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Lee Jun Ki declares Philippines to me moron-filled *beep*
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doggyji



Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Location: Toronto - Hamilton - Vineland - St. Catherines

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DP sorry.
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rabbitsaregood



Joined: 03 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

babtangee wrote:
rabbitsaregood wrote:


DENG!!

it's cos it's not defamatory to any of those people.


Claiming that Eminem wrote this is not defamatory?

Quote:
"I was at the Grammys and Elton John gave me a hug / So I got out my pliers and ripped his little faggot dick off with a tug / Shoved it down the throats of Britney, then Christina A. / Probably gave both of the bitches AIDS."


If the Yangpa article is defamatory, why isn't that?


You are right, of course. It's not defamatory. Because the writers never intended for the reader to believe it were true.


Writers intention is inadmissable. readers understanding is the only thing that counts, even if you can't prove or show that somebody understood it to be true, as long as somebody plausibly did it's good enough for libel (as long as its defamatory)

Anyway, it's not defamatory to Eminem because he has said similar stuff and worse in the past. He has openly said that it's ok to say this kind of thing, so writing that he did would not injure his reputation in any way.

It's not libellous to Elton John for similar reasons.

Britters and Chrissy might have a stronger case in theory, but in practice its a bit dubious. For one thing if Eminem actually had said this a newspaper would be justified in reporting on it. So a fake newspaper writing it probably would be too, especially since the article implies the sensational dubiousness of the claims.

Secondly claiming that your reputation has been damaged because a paper said that someone else said something about you, especially when the newspaper is a satirical imitation, and all the people concerned are well known, is nebulous. In fact claiming that your reputation has been damaged because eminem actually said something about you might be viewed skeptically anyway.

The Yangpa article deliberately makes a guy out to be racist, which is damage to his reputation automatically. Second, people demonstrably believe it. Third it has no basis (I know of) in truth. That's pretty much all you need for libel.
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Qinella



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will be truly disappointed if you take down the article, or break the facade of seriousness you referred to. Let's compare this to the newspaper that printed those cartoons that got the Muslims all in a twist last year. Should they have censored themselves, then, because some people are going to respond like fucking mindless idiots? Of course not.

If you didn't think the article was funny, fine. But to claim it is libelous reveals ignorance of that word's definition, suggesting that Billy b. kowtow to stupidass netizens is beyond reprehensible, and claiming that the imaginary comments are racist is just mindnumbingly retarded. I'm really shocked at how stupid some of you are.
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babtangee



Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Location: OMG! Charlie has me surrounded!

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rabbitsaregood wrote:


Writers intention is inadmissable. readers understanding is the only thing that counts, even if you can't prove or show that somebody understood it to be true, as long as somebody plausibly did it's good enough for libel (as long as its defamatory)


I assume the Koreans would be more likely to operate under US law, not the UK? In which case you'd be wrong:

Quote:
There are exceptions to defamation rules for politicians and celebrities and, to a limited extent, for people who have become the subjects of a public controversy. These people, because they are in the public eye, are expected to have tougher skins and can only be defamed if it is proven that the false statements were made with actual malice and a reckless disregard for the truth --

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter12/12-a.html

Writers intention is everything. The Yangpa's Lee Jung-ki article did not make "false statements ... with actual malice". It was intended as a joke. Though it was probably a poor one, it did not intend to defame the guy, as it did not intend for people to believe it. Do you really think the fictitious movie title at the begining of the article isn't enough to prove this in a court of US law? What about the fact that every other article on the website is fictitious? There's no way Lee Jung-ki is getting a red cent in a US court.

Now, if he were to sue in the UK, well then it would be a different matter:

Quote:
"It is easier for US-based celebrities to sue for defamation in the English courts than in their own country, as our libel laws are much more favourable to claimants. For instance, in the UK you do not have to prove malice, as you do in America. Also, the right to freedom of expression is enshrined in the US constitution under the First Amendment, whereas here the right is more evenly balanced with the individual's right to their reputation..."

http://www.sweetandmaxwell.co.uk/pressroom/2006/270706.html

God Bless America.


Last edited by babtangee on Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gang ah jee



Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: city of paper

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JJK1 wrote:
flotsam wrote:
Word has even reached NYC. The Filipino students at NYU, The New School, Columbia, Hunter, and Pace universities are holding a forum on how to contain the threat called “Lee, Jun-Gi, Hallyu and You: Diverse Perspectives on Gender Confusion, Cultural Imperialism, the Inner City and Globalization in Feminist Meta-Discourse.”

Ha!

Anyway billybrobby, I think you're going to have to admit that satire, and indeed any humour, is heavily dependent on context. On the internet however, you can't hope to control the context in which people view things.

Reminds me of a problem my school student newspaper had early this year:

wikipedia wrote:
In April 2006, Salient published a short piece which put "Chinese", along with animals like poisonous snakes and penguins, in a list of "Top five species we should be wary of". The supposed "joke" upset the Chinese community and caused huge protests from both Chinese students and the Chinese Embassy. Accused of being blatantly racist, editor James Robinson apologised, saying "It was a ridiculous jab that was honestly so stupid I didn't even think twice about it," However, he argued people who were offended had misinterpreted it , "We put 'the Chinese' between 'penguins' and 'very poisonous snakes' on the list, and people somehow took it seriously." He also defended his right to publish it, saying "It's not hate speech or inciting violence against the Chinese race. It would be a dangerous precedent to come out and say, 'Sorry, we were totally out of our minds to print such a thing'."

While the editor was right to defend satire, a printed magazine (or established website) is a relatively stable context. A blog is just a random link that just serves to contribute to racial tensions amongst asians.

There's no shame in addressing the fourth wall if it will calm things down and 'increase the peace, dude'.
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mithridates



Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just write another post from Lee Jun Ki:

Quote:
Hi Yangpa readers this is Lee Jun Ki. I just hacked into the Yangpa's top-secret server database and security is going to be on me any second, I can hear them coming down the hall. All I want to say is this. Don't believe the Yangpa! I don't even know what the word bonerhound means for Christ's sakes...here come the guards! I'm locking this post so it'll never get deleted. Remember me Philippines, drink pomegranate juice to be prett
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indiercj



Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, what's up with all those grown up whity expats acting like twenty something Korean anti-Lee Jun-Gi fans lately? Laughing
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rabbitsaregood



Joined: 03 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

babtangee wrote:
rabbitsaregood wrote:


Writers intention is inadmissable. readers understanding is the only thing that counts, even if you can't prove or show that somebody understood it to be true, as long as somebody plausibly did it's good enough for libel (as long as its defamatory)


I assume the Koreans would be more likely to operate under US law, not the UK? In which case you'd be wrong:

Quote:
There are exceptions to defamation rules for politicians and celebrities and, to a limited extent, for people who have become the subjects of a public controversy. These people, because they are in the public eye, are expected to have tougher skins and can only be defamed if it is proven that the false statements were made with actual malice and a reckless disregard for the truth --

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter12/12-a.html

Writers intention is everything. The Yangpa's Lee Jung-ki article did not make "false statements ... with actual malice". It was intended as a joke. Though it was probably a poor one, it did not intend to defame the guy, as it did not intend for people to believe it. Do you really think the fictitious movie title at the begining of the article isn't enough to prove this in a court of US law? What about the fact that every other article on the website is fictitious? There's no way Lee Jung-ki is getting a red cent in a US court.

Now, if he were to sue in the UK, well then it would be a different matter:

Quote:
"It is easier for US-based celebrities to sue for defamation in the English courts than in their own country, as our libel laws are much more favourable to claimants. For instance, in the UK you do not have to prove malice, as you do in America. Also, the right to freedom of expression is enshrined in the US constitution under the First Amendment, whereas here the right is more evenly balanced with the individual's right to their reputation..."

http://www.sweetandmaxwell.co.uk/pressroom/2006/270706.html

God Bless America.


gp

And yes, they would use America's system if they used anyone elses. Although malice is one of those words which has a broad definition. I'm sure if you printed this about an American Movie star or politician they would be able to sue, because to say that e.g. John Kerry made racist comments is really quite injurious. Anyway, that's a bit off topic.

I don't really buy the whole thing with it being a satirical website on which everything else is false, and so nobody would believe it. A lot of people DO believe it. There is no requirement with the way the internet works to look at anything else on a website, even the front page. I didn't just now, I just clicked on your link.
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Woland



Joined: 10 May 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JJK1 wrote:
It doesn't matter if the article is fake or not, how are random people stumbling on to the article supposed to realize its fake? Its just making Koreans in general look bad and bringing out a lot of hostility between both sides.

read this comment:

Quote:

idealjetsam Says:
October 14th, 2006 at 9:27 pm

Word has even reached NYC. The Filipino students at NYU, The New School, Columbia, Hunter, and Pace universities are holding a forum on how to contain the threat called “Lee, Jun-Gi, Hallyu and You: Diverse Perspectives on Gender Confusion, Cultural Imperialism, the Inner City and Globalization in Feminist Meta-Discourse.”



I think you should atleast write at the end of the article that its not true so these morons can calm down


If you are in on the joke, too, this is very clever. If not, read it again.
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jaganath69



Joined: 17 Jul 2003

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good God, do I take it that because of a few over-sensitive souls on the WWW that this article is attracting condemnation? If so, those folks need to step into the hall of mirrors and take a damn good look at themselves.
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shevek



Joined: 29 Jul 2003

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Yangpa is an awesome site.
At this point the comments section on that particular article is actually funnier than the article itself.
It is astounding the level of hypersensitve little crybabies that the internet attracts. I guess these days Oprah is showing re-runs or something. God god, it's friggin cyberspace. On an average day if I can get though a 30 minute session without stumbling upon some woman having sex with a dog I count myself lucky. This pales in comparison.
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flotsam



Joined: 28 Mar 2006

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Woland wrote:
JJK1 wrote:
It doesn't matter if the article is fake or not, how are random people stumbling on to the article supposed to realize its fake? Its just making Koreans in general look bad and bringing out a lot of hostility between both sides.

read this comment:

Quote:

idealjetsam Says:
October 14th, 2006 at 9:27 pm

Word has even reached NYC. The Filipino students at NYU, The New School, Columbia, Hunter, and Pace universities are holding a forum on how to contain the threat called “Lee, Jun-Gi, Hallyu and You: Diverse Perspectives on Gender Confusion, Cultural Imperialism, the Inner City and Globalization in Feminist Meta-Discourse.”



I think you should atleast write at the end of the article that its not true so these morons can calm down


If you are in on the joke, too, this is very clever. If not, read it again.


That idealjetsam guy is not to be trusted. He used to post here under that name until Dave took a FREAKIN' month to change his email address. I don't what name he posts under now. Probably gang ah jee.
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The King of Kwangju



Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Location: New York City

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billyrobby, let me start off by saying I think your Yangpa site is hilarious. I read it all the time and literally LOL at most of the articles.

That article is not the best on the site, and only makes sense in the context of the original post. I got it the first time, and no, it's not really clever, but making cruel fun of idiots has its own charm.

billybrobby wrote:
I'm not sure what I should do with it. Pull it down? Clean up the comments? Let it die out? I hesitate to pull it because I've been aiming to make stuff that was funny and merciless and would not pander to anybody's prejudices and would not hold anybody's hand and pat them on the head and say, "oh it's just a joke." People have to think for themselves. For me to break the facade of seriousness and let everybody in on the joke wouldn't be right.

Here's some advice from someone who has been involved with some VERY controversial sites:

The comments always reveal more about the audience than they do about you. If you understand that, then there's no decision to be made. Just let it run its course and die out.

Lesser material is getting the attention, but run any site long enough and you'll see that it happens more often than not. Sweat over something and see it die in a day. Throw something out there when you're in a hurry and see it make Boing Boing. That's the internet.

Now, there are some racist comments on there, and I can see why that might bother you. Your site is a forum for this garbage. Of course, this is the audience's prejudices, not yours. And by deleting them, you aren't changing anyone's mind, you're just making yourself feel a little better.

But leaving it up reveals a lot more than taking it down.

Good luck and have fun, BR.
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Troll_Bait



Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: [T]eaching experience doesn't matter much. -Lee Young-chan (pictured)

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a potential "out." Write another phoney Lee Jung-ki story, one in which he tearfully says that he's sorry, grovels for the Filipinas to please accept his apology, and blames the whole unfortunate incident on the intoxicating effects of pomegranite juice.
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Zoidberg



Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Location: Somewhere too hot for my delicate marine constitution

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

flotsam wrote:
Woland wrote:
JJK1 wrote:
It doesn't matter if the article is fake or not, how are random people stumbling on to the article supposed to realize its fake? Its just making Koreans in general look bad and bringing out a lot of hostility between both sides.

read this comment:

Quote:

idealjetsam Says:
October 14th, 2006 at 9:27 pm

Word has even reached NYC. The Filipino students at NYU, The New School, Columbia, Hunter, and Pace universities are holding a forum on how to contain the threat called “Lee, Jun-Gi, Hallyu and You: Diverse Perspectives on Gender Confusion, Cultural Imperialism, the Inner City and Globalization in Feminist Meta-Discourse.”



I think you should atleast write at the end of the article that its not true so these morons can calm down


If you are in on the joke, too, this is very clever. If not, read it again.


That idealjetsam guy is not to be trusted. He used to post here under that name until Dave took a FREAKIN' month to change his email address. I don't what name he posts under now. Probably gang ah jee.


Laughing Laughing Laughing
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