Job Discussion Forums

[drifter13]

So I'm trying to find an alternative to the NOVA offered JMA coverage, but I'm wondering if I have to factor NHI into that. I no you are supposed to pay NHI if you work in Japan, but I don't see any metion of it in the NOVA info pack and have only been able to glean facts of websites as to what it is and how it works.

Also, if anyone has a reccomendable insurance agency they've dealt with, fell free to drop the name of the company.

thanks for any help in advance.

[southofreality]

You should consider enrolling in the National Health Insurance scheme (kokumin kenko hoken). Not only does it keep you straight as far as the law is concerned, for your first year here, it's usually cheaper than what most eikaiwa companies offer. Your fees are calculated based upon the taxes you paid in Japan during the previous year, which for you, are zero. Plus, NHI is very easy to use; you just present it at the time of your doctor visit, and there are usually no insurance questions that follow. Anyway, the following link migh help you out:

Required Health Insurance for Foreigners Residing in Japan-Click Here

[drifter13]

Thanks for the link. So I could use NHI instead of the JMA? because the NOVA info packet seems to indicate I need medical insurance before leaving for Japan, and NHI looks like it needs to be set up in my local ward (where ever that ends up being). I guess I could buy travellers insurance for the time it takes me to get coverage. Any NOVA people, or people who know NOVA people, use NHI and only NHI? It seems to be pretty cheap for the one year (which is the plan atm).

[Glenski]

NOVA is still bullying people to take their JMA? Yes, THEIR JMA. NOVA gets a cut from your insurance premiums.

Tell NOVA that you need a day to recuperate from the plane ride. It's only common sense for jet lag. Remind them, also, that you need to register for your alien card. Sign up for NHI and the alien card in the same place on the same day. THEN, to go work.

If they harass you more, tell them the union has been on their backs about this harassment, and that you will report them. (You probably won't even say this, but it's a thought.) Get short-term travel insurance, dump it a month after you arrive, and get NHI.

NHI costs 2500 yen/month the first year. There is no record of you making money in Japan. Next year, though, it goes up tenfold. However, if you take JMA, you won't be with NOVA forever, and when you go off it, you will have to have some sort of insurance. If you don't opt for travel insurance or get shakai hoken, you will have to get NHI, and at that time, you will have to make backpayments for up to 2-3 years' worth when you weren't on it, even if you were on JMA then.

Makes you think twice.

[drifter13]

Thanks for the advice, I figure that JMA is off the option list Gonna grab some travler insurance and then snag NHI as soon as I can. It seems like a good idea all around, since If I do stay more that a year at least my records will be good as far as NHI payments go.

[Wasabi Bomb]

Keep in mind that if you get NHI or Shakai Hoken through your work at Nova (and maybe you should get Shakai Hoken instead of NHI, because Nova will have to share the cost of your premiums...with NHI you pay it by yourself) you will also have to make monthly pension contributions, which take another big bite out of your paycheck. When you leave Japan you can apply to get back only 3 years worth of payments. You can't claim pension benefits in Japan unless you live here 25 years.

For those reasons (and because I plan on living in various countries) I've never taken shakai hoken or NHI and instead have cheaper private insurance and I pay into a private retirement fund rather than a national pension I won't be able to benefit from. Technically I'm breaking the law, but it's still very common.

***
Nova might tell you it's illegal to be there without insurance, but it's B.S. A lot of ECC teachers show up without insurance and ECC tells them their options at their orientation and the company seems to be fine with that.

[GIR]

When I declined JMA, the NOVA recruiting office wanted to know what insurance arrangements I had made. I told them that I was interested in the national health insurance, and they told me that I'd have to sign up for that after I arrived in Japan. But it seems like we're good on that note.

[drifter13]

[Ryu Hayabusa]

I've read on this and other forums that NHI is cheap the first year--around 2500 yen/month. That sounds great, but during my training at ECC I was told that one must also enroll in the National Pension (Kokumin Nenkin) which is about 15 000 yen/month. Suddenly, getting NHI doesn't sound like such a good idea.

I've asked around ECC Namba and I've been told that it's not possible to just enroll in NHI (Kokumin Kenko) without also enrolling in Kukumin Nenkin. They say this is a relatively new thing.

Does anyone have anything to add to this?

I'm thinking of going to my ward office and trying to enroll in only Kokumin Kenko. If I can't on one day, I'm going to go back on another day and try with another teller.

In Japanese, how would I ask to be enrolled in NHI without Kokumin Nenkin?

Also, I've done some calculations to give myself a clear cost comparison between NHI (kokumin kenko and kokumin nenkin) and Shakai Hoken. The amounts to be paid every month assume a salary of 260 000 (250 000 yen + 10 000 travel reimbursement.) I posted this on the ECC group on Facebook and I hope that people here find it useful.

______________________________________________________________
National Health insurance and pension (Kokumin Kenko Hoken and Kokumin Nenkin) is around 18 000 yen/month.

18 000 x 6 months= 108 000 yen
Refund after 6 months (and less than 12 months) = 41 580
Total spent for 6 months of coverage = 66 420
______________________________________________________________
Shakai Hoken is around 30 000 yen/month.

30 000 x 6 months = 180 000
Refund after 6-11 months = 104 000
Total spent for 6 months of coverage = 76 000

So, if a person has just been on insurance for 6 months shakai hoken is still the better deal despite being 10 000 yen more.
______________________________________________________________
If a person is here for 11 months, it's not such a good deal with either plan.

National Health insurance and pension (Kokumin Kenko Hoken and Kokumin Nenkin)

18 000 x 11 (months) = 198 000 yen
Refund after 6 months (but less than 12 months) = 41 580
total spent = 156 420 yen

Shakai Hoken

30 000 x 11 (months) = 330 000 yen
Refund after 6-11 months = 104 000
Total spent = 226 000 yen
______________________________________________________________
After 12 months it becomes clear that Shakai Hoken is the better way to go.
I didn't calculate it, but after the first year and year and a half, the premiums go way up for the National.

National Health insurance and pension (Kokumin Kenko Hoken and Kokumin Nenkin)

18 000 x 12 (months) = 216 000
Refund for 12-18 months = 83 160
Total spent = 132 840

Shakai Hoken

30 000 x 12 (months) = 360 000
Refund for 12-17 months = 208 000
Total spent = 152 000
______________________________________________________________

[Glenski]

Get the two insurance plans straight.

Kokumin Kenko Hoken is health insurance for those who are not covered by their employer and corporate insurance. It does not involve a pension plan, and if you are on KKH, it is optional to enroll in a pension plan. (You'll get back almost all of 3 years' payments, though, if you do. Government is working on extending that to 5 years, but it hasn't happened yet.)

Shakai Hoken is corporate insurance, and it includes the health insurance and pension plan. They cannot be separated. If ECC has this (and I believe they do), then you are obligated to pay half of both. ECC pays for the other half. Again, you will get most of 3 years' pension installments back when you leave Japan.

[Ryu Hayabusa]

I thought I did have them straight. Thanks for your reply, though.

I suppose I should've made it a bit clearer what I wanted to know. From what ECC and people at ECC have told me, one cannot enroll in Kokumin Kenko Hoken (NHI) without also enrolling in Kokumin Nenkin (National Pension). I wanted to know if this is true. I'm going to direct this specifically to those who have just recently arrived to Japan or have spoken to new-arrivals recently. From what I've gathered, it's just recently that Japan has required foreigners to enroll in both NHI and National Pension. The reason why I'm asking is because I hope this isn't true. I also want to make sure what the situation is before going to the ward office and potentially signing up for something that I may regret.

ECC gives us the choice to stay with the 29.5 hour/week schedule and enroll ourselves at the ward office for NHI and National Pension, or to take a 30 hour/week schedule and let ECC enroll us in Shakai Hoken.

Glenski, you're saying that enrolling in the National Pension is optional. That's great news. I'll let the forum know what happens.

Some people may be wondering why I don't just go with Shakai Hoken from the get-go. The way I see it, if I can enroll in just NHI for a year, I can switch to Shakai Hoken right before my premiums with NHI go up. The coverage isn't as comprehensive, but I'll save a lot of money.

[Khyron]

[Ryu Hayabusa]

@Khyron

haha. I'm happy you picked up the Ninja Gaiden reference. The reason why I thought it would be better to switch to Shakai Hoken after one year was because I was told that the Shakai Hoken starts off at around 30 000 yen/month and stays there if my salary doesn't increase. It makes sense that it would increase after my first year. I was just going with what I was told during training. I must have missed this when I was scouring through this forum for Shakai Hoken info.

[southofreality]

I've heard of people being told they had to enroll in Kokumin Nenkin when they enrolled in Kokumin Kenko Hoken and then I've heard of people just enrolling in Kenko Hoken without enrolling in the pension plan. From what I've learned, enrollment in both is mandatory, but in reality, a lot of city and ward offices aren't pushing the pension issue.

Personally, if it were me and my plan was to leave at the end of a year anyway, I'd bypass the whole mess if I was told I had to pay into the pension system.

[Glenski]