Korean Job Discussion Forums

Anda · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: South Korea

What does the new form have written on it. It would seem that things are becoming more complex to work in Korea in EPIK with tax and now this whatever it is plus all the new stuff on a driver's lience if you want to drive here.

long-term-player · Joined: 10 Feb 2003

The lawyer told me that a was form to prove the Superintendent was the boss and that his signature was authentic and he guaranteed my position - and that the Employer should have paid to had it notarized...

Anda · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: South Korea

That's been around a while. I've talken those forms two or three times to immigration. If my school's principal changes then the new principal has had to do it anew.

Mosley · Joined: 15 Jan 2003

It seems that at least a few EPIKs in 2 provinces(up to half a dozen EPIKs) have been denied renewal of their contracts. Very ironic, coming from a programme that can't get its minimum of 200 recruits. To be very clear, I would support management at the local, provincial or national(EPIK) levels if they refused renewal(or even terminated a contract) of a contract for any EPIK WHERE CAUSE WAS SHOWN. The "cause" can refer to either incompetence or misconduct, of course.My fear, however, is that some EPIKs are being denied renewal due to subjective "personality" conflicts. Even more disturbing is evidence that suggests that some "soon-to-be-turfed" EPIKs are getting the boot due to their speaking of unpleasant truths to various bureaucrats of public education. If that's true, and I hope I'm wrong, then it means few EPIKs are safe from arbitrary dismissal at the hands of petty bureaucrats. At the very least, an EPIK denied renewal must be entitled to the following:1. A DETAILED, WRITTEN report outlining the reasons for renewal refusal. Names & signatures must be included. 2. Right of appeal, before an independent EPIK body. The body must include EPIK teacher & EPIK management representatives.
If my suggestions were to be followed, that would indicate the emergence of a "professional" EPIK Programme. I ain't holdin' me breath. If any EPIKs are out there that can offer me(and all EPIKs) insight into what's happening w/screwed -around EPIKs, let us know.

schwa · Joined: 18 Jan 2003 Location: Yap

The lawyer told me that a was form to prove the Superintendent was the boss and that his signature was authentic and he guaranteed my position - and that the Employer should have paid to had it notarized...

Hey I had to get one of those for the first time this year too (immigration required it). My supervisor took care of it, a fancy-looking document with stamps attached. 3 100-won stamps! I bought him a coffee from the vending machine & we had a laugh.

schwa · Joined: 18 Jan 2003 Location: Yap

Mosley, if you were a boss, how would you feel about rehiring someone who was persistently thorny? There are channels for constructive criticism. I have little sympathy for those that dont get it.

adventureman · Joined: 18 Feb 2003

Schwa,

Besides this forum, what are these outlets that you speak of?

At least they were allowed to finish out the year...

Anda · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: South Korea

This has always been the go with EPIK. It is not really EPIK but how things happen within the Public School system here. You have to fit in at your schools. Of recent some EPIK supervisors have listened to EPIKS that have had trouble fitting in at a particular school and arranged a move. Moving but once you have made enemies with teachers at one school is not a lot of good as your enemies will blacken your name before you get to start at the new location.

It is better to sort out the problems where you're at if it is at all possible. It might sound strange but those of us that say they can't teach and insist on being a support teacher being under the control of their Korean co-teacher last better than good foreign teachers that insist on teaching using a different teaching approach to English teaching than the Korean teachers here use.

Now the EPIK contract used to state that we were employed to assist the Korean teacher and that we weren't employed to change how English gets taught here.

The other thing is that we are supposed to take all problems to our assigned main Korean co-teacher. The co-teacher then goes up the ladder if they think it is a fair complaint / request and needs to be looked at. This is the system also for Korean teachers so we are being treated the same as the teachers we work with. Going beyond your co-teacher is a no, no except for your local EPIK supervisor. One call to your EPIK supervisor should be all that is made on a problem unless he tells you to make futher contact. Telling anybody that they must do something for you won't get you far here. Going beyond your co-teacher or EPIK supervisor is a strict no, no. Sometimes however your school's vice principal or principal will help you provided they like you.

Anyway for the record I wasn't re-employed at the end of my second contract with EPIK. I re-employed with EPIK and had problems and my EPIK supervisor arranged a move but I left as I thought that I had been offered a better job so I left. Now I have been back working at a new school for eighteen months. I've had some problems but have managed to get them sorted out and my school is happy with me. So please don't go calling me a bum licker as I'm not. But I've had to learn to fit in by trail and error. Korea is not the West and never will be so it's useless trying to make it comform to what we expect. "When in Rome do as the Romans do" still holds true.

adventureman · Joined: 18 Feb 2003

CanEducator · Joined: 27 Apr 2003

Adventureman- Anda's assessment of how EPIK teachers fit in to individual schools is very accurate. He is giving information that new EPIKs would be better off knowing. Nobody is saying it is ideal, it is just reality.
Your questions are also relevant and right on the money. There is luck involved in just getting a good school with a nice staff, and a good responsible co-teacher.
For things that come up that you need help with, be diplomatic and kind about it, and low-key. That will get you the best results. In general.
Don't lose heart, because there are lots of nice people, dedicated teachers, in the Korean public schools. Look for the good.

Mody Ba · Joined: 22 May 2003

I agree with Mosley.And I do not care if anyone calls us the "Mo-Mo Twins".So what?
Schwa,what "constructive channels"(for employee grievances) did you have in mind?
Yes,some EPIKs have caused undue problems,and SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN HIRED IN THE FIRST PLACE.Of course,that goes back to EPIK's inadequate screening process. Then.once they have found themselves saddled with some people who are losers,they act like it was not EPIK's fault in the first place.
However,some people are good teachers who have legitimate complaints.Why should they not be able to voice their complaints?Channels?What channels? Maybe in SOME provinces....but not in all provinces.Again,that glaring lack of standardization... Rolling Eyes

Anda · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: South Korea

Going outside the guidelines is not on for Korean teachers or EPIK teachers. You might acheive some short term goal but at the expense of not being recontracted with. Anyway since when has it been that one can demand this and that back home in a job and expect to get it. I usually get well paid when I work back home but by proving that I can work harder than my compertition but that is when I work for a place owned by one person not a goverment position.

I've worked plenty of goverment positions back home and one goes up the ladder with years of service or gets started into a high position due to referances. Here and back home one generally climbs the ladder through contacts within the goverment. So why expect it to be different here. Try bringing in a a private legal system against a goverment department at where you work back home and see where it gets you.

If you work for the goverment back home then conditions vary from state to state etc the same as here. Also wages vary from state to state as well. Anyway you are not back home you are here.

Mody Ba · Joined: 22 May 2003

Anda,Anda,ANDA!!!! Smile

Thanks SO much for telling all of us "you are here,not back home!!!) Laughing

Now,it is all becoming clear ,Anda! Laughing

Thanks,buddy,for the clarification! Laughing

Next,I betcha Anda is going to haul out that old "If you don't like it, JUST LEAVE!" thing the newbies are so fond of mouthing...but ANDA,man you are NOT a newbie!
It is NOT the same as the US. In the US(probably Canada and England too),they BETTER pay you on time and follow their responsibilities as outlined in the contract,or you have immediate legal recourse.
I would really expect more of Anda than the old cultural relativism'When in Rome(!!!),do as the Romans do!!!"
Maybe you have just been here too long ,Anda... Rolling Eyes

Anda · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: South Korea

Dear, dear sweet Mody Ba, if the bull at the gate thing doesn't work as it doesn't then one has to learn a different way to get things done. You lot have learnt how to not get rehired. Great skill I must say.

I've got a 15 hour work week and I'm off for all the summer holidays. Perhaps I've learnt a thing or two that you haven't Dear Mody Ba!

adventureman · Joined: 18 Feb 2003