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The King of Kwangju
Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Location: New York City
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 Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, so now I see the new follow-up which I assume you posted to diffuse the tension.
As a fan I have to say that it's on the lame side.
As a reader I have to say that if they don't get the joke so far, that post isn't going to clear it up for them.
Those comments are hilarious. You wanted to stir it up, mate. It's stirred! |
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billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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What? lame side? that's pure comedy gold! i defy you not to chortle at it!
...chortle, damn you! |
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babtangee
Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Location: OMG! Charlie has me surrounded!
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
i defy you not to chortle at it!
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You got me. I couldn't help myself. It was great. |
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casey's moon
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: Daejeon
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
What? lame side? that's pure comedy gold! i defy you not to chortle at it!
...chortle, damn you! |
I chortled.  |
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kermo
Joined: 01 Sep 2004
Location: Eating eggs, with a comb, out of a shoe.
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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| sock wrote: |
PS Alice, you're so hot, will you go out with me??? |
I have to agree. I'm pretty sure if you bought her a new (acid-washed) denim jacket, she'd be yours for the taking. |
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The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 12:31 am Post subject: |
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Some people bait the Nigerian scammers for fun. Trolling these people, however, is far more interesting.
| rabbitsaregood wrote: |
| Pull it with an explanation and an apology. It's really quite offensive to a lot of people regardless of your intentions or how you think it should be read. People will read it how they see fit and your explanation that people have to think for themselves is pretty scant. |
No, if they could understand written English, they would not have been offended. Again, as babtangee pointed out, look at the name of the movie in the original post. It was a giant, flashing, "THIS IS SATIRE", right there, impossible to miss.
Billybroby should not be required to censor everything he writes so it can be correctly understood by those at a Grade Three English reading level. Should he include stick drawings too?
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It's racist, spiteful and highly libellous. I mean, I don't know what the Korean situation is, but in Britain this is a criminal offence, with possible prison sentence.
I like the Yangpa, but this article is nasty and irresponsible. To be honest, if I was Lee Jun Ki i'd sue you / charge you. |
If they could actually read English, they'd have taken it for what it was.
Billybroby, apologize for nothing.
But there's a cultural thing going on here - young Asians (yes, generalization) aren't particularly good at 1. critical thinking/media literacy 2. English comprehension, or 3. detecting irony and sarcasm.
Now that's not their fault, but the fact that they go flipping apesht and mob-like as a result of the sum of their failings at all three skills is their fault. Not yours.
Bravo!!!
I second the suggestion a few pages ago to have some fun with the Chinese next.
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My favourite comment. Koramerican's thinking a little too hard here:
Kormerican
October 15th, 2006 at 2:46 pm
a lot of western men feel that sarcasm and satire are products of crititical thinking. Sometimes it is.
But often it’s a symptom of their passive-aggressive personalities and arises from a basic hatred for the “other”. Also, sarcasm in the west is taken as wit, creativity, etc. But in actuality, most sarcasm is in essence the puerile schoolboy desire to appear to be intelligent and has more to do with vanity than with any real worth let alone creativity.
the article is not interesting. it is vain and a product of an empty and wasted upbringing. The people who consume this sort of garbage as entertainment are caught in the same meaningless existence as the writer. There are millions and millions of these people.
Kormerican |
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billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 1:41 am Post subject: |
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| The Lemon wrote: |
My favourite comment. Koramerican's thinking a little too hard here:
Kormerican
October 15th, 2006 at 2:46 pm
a lot of western men feel that sarcasm and satire are products of crititical thinking. Sometimes it is.
But often it’s a symptom of their passive-aggressive personalities and arises from a basic hatred for the “other”. Also, sarcasm in the west is taken as wit, creativity, etc. But in actuality, most sarcasm is in essence the puerile schoolboy desire to appear to be intelligent and has more to do with vanity than with any real worth let alone creativity.
the article is not interesting. it is vain and a product of an empty and wasted upbringing. The people who consume this sort of garbage as entertainment are caught in the same meaningless existence as the writer. There are millions and millions of these people.
Kormerican |
Yeah, that one killed me. It was hard to not break character in order to respond to that one. To make a huge (and frankly bizarre) generalization about western men in sentence one and then to criticize them for fearing the 'other' in sentence two. Such irony! And then to put a double-twist on top of that twist, both sentences are an attack on satire! It's like the most perfect satire ever written!
It's also kind of ham-handed the way he trots out various big words (puerile) and fancy concepts (passive-agressive) to make the very strange argument that satire (not just my satire, but satire itself) is mostly juvenile and vain. I suppose he tought it was going to come off as some kind of incisive intellectual attack, but he never explains why he thinks satire is mostly vain. So it's just sort of an empty exercise in sentence construction. It's too bad, really. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:32 am Post subject: |
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| I don't know about anyone else, but from time to time, when I'm bored with my lesson, I like to make a comment in somewhat sophisticated English and then razz on my students for being too stupid to catch the subtleties of English. It's a hoot. |
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billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:56 am Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| I don't know about anyone else, but from time to time, when I'm bored with my lesson, I like to make a comment in somewhat sophisticated English and then razz on my students for being too stupid to catch the subtleties of English. It's a hoot. |
sometimes I like to make unfair analogies and then do a farting sound with my armpit. |
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Tiberious aka Sparkles
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:59 am Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| I don't know about anyone else, but from time to time, when I'm bored with my lesson, I like to make a comment in somewhat sophisticated English and then razz on my students for being too stupid to catch the subtleties of English. It's a hoot. |
sometimes I like to make unfair analogies and then do a farting sound with my armpit. |
Well played, sir. |
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rabbitsaregood
Joined: 03 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 6:11 am Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
Well, here's the story behind that article. I wrote another article making fun of Lee Jun Ki, and thereafter I started getting all of these comments from people who were apparently pubescent girl fans who weren't getting the satire. The article quickly became the most viewed, searched for, and commented article on the site. And for months, I ignored it, but after a while I decided I ought to have fun with it. So I wrote the second article. Which alone is just cruel and stupid and not even really funny, but in the context of the situation is...well...not really clever, but I guess you can understand it more. I mean, it was trying to put a twist on the situation rather than just making blunt attack on the philippines, which I've never been to, have no opinion of, and can only occasionally spell correctly.
I figured it would only cause heartache and tears for 13-year-old Lee Jun Ki fans, the thought of which makes me laugh because I'm heartless. But instead it's been picked up by another bunch of people, presumably young filipino guys, who also don't understand the satire and are spitting mad about it. |
What satire? I don't see what's satirical about it (as opposed to the police - prostitution satire which was generally good and funny). You just said that the main reason for posting it was to upset a bunch of 13 year olds. What you've got here is a load of people believing something that isn't true, which you did on purpose. That's the opposite of satire in a way, which is supposed to real hidden truths about situations.
| Quote: |
Really, I don't feel responsible for the feelings of people who can't understand obvious jokes.
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I hesitate to pull it because I've been aiming to make stuff that was funny and merciless and would not pander to anybody's prejudices and would not hold anybody's hand and pat them on the head and say, "oh it's just a joke." People have to think for themselves. For me to break the facade of seriousness and let everybody in on the joke wouldn't be right. I dunno. anyways, those are my thoughts. |
I don't think you should worry about offending people, but worrying about offending people is different than offending people on purpose. People are offended by LJKs comments not yours anyway, although obviously you made them up. And I don't like the idea of you breaking the facade of it all either, but I do think you should do something. It would have been better if it was a more direct follow up to the article you talked about before. |
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billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 8:50 am Post subject: |
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Although that article is distinctly different from all the other articles, I still contend that it is satire. The other articles ridicule their subjects whereas that one ridicules the readers, or at least the portion of the readers who are not "in-the-know" about the article's nature. It's like when comedians from other countries come to America and interview people with easy questions, get the wrong answers, and smugly assert that Americans are dumb. It's a form of satire that I don't really like, because it's easy and doesn't really tell us much. it's also very smug and nasty and positions the author as being somehow better than or more clever than the audience. but this is the only article of that nature that i've written.
Whether you think the article is effective or "fair" depends on how easy you think it is for the reader to know that the article is fake, and therefore how dumb they must be to NOT know that the article is fake. I contend that it is *incredibly* easy to discern that the article is fake. Anybody who can't figure it out is either stupid or lazy. i think it's probably laziness. And I refuse to cater to or coddle such that kind of stuff. And again, stupid people are always going to go through their lives misunderstanding things, running into things, and falling down a lot.
The only thing I really don't like is having my blog be a haven for all sorts of racial remarks about Koreans and Filipinos. I think a lot of people are just having fun with it and don't even believe the article, they're just being nasty. |
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babtangee
Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Location: OMG! Charlie has me surrounded!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
| I think a lot of people are just having fun with it and don't even believe the article, they're just being nasty. |
That's an obvious certainty. |
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gang ah jee
Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: city of paper
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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What I'm wondering is, isn't King of Kwangju's argument that you have no responsibility for the reactions of your readership the rationale of internet trolls? Aren't you blogtrolling, billybrobby?
Last edited by gang ah jee on Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:55 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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rabbitsaregood
Joined: 03 Oct 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
| Although that article is distinctly different from all the other articles, I still contend that it is satire. The other articles ridicule their subjects whereas that one ridicules the readers, or at least the portion of the readers who are not "in-the-know" about the article's nature. It's like when comedians from other countries come to America and interview people with easy questions, get the wrong answers, and smugly assert that Americans are dumb. It's a form of satire that I don't really like, because it's easy and doesn't really tell us much. it's also very smug and nasty and positions the author as being somehow better than or more clever than the audience. but this is the only article of that nature that i've written. |
It depends what the question is. If its "So, you are anti abortion and pro death penalty. At what age do you think we should start killing people?" (Mark Thomas) then that's satirical because the satire is in the question. If it's the kind of "Where is Iraq?" {points to France} thing, I don't think that's satirical and its only funny cos of the stupidity of the reaction. And that's funny for the same reason as a report on a guy who wins a Darwin Award. He's so stupid it's funny, but it's not satirical.
But your article doesn't have a reaction (apart from the comments - which weren't there to start with) it just says that some famous guy said racist things about The Philipines, with some vague clues as to the fact that it might not be true.
| Quote: |
| Whether you think the article is effective or "fair" depends on how easy you think it is for the reader to know that the article is fake, and therefore how dumb they must be to NOT know that the article is fake. I contend that it is *incredibly* easy to discern that the article is fake. |
If you thought that those philipinos would be able to understand it, why did you think they would be upset?
I dunno, I do really like your site, and this is long. I don't want to turn things into some massive battle of attrition. It's just that I don't think it's cool to slander someone for no reason, especially when the people it's aimed at aren't in a position to get the joke. |
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