Korean Job Discussion Forums

jh · Joined: 04 Jul 2003 Location: Seoul

Okay. a couple of people got their backs up.

Corporal, I ask you, where was your empathy when you were critical of the Korean parent, voicing out and implying that she was a bad parent?

How can you or anyone be so confident, be such an uber-mom, as to be so vocally critical of another parent? Do you think you are right and that is all there is to it? I used to think this, til I became a parent. Now I am constantly second guessing myself. This is one job that is too important to screw up.

I did not mean to imply that only a parent can be qualified to voice an opinion or make a comment. Only that by becoming one, you gain an insight through the experience that can never be rivaled by the uninitiated regardless of intelligence, imagination and empathy. And being so, one would at least become hesitant in attacking another parent.

If parenthood is an exact science, why are there so many different views?

So, let me pose this one. How can we tell if we are good or bad parents? By looking at our kids grown up? By what criteria are we judging ourselves to be good parents, bad parents?

It seems to me that we are very quick to be negative of our hosts. You had stated that your statement would probably invite everyone to defend Korean moms. Well, you're right, but not everyone.

I'm defending them.

BTW, you have an adorable baby. Good luck being a parent, but of course you don't need it.

makushi · Joined: 08 Jun 2003

Corporal · Joined: 25 Jan 2003

Amen makushi.

I tried to post a response to jh earlier, but my computer fried it.

Suffice to say, I don't think I'm a perfect parent nor do I think ALL Korean parents are horrible.

All I know is, I will not let my daughter (when she's old enough to walk) out of the apartment to run around and play unattended, and then go outside and scream her name for half an hour EVERY DAY, having no clue where she is. Who knows what kind of pervs are out there? Just because Koreans don't talk about them, doesn't mean they don't exist.

Nor will I enroll her in 50 different hagwons just so I can look better than the other mothers on the block.

And there are quite a few other "Korean" parenting practices I will not engage in, but I need coffee and I'm too tired to go into it all right now.

Velvet Sea · Joined: 09 Jun 2003

I once did a short paper in my Child Development Course at uni about Asian parenting styles and it often showed that they can not be truly classified into Authoritive, Authoritarian, Indulgent, or Neglectful (North American Classification). That was some time ago so there definitely could be more advanced studies since then.

Circus Monkey Wrote:

jh · Joined: 04 Jul 2003 Location: Seoul

makushi · Joined: 08 Jun 2003

the_beaver · Joined: 15 Jan 2003

makushi · Joined: 08 Jun 2003

the_beaver · Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Wombat · Joined: 28 May 2003 Location: slutville

This is just an experience I've had, and I'm not citing it to condemn an entire nation of mums and dads.

At the bath house once, as I soaked in a big granite hot tub (full of above-averagely hot water), I noticed a 2 year old (or thereabouts) girl perched on the edge. I suppose I was dizzy from the heat of the water, so it didn't click instantly, as it should have, that this was not a good idea. Anyhow, she toppled into the water a few minutes later and sunk like a stone to the bottom of the crazy-hot water, smashing her lip on the granite edge of the bench along the way.

Luckily, I wasn't so drowsy as not to react, and leapt up and plunged myself under the water to collect the still-at-the-bottom infant. When I hauled her up to the surface, she was bleeding from the lip and sobbing hysterically, in between truly frightening fits of watery coughing. As I clapped her on the back to help her cough the water out, I looked around frantically for a parent - none were around, it seemed. An old woman regarded me casually from across the room. I didn't have anything to stop the copious blood from the little girl's split lip, so, carrying her, I sprinted to my locker to get a clean towel. The poor little thing was sobbing and shrieking, bleeding and coughing.

I managed to clean her lip up; about 3-5 minutes had passed in total; finally, some woman sauntered out of the sauna room, glared at me angrily and said something rude in Korean, before snatching her daughter out of my arms. Of course, I lacked the powers of language to tell her that I hadn't split the girl's lip, etc etc.

The bathhouse was almost empty; what would've happened if I hadn't been in that tub? How long would that little girl have stayed at the bottom of that hot tub? I'm not a mum yet, but I know enough about toddlers to understand that leaving them completely unattended in a virtually empty place full of deep pools of boiling-hot water is a bad idea. They're not like Western kids either, in that most of them have no experience with water; they usually don't know how to swim.

I was shaken, to say the least.

Wombat

mokpochica · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Location: Ann Arbor, MI

Wombat--
My friend had a similar experience to yours (in Korea), except that hers was with a child narrowly missed being hit by a car, falling and hurting herself, and then the mother coming angrily up about 10 minutes later as if my friend had inflicted this upon the child. I wonder if the angry demeanor comes from being embarassed...?

As for myself, I once helped a 4 year-old child who had gotten lost/separated from her mom downtown. I waited about 5 minutes, watching her crying and shrieking by herself before I decided that no one else was going to help her and I should do what I could with my minimal Korean skills. Situations like that do make me question the parenting skills of those involved. Of course I know that not all Korean parents let their kids get into these kinds of situations. However, it does seem that kids are given more leeway here to do as they wish, even when it sometimes can result in dangerous situations.

As to the original question, I know that my household will have a bit of both N. American parenting styles and Korean since I'm planning on marrying a Korean. Some things that have rubbed off a little bit on me here are the more relaxed attitude toward not having a strict bedtime every night (I was brought up an 8 PM every night kid) and not hovering over the kid so much (but still keeping a close eye on them). As for respecting and loving parents/elders, I think that it's really the same in N. America and Korea. This respect and love may be shown in different ways, but I have no short supply of respect and love for my N. American parents and grandparents, even though I don't show it by bowing to them. Of course, I want my (future) children to show the respect to their grandmas and grandpas in culturally appropriate ways.

As for the hagwon issue, I know a lot of parents nowadays in N. America that are overscheduling their kids' free time as well. They may not go to hagwons per se, but they often have a different extra-curricular or play date to go to every night. I want my kids to have time for unscheduled activities (wherever we live), but see no harm in hagwons/extra-currics in moderation.

makushi · Joined: 08 Jun 2003

the_beaver · Joined: 15 Jan 2003

makushi · Joined: 08 Jun 2003

Wombat's experience reminds of a time I was at a beach in Taiwan and the lifeguards were having too much fun on their jetski to notice that some kids were stranded a small sandbar as the tide was coming in.

I saw one kid that was waving his hands wildly with water up to his mouth and trying to scream. I swam out got him and brought him back.

Then a litte girl comes over and starts crying and pointing out to another section of the sandbar and I see three more kids in the same situation. Turns out it is actually worse because they are bigger and the water is getting higher.

I know there is no way I can help them all by myself. They'd definitely drown me. So I run over to a lady who is playing with an inflatible tube, snatch it and swim with out to the sandbar. By the time I get there the water is up to my mouth level and the kids just jump on me and the inflatible.

It was craziness as all three, in their panic, kept trying to climb to the top of the inflatible and, in the process, pushing the others down.

I tried to pull them back to the beach but it was like swimming with a 200lb weight behind me.

At one point, one of the kids climbs up just high enough to get level with my face and pukes. Nice!

Anway, I finally make it to the beach and collapse.

The lady who owned the inflatible shows up and starts yelling at me for taking her inflatible without asking! (Damn foreign devils!)

As I proceed to puke the sound of the lifeguards whizzing around on their jet skis is distinctly audible.

Another Asian moment brought to you by Makushi....