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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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 Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2003 2:31 am Post subject: Re: The conflicting laws? |
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| humanuspneumos wrote: |
TheUrbanMyth- Actually- after reading the Labor Board laws and other legal junk- I was exposed more than once to the concept that people who work are to be payed whether or not they are legal. The reason this law was put in place- in part- was to protect all workers from getting invitations into the country to only discover that they wouldn't get paid. Also, it discourages unscrupulous managers to think they can get-away with easy/free labor.
Another group is saying- "You worked illegally- we will fine you- you go out." If it was really all that bad then wouldn't you think the Labor Laws would deny all pay? |
But then where would Immigration get the money to fine the person for working illegally?  Sure they encourage people who are working illegally to come forwards and claim their money...it's easier than hunting them down. You may get your money, but you'll likely lose it all in fines, not to mentioned being deported and banned for 2 years or so. |
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Mankind
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2003 4:38 am Post subject: |
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humanuspneumos is right. You can go to the labour board even if you have no visa!
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| Sure they encourage people who are working illegally to come forwards and claim their money...it's easier than hunting them down. You may get your money, but you'll likely lose it all in fines, not to mentioned being deported and banned for 2 years or so. |
God, why do you people post if you don't know what the hell you're talking about??????
The labour board and immigration are seperate bodies! They do not exchange information. Getting money that is owed to you has nothing to do with your Visa, it has to do with your contract and Korean law.
How do I know this? My wife works for the labour board. I likely know as much about Korean labour law as any Waegook in Korea (since it's common dinner time conversation)
Urban, it seems like you have a big chip on your shoulder about illegal work. Tough ****. People like you are the biggest problem in Korea. You come on the board with some dumbass personal agenda and spread miss information in some pathetic attempt to get noticed.
People if you don't know what you're talking about, do the teachers of Korea a favour and shut-up. Spreading misinformation doesn't help anybody! And keep you personal little pet-peevse to yourself.
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2003 5:07 am Post subject: |
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So if an illegal teacher went to the labour board and complained you don't think Immigration would hear about it? It's their business to know this stuff. Funny how every time I post something, you claim you know someone somewhere who says the opposite. It's also funny how Lonely Planet says pretty much the same thing I have been saying. It's also funny since I know quite a few illegal teachers who went to the Labour board and were nailed by Immigration.
I happen to know this since I have a girlfriend who's brother works for Immigration.
Anyway since you work illegally, it would appear like you have an interest in stating what you did in your last post. [/i] |
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Mankind
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2003 6:02 am Post subject: |
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| It's also funny since I know quite a few illegal teachers who went to the Labour board and were nailed by Immigration. |
Can't be. You would talk with lowly dregs like that? Slumming I guess.
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| also funny how Lonely Planet says pretty much the same thing I have been saying |
Wow  Lonely Planet you say? We all know that is the most accuate overseas teaching guide in print. No wait, it's a travel guide you twit! Are you seriously basing your knowledge of Korean labour law on that? God I knew your info was a bunch of crap, but man. What a source. What did you use for your Masters? Captian America vs The Red Skull (and that is how the West defeated the Nazis).
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| ...to know this since I have a girlfriend who's brother works for Immigration |
Wow again. Besides my wife (who works at the labor board), my sister's, husband's, father's, cousin works at immigration. And he says your wrong too.
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| So if an illegal teacher went to the labour board and complained you don't think Immigration would hear about it? It's their business to know this stuff |
They can try. But no I don't think they'll find out about it, unless someone is not doing their job properly. Since my wife helped 2 people today with this very problem (one wasn't a teacher). You know what? No report to immigration.
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| Anyway since you work illegally, it would appear like you have an interest in stating what you did in your last post. |
Actually. I don't care whether or not people teach privates. If they teach less, it's actually better for me. I simply want people to know the truth about things. Not just some Myth.
As for the reason as to why I posted after your posts. Yours are usually full of garbage, misinformation and personal agendas. And I don't think its fair to freak out the new people here, with your kinda crap. Plus in the long run it saves me from reposting the same info over and over. Cause if people know the truth, the repeat questions, will stop coming up.
HAND  |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2003 5:05 am Post subject: |
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Brave Mankind. What a polished and well-thought out post. It clearly shows what kind of professional you are.  So tell me something. Is the Labour board aware that these teachers are illegal? If so, what is a government agency doing, concealing that kind of illegal behaviour from another government agency whose job it is to prevent such behaviour?
Also if it were so easy, what is to stop some teachers from claiming that they haven't been paid and suing the boss for extra money? If they get paid in cash (which most illegal teachers would be likely to be paid in) it would be hard to prove he'd paid them. Does the Labour board just take the foreigner's word or does s/he have to provide some proof? If the boss refuses to pay, does the labour board have the power to claim the wages, or do they have to go to court? If the teacher was working illegally I doubt he'd want to do that, as that would quite likely attract Immigration's attention. Does the foreigner also have to get a lawyer?
Also if it were so easy to collect, then why does Korea have such a bad reputation for ripping off even LEGAL foreigners? I guess we should just all illegally teach, because hey, if the boss doesn't pay we can just go to the labour board and get the money that way. You do illegal teachers a big disservice when you claim it's easy.
If the only way you can be a success is to work illegally then well, I guess you don't have a choice. But I prefer being a success working legally. It's possible...but you need to have guts, smarts and a hard work ethic. Two jobs require a lot of hours, but they're very well paying...and you don't have to worry about a pissed-off client, cancelled classes, or immigration. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2003 5:11 am Post subject: |
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| And do you want to drop the personal attacks BTW? They're frowned on upon this board, and shooting the messenger because you don't like the message just loses you credibility. |
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Mankind
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2003 8:33 am Post subject: |
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| Is the Labour board aware that these teachers are illegal |
Yes
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| If so, what is a government agency doing, concealing that kind of illegal behaviour from another government agency |
called transperancy, helps prevent corruption.
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| Does the Labour board just take the foreigner's word or does s/he have to provide some proof |
Need some time of agreement, witnesses, contracts, bank statements. Many privates aren't paid in cash.
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| If the boss refuses to pay, does the labour board have the power to claim the wages, or do they have to go to court |
The board can claim lost wages under some situation (size of the company and inc. play a role). If they can't they take you through the basic steps of civil action (up to 20 million).
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| If the teacher was working illegally I doubt he'd want to do that, as that would quite likely attract Immigration's attention. |
Actually its very safe. Employers know that they lose the cases as a rule, and that if they rat out the teacher, they end up with a 10 million fine on top of suing damages.
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| then why does Korea have such a bad reputation for ripping off even LEGAL foreigners |
Because dumb-ass know nothings post incorrect info all the time (do you know anyone like that?). Hogwan owners also scare newbies into being afraid of the labour board, and thus many just never try to get whats owed.
Every time you type, you look like a bigger fool. You were the big mister know it all, and here you ask a hundred simple questions that any knowlegdable person should know.
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| What a polished and well-thought out post. It clearly shows what kind of professional you are. |
Yes one who uses real sources and doesn't blow smoke up peoples a$$e$ so he can try to feel like a big shot. I've posted a true list of pros and cons before about privates. I don't lie or suger coat, just the facts. And no offence but I've been here more than twice as long as you, am married to a local, and have probably forgot more about Korea than you know.
HAND
Last edited by Mankind on Tue Aug 12, 2003 7:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2003 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Mankind wrote: |
| Every time you type, you look like a bigger fool. You were the big mister know it all, and here you ask a hundred simple questions that any knowlegdable person should know. |
Now you're just going to just make him cry. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:01 am Post subject: |
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| Mankind wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Is the Labour board aware that these teachers are illegal |
Yes
| Quote: |
| If so, what is a government agency doing, concealing that kind of illegal behaviour from another government agency |
called transperancy, helps prevent corruption.
| Quote: |
| Does the Labour board just take the foreigner's word or does s/he have to provide some proof |
Need some time of agreement, witnesses, contracts, bank statements. Many privates aren't paid in cash.
| Quote: |
| If the boss refuses to pay, does the labour board have the power to claim the wages, or do they have to go to court |
The board can claim lost wages under some situation (size of the company and inc. play a role). If they can't they take you through the basic steps of civil action (up to 20 million).
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| If the teacher was working illegally I doubt he'd want to do that, as that would quite likely attract Immigration's attention. |
Actually its very safe. Employers know that they lose the cases as a rule, and that if they rat out the teacher, they end up with a 10 million fine on top of suing damages.
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| then why does Korea have such a bad reputation for ripping off even LEGAL foreigners |
Because dumb-ass know nothings post incorrect info all the time (do you know anyone like that?). Hogwan owners also scare newbies into being afraid of the labour board, and thus many just never try to get whats owed.
Every time you type, you look like a bigger fool. You were the big mister know it all, and here you ask a hundred simple questions that any knowlegdable person should know.
| Quote: |
| What a polished and well-thought out post. It clearly shows what kind of professional you are. |
Yes one who uses real sources and doesn't blow smoke up peoples a$$e$ so he can try to feel like a big shot. I've posted a true list of pros and cons before about privates. I don't lie or suger coat, just the facts. And no offence but I've been here more than twice as long as you, am married to a local, and have probably forgot more about Korea than you know.
HAND |
I asked the simple questions because I wanted to know if you knew anything about the law or were just talking nonsense as usual. Glad to see you actually know something. I was starting to fear it was a lost cause. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| Gord wrote: |
| Mankind wrote: |
| Every time you type, you look like a bigger fool. You were the big mister know it all, and here you ask a hundred simple questions that any knowlegdable person should know. |
Now you're just going to just make him cry. |
What's the matter Gord? You got beaten on the other debate so now you are going to post here looking for allies? I noticed that you haven't refuted any of my claims that you made stuff up. Remember quotes are used when you are referring to another person's words. Not when you make them up yourself and try to apply them to another person.
Don't worry there's no charge for this free English lesson. I'll be happy to give you another anytime. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:06 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Mankind
Every time you type, you look like a bigger fool.
[)[/quote]
Oh the irony. The pot calling the kettle black. |
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SeoulShaun
Joined: 10 Jul 2003
Location: Seoul, Korea
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:28 am Post subject: |
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| It is a very touchy subject......I truly believe that you take your life and put it in someone else's hands if you choose to work illegally in Korea. |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2003 6:10 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| What's the matter Gord? You got beaten on the other debate so now you are going to post here looking for allies? I noticed that you haven't refuted any of my claims that you made stuff up. |
I've been in and out the last couple days during short persiods of time. Fear not, I'll get back to replying to it in short order.
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Remember quotes are used when you are referring to another person's words. Not when you make them up yourself and try to apply them to another person.
Don't worry there's no charge for this free English lesson. I'll be happy to give you another anytime. |
Where the hell did that tangent come from? You've gone from creating facts and imaginary histories to whipping up new conversation threads on the fly. Seriously, what the hell is up with that? |
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waterbaby
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Location: Baking Gord a Cheescake pie
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2003 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Urban Myth, Gord, Mankind ... Can we please keep it nice and on topic? We don't want to see this baby locked. Stick to the topic please... |
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Len8
Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Location: Kyungju
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| Posted: Thu Aug 14, 2003 4:09 am Post subject: |
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I was in a hogwon for a short time, and I found out later that one of the teachers had a fake degree. The employment agency gave her the fake degree, and had the hogwan paye for her to come to Korea. I had no problem with that, because she was tough, and very capable. A lot more capable than most English teachers I've met. You gotta give somebody like that credit, because anyone who has the balls to do that and shine at the same time is a real winner.
Last edited by Len8 on Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:32 am; edited 2 times in total |
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