Job Discussion Forums

[kev7161]

[LeopoldBloom]

Teachers in China who teach subjects, not ESL, at International schools and receive wages that are somewhat competitive (around $2000 a month + benefits) and are treated well... are among the very small minority of foreign teachers in China.

By and large the overwhelming majority of those jobs require teacher certification in your subject area. Teachers who have such might consider looking at international schools in China where their odds of having a good experience is higher than the rest of the unfortunate herd.

But then again, with those credentials they could teach at international schools in most countries around the world and receive much more competitive wages and benefits elsewhere and also be in far less shark-filled pool. Most countries around the world have much better reputations for how they treat foreign staff.

The bottom line is that most people who are considering teaching in China do not have certification in a subject area. And if they don't they'll be stuck will 4 - 6,000 Rmb a month or slightly more 90%+ of the time. In theory a TEFL teacher could make double that or even more at a language center... but the incredible misery that 98.7% of language centers in China are as workplaces... is simply not worth it. Turnover is astronomical at those places. The only reason a precious few people stay is because they feel totally trapped. Which brings us back to the original point: TEFL in China can be an absolutely terrible experience and mistake that could severely damage you psychologically, physically and most of all, career-wise.

LPD

[roadwalker]

Misery???

China schools get some miserable people, as can be seen on these boards, but there are few cases of actual misery, objectively viewed, when it comes to the typical TEFL jobs. Little Lord Fauntleroys probably won't be happy here in most cases. But if you enjoy teaching, can accept last minute changes to your schedules, and the bumps along the way that living abroad entails, China might be a good fit for you. I have my anti-China days: it's impossible not to after working anywhere for a while. But overall, it's been good for me, and I've returned again and again.

You may find better overall compensation elsewhere, and if that's a major factor for you, do your homework. Add everything up, not just salary.

As a foreign teacher, I've been treated well. China isn't perfect and there have been some terrible instances of siding with the locals over the foreigners. That happens everywhere in the world that doesn't host an occupying foreign army. If you are involved in business that competes with well-connected locals, such as running your own school, you MAY run into local corruption problems. As an employee or a private tutor, in most cases you will be ignored and if dealt with at all, dealt with politely by the government.

[DirtGuy]

There are 4 FTs at my uni and it looks like all of us are going to re-up for another year. This means we can all look forward to being damaged psychologically, physically, and have absolutely no career prospects after we leave China. I'm cool with that.

DG

[kev7161]

[lemak]

[creeper1]

I agree with some of the points on here. Yes, the posters on this forum are much more positive on here than on that other forum discussing the hermit kingdom. Which is surprising really considering how much more difficulty posters in China must put up with.

I guess the majority of posters on here are sunny people that see the bright side of everything China.

Myself I tend to agree with Leopard Bloom. Once I've paid my rent (expensive in my location) and paid for necessary items of living there is very little left at the end of the month.

[roadwalker]

[GreatApe]

I work for an I.S. that has 9 foreign teachers working for it. The two newest teachers have been here one year, everyone else has been here for more that 2 years ... the most veteran teacher has been here 7 years.

I make more than 1,800 USD a month. I work roughly 30 hours a week and do not teach on the weekends. I do not teach "privates" to supplement my income (although I could if I wanted to) because I have no need to do privates and I value my free-time on the weekends. I teach 22 hours per week; my largest class is 20 students. I am able to save more than 8,000 RMB per month ANY month I choose to do so! And that is NOT exaggeration.

The foreign teachers at my school are from Africa, India, Malaysia, the Philippines, and America. This time of year is "new contract time" and I do not see any of our teachers wanting to leave. Why? Because the job is ROCK SOLID!

LBloom speaks mainly in hyperbole, generalizations and stereotypes. Newbies would be well-warned to take what he has to say with a large grain of salt and to realize that his axe-grinding is consistent, as is his anti-PRC stance.

It's possible to advance into better jobs and receive better salaries in China. I have done it and if I can do it, then others can do it as well. I worked two pretty "rough" jobs before I landed my current job. I won't make the 3,600 USD dollars per month I made teaching in the states, but I don't NEED to make that much money either, since I spend very little per month living in China.

IMO, qualified teachers can live a very good life working in China and, from what I've seen, the number of qualified teachers is increasing--albeit slowly. That's a good sign as far as I'm concerned.

Also, IMO, anyone who posts so much anti-China opinion and rhetoric, who takes his name from the protagonist of James Joyce's "Ulysses", and is less-than forthcoming about his own personal experiences and reasons for being so anti-China is not to be trusted.

At the beginning of "Ulysses" Joyce introduces Bloom this way:

[dakelei]

My math is pretty weak but by my calculations $1,800 is not even 12,000 RMB. In a decent size city here that is not really that outlandish a salary. I made that in Shenzhen at an international school back in 2009. I'm a certified teacher in the USA. (Of course the school DID subsequently go out of business, but that's another story.) My salary now at my uni (in a Tier 5, I swear, city) is 7000 for 16 teaching hours and I get offers nearly every week for outside work. Because I'm one of these nutjobs not at all interested in money I routinely turn down such offers, much to the frustration of my Chinese girlfriend who silently (and sometimes not so silently) wishes I was a tad more ambitious and materialistic. Right now I have around 3 months' salary sitting in my China Construction Bank account. I don't make a conscious effort to "save" (mostly because I'm a total pessimist at heart and just don't see the point of planning for a future I have no assurances will ever come...but that's also another topic for another day). I buy silly stuff like guitars that I can barely play and frequently eat out. My point is that if I were really into money and saving China would probably not be a bad place to do it. For young folks with ambition and gumption China might be a good place to get something going. I'll admit, though, I grow weary of how just about every FT here who feels they can string a sentence together wants to "write." Books written on paper are so last century and your great novel ain't gonna happen. Just get a job already, OK?

[litterascriptor]

[LarssonCrew]

One thing about China is that the tax/rent thing is often taken care of.

For instance, if you work in a uni, say, 20 hours a week, for 6000 a month and a free apartment with no bills, you're essentially getting, compared to say my brother, the same as 20000 a month, because:

25% NI and tax -> 5,000
Rent -> 7,000
Bills, electricity, council tax, internet, tv etc -> 3,000

So on 20000 a month in London after those two basics you're left with 5,000, take off your travel card of 1300 a month and you've got 3700, whereas in China the whole 6000 is in your pocket.

[Asiateacher]

China still rocks... It's good to see some positivity online about it sometimes... Mostly everyone just talks about the negative stuff