Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

alper · Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 5:11 pm Post subject: Universal Peace!!!

hi...
I want to talk about UNIVERSAL PEACE...
for a while, I've been struggling on this topic... at the same time I have a project, Universal Peace Project...

ideas are so important for me... what do you think about Universal Peace...
Do the world need this or not? can you share you ideas with me?... thanks...
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Universal Peace...

alper · Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 2:21 pm Post subject:

mmm... nobody wants peace?
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Universal Peace...

Bob S. · Joined: 29 Apr 2004 Posts: 1767 Location: So. Cal

I'll have a piece of pie.

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Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.
-Thomas Paine

Leon Young · Joined: 05 Sep 2006 Posts: 107 Location: Kunming,China

I may say you are a dreamer

but you are not the only one^^
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alper · Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 8:35 am Post subject:

why do you think that I'm a dreamer... even you say this I believe in this... at least I hope something... even difficult...

then what is your opinion... why not?
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Universal Peace...

Bob S. · Joined: 29 Apr 2004 Posts: 1767 Location: So. Cal

He was quoting a John Lennon song. Very Happy

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"There is no worse tyranny than to force a man to pay for what he does not want merely because you think it would be good for him."
-Robert A. Heinlein, "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress"

Leon Young · Joined: 05 Sep 2006 Posts: 107 Location: Kunming,China

alper · Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 6:46 am Post subject:

friends I understand you, its so hard to think this in so much hard times, bu this is an action, and sometimes we need to hope something, maybe it has been dreamed for ages, but I believe that we just need peace... yes, I didn't hear those words for the first time... I'm used to...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cj44kfI6XfU

this is my first band, its about universal peace... please listen... its turkish but you can get the theme...

and thanks for your opinions...
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Universal Peace...

Leon Young · Joined: 05 Sep 2006 Posts: 107 Location: Kunming,China

asterix · Joined: 26 Jan 2003 Posts: 1654

Mankind is by nature, territorial.
Although we know intellectually, that war is stupid, our territorial imperative overcomes our common sense.
I think that if our political leaders were required to physically lead their troops into battle, as the ancient leaders did, there would be very few wars taking place. However, you will have noticed that nowadays, the people who start the wars remain as far as possible from the conflict, while the young men and women do the sctual fighting.

alper · Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 2:53 pm Post subject:

thanks friends,

sometimes I think this is nearly impossible (perhaps absolutely) but, people need hope and some belief, maybe you say "you can't do anything"...
but at least I'm trying to show my reaction against wars...
is fighting a good thing? we are not barbaric people and those ages got behind... there are government models and systems...
so, any country can't do something in such a relaxed way, especially in external politics...

and again thanks for your opinions because I really need to know different ideas... Smile

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Universal Peace...

asterix · Joined: 26 Jan 2003 Posts: 1654

You can refuse to fight, as a conscientious objector, although you can't really do that if you are already in an army, because the punishment for doing it is severe, perhaps even death.
In the liberal democracies, like the USA, you can refuse to join the army if you are conscripted. I believe they put you in jail for several years, though, so you have to be very firm in your belief. I don't know what the punishment would be in such places as China, but I imagine it would be very harsh.
What would happen in your country?

openenglish · Joined: 26 Oct 2007 Posts: 35

I think most of us wish for peace, but when we imagine a peaceful world I think everyone imagines it in a different way. Depending on your ideals you strive to change the world the way YOU want it to be, a Socialist dictator wants a peaceful socialist world and is willing to fight to get it. A lot of leaders and people see war as a necessary means to make the world the way they want it to be.
I personally don't agree but I do understand people who are willing to fight for their basic human rights.
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alper · Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:23 pm Post subject:

asterix and openenglish thanks...

in my country, refusing to fight is hard... but its not a big crime... and if you have wise necessities to do it, you can...
there are some situations... if a country is against you, and wants your lands, in such a time you have to defend yourself...

but I'm not talking about this, especially in last decades we've seen lots of humanity crimes in the name of democracy and peace... I agree with openenglish about "whose peace"...
my ideal peace is not the tool of any ideology or politics... just peace for all the people...

I know this is a big utopian... maybe, but at least I think we have to struggle for this aim...

wars and fights aren't only solutions... everytime there is a way... if you really care about people and humanity rights...

and again thanks for writing your opinions...
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Universal Peace...

asterix · Joined: 26 Jan 2003 Posts: 1654

Now that there is an International Court of Justice in Den Haag, in the Netherlands, I suppose all disputes between nations could be decided there.