodybuilding (or simply body shaping) is progressive resistance-i.e. in order to keep growing (bigger, stronger, or leaner) one needs to continually increase the workload. Concievably this could be done by increasing time spent, or by icreasing weight. In reality, increasing time spent leads to a decrease in good form (and therefore injuries and slowed growth) as well the always present spectre of overtraining. Therefore, increasing weight moved is the way to go (yes there are other highly advanced ways of intensity increasement-static strip, partial reps, forced negatives, i.e.- but they are way out of the league of a beginner).
Recognizing that one has to increase the weight, the question becomes: how? The traditional golden rule of thumb was once one could complete all reps of all sets with relative ease, then one was ready to increase weight by 5-10%. Try this out and I'm sure you'll be sucessful.

As far as bb.com goes, if all one is buying is whey protein, then your are better off visiting the import market at Namdaemun (hours are 10-6M-F) and looking around. Recently (May) I saw a 2K tub of prolab for 40.000W- which wasn't bad- just make sure to check the expiration dates which are clearly printed. If, however, anything else is needed, bb.com can end up cheaper even after shipping. With the exception of namdaemuns prolab (which is subject to availability) Korea tends to be outrageously priced (Korean made whey sold at bodybuilding shops go for 100.000-150.000 per 2K.).

One thing to make a note of: In this (what is becoming) column, I have made constant mentions of the importance of a high-protein diet. There are two VERY important things that I have failed to mention: water and multivitamins. Every day try to take in AT LEAST 4 litres of water, it aids in muscle growth, health, and fat loss. In fact, some have gone as far as to label water the miracle weight loss substance that so many people crave. My second note is to make sure and include a multivitamin. Good ones can be found at most pharmacies in Korea (Atomix seemed ok). I, personally like Animal Pak by universal nutrition (www.bodybuilding.com). The bottom line is that as peripetic teachers/dieters/bodybuilders our diets can be less than perfect- and a proper multi will help correct any defiencies.
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

one point I'd like to add to what Demonicat has said..

Freezer Burn wrote:


I workout 4 times a week, mostly upper body i.e incline, bench, flyes as well as lat pulldown, row, hammer curls etc all the groups.


If you are not training your lower body then you are really missing out. How do you expect to add massive weight when you are focusing on scrawny things like your arms instead of your legs.

Not to say that your arms are scrawny, just more so in comparasin to the lower half of your body. Far too many neglect the legs when the truth is they are massive bodies of msucles (well, not mentioning my chicken legs)
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Demonicat



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Location: Suwon

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damn! Good call, cap'n! Besides the obvious size and numerical differential of the legs to the arms (example BIceps Vs QUADriceps), working legs also has a host a hormonal trigger bonuses. Heavy leg work releases a natural flood of testosterone and growth hormone thoughout the body. This supercharges both the metabolic (fat burning) and anabolic (muscle building rates). Don't let it go! Devote one day to legs. If you need advice on how to work them, just ask.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Demonicat wrote:
I'm not so sure myth. The concept that there is no upper or lower chest kinda goes against the entire theory of modern bodybuilding. Further, if this was true how could one explain the high develkopment of the lower pectoral region in trainees who focus on flat or decline bench presses V. trainees who focus upon the upper pectoral region.


Well let's forget theory and focus on anatomical principles for a while. The major pec muscle has one point of origin. What this means in bodybuilding terms, while it is possible to focus slightly more on one PART of the muscle, is that the muscle works as a whole under any chest exercise. You may be thinking of the pec minor?

As for the theory of modern bodybuilding, if you are talking about the pros you cannot really compare genetic wonders who are on 'gear' to genetically average people who are natural.

As for the development, have you ever seen people who had a BIGGER "upper" (to use your word) chest than their "lower"? The bulk of the pectoral muscle is around the nipple area or "lower" chest (again to use your words). That is why people tend to have bigger "lower" chests. Those who have good all-around development tend to be genetically gifted and therefore ANY exercise would work for them.

Try and flex your "lower" and "upper" chests individually. Can't be done, since the pec muscle is just one muscle.
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Freezer Burn



Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Location: Busan

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ask Very Happy

I dont have chicken legs, but they are weak when I get on any machine for them, so I dont do it Razz

but always wanted to get into it.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: It's not a superiority complex when you really are superior

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Corea wrote:
As per the upper chest argument: this went on for quite some time in the "ESL Fitness challenge thread" back in 2004 (man, that was a great thread). Anyways, I draw your attention to this photo for proof of the "great divide"




]



Franco Columbo's pecs looked like that naturally. Some people have genetic freaky bodyparts while others don't. A good example is bicep peak. Some people have it, some don't. I forget who, but it was either Arnold or Sergio (3rd and 2nd Mr Olympia respectively) who had good bicep peak on one of their arms and the other arm was somewhat flat looking. Now if these could be fixed by training why did this never happen? And if Franco's pecs could be achieved by training, why did none of the other bodybuilders of that era achieve that look?

For most people, training the incline will never make much difference in their upper pecs as opposed to say the flat. Now if you are genetically gifted or on steroids then this does not apply, since the 'rules' have been dramatically changed.

I'll see if I can post some links from other natural trainers later offering their views on the subject.
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