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spycatcher reincarnated
Joined: 19 May 2005
Posts: 236
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 Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 5:44 am Post subject: |
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| I have taught English in the Czech Republic, Taiwan and Vietnam. Out of these three countries I would say that the level of foreign English teachers that I have come across is much, much higher, here in Vietnam. |
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sigmoid
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 1276
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:02 am Post subject: |
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| Vietnam is largely for the dregs of the teaching world. |
That's because making visas/work permits difficult and expensive to obtain encourages professional, experienced and qualified teachers to go to other countries.
The teaching/training/tutoring/education industry is not limited to Viet Nam. People who know what they're doing and do it well have options. Requiring them to "jump through hoops', putting up obstacles and barriers and having unclear regulations and policies encourages them to research these options, buy a ticket and leave.
The "dregs" are what is left over after everybody has gone somewhere else. And they are able to get teaching jobs because there is so little competition for jobs that nobody else wants. |
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skarper
Joined: 12 Oct 2006
Posts: 477
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:18 am Post subject: |
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Where are all the good, professional, well trained, motivated English Teachers? Which wonderful, well paying, welcoming country has snapped them all up?
Sorry for the sacrcasm but WE ALL KNOW that EFL everywhere is the same. It attracts all sorts of people but mostly the good people leave and go into other jobs because EFL just can't cut it.
Some become managers. Some start their own schools. Some just stick it out and make the best of it....but most go home and get a 'normal' job.
There is always a large majority of new faces who are mostly inept though often well meaning. EFL is what it is. There are no good places to go where professionalism is valued/rewarded or even wanted.
These realities can be annoying, but the sooner we all accept them the better off we will be.
Vietnam is NOT worse than Japan, Korea or France in my experience. Korea has a straightforward and transparent visa/WP system but still fails to attract professional teachers. Japan's WP system is held up by many as the best solution but again their are proportionally VERY FEW qualified EFL teachers among the masses of unqualified 'gaijin' edutainers.
Europe is pretty much a hopeless case since the 2008 financial meltdown. Living on subsistence wages in Spain/Italy/Greece does not appeal...Japan is not much better an getting worse. Korea is due another jolt no doubt made worse by NKs sabre-rattling.
In sum - Vietnam is OK. Not great but OK for most of us. Those wanting to seek greener pastures may well find it hardly worth the trouble.
All this visa kerfuffle will settle down in the end. I am married to a local so it hasn't affected me yet.
Last edited by skarper on Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:30 am; edited 1 time in total |
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LettersAthruZ
Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 466
Location: North Viet Nam
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:20 am Post subject: |
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| sigmoid wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Vietnam is largely for the dregs of the teaching world. |
The teaching/training/tutoring/education industry is not limited to Viet Nam. People who know what they're doing and do it well have options. Requiring them to "jump through hoops', putting up obstacles and barriers and having unclear regulations and policies encourages them to research these options, buy a ticket and leave. |
I'm reeeaaaalllly considering researching these other options myself......a recent spat of hyper-inflation the past couple of months only seemed to seal the deal for me in terms of exploring my options elsewhere.....still, no place is perfect, and Viet Nam STILL doesn't mess TOO badly with me regarding my freelancing, and I'm per-rittty sure that if I had attempted to freelance in, say, South Korea, that I would be in the clink by now..... |
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skarper
Joined: 12 Oct 2006
Posts: 477
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:38 am Post subject: |
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Sure - freelance work in SK is a serious no-no. Someone will rat you out in no time and you will get jugged - they will freeze your bank account too.
Though - many do freelance in SK for years and get away with it - so it can be done. Helps to be Canadian because of 6 month tourist visas.
By all means look into other places but expect to swap one set of problems for another.
If freelancing you can always pass on the costs of visa runs to your clients in higher fees. You will still be a better/cheaper option than the mills who will charge an arm and a leg then send in the clowns...
If you really like it here why not get married? Solves 90% of these problems though it does cost 2-3000 USD. Just don't buy a house in her name! ;-> |
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LettersAthruZ
Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 466
Location: North Viet Nam
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:59 am Post subject: |
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| skarper wrote: |
| If freelancing you can always pass on the costs of visa runs to your clients in higher fees. You will still be a better/cheaper option than the mills who will charge an arm and a leg then send in the clowns... |
Hahahahaha!!! You must have been sitting in on a few proposal meetings I have held with potential clients, since that is how I pretty much explain away - "BUT, BUT, [insert popular mill's name HERE] is so famous around both, Ha Noi AND Viet Nam, why wouldn't my company select them over you?"!!
| skarper wrote: |
| If you really like it here why not get married? Solves 90% of these problems though it does cost 2-3000 USD. Just don't buy a house in her name! ;-> |
It's really a tempting idea, but I have seen friends brought to tears trying to secure a legal and proper marriage license from the crooks in charge here........it is just stunning.
On the other hand, it would remove the princely sum (and it AIN'T cheap) I have to "donate" for my Work Permit every couple of years.....interesting thought..... |
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ExpatLuke
Joined: 11 Feb 2012
Posts: 744
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| spycatcher reincarnated wrote: |
| I have taught English in the Czech Republic, Taiwan and Vietnam. Out of these three countries I would say that the level of foreign English teachers that I have come across is much, much higher, here in Vietnam. |
I'd have to agree with this as well. I've taught in both China and Vietnam and the fellow teachers I've met in Vietnam have been much more qualified and professional than the ones from China...
I tend to think if the only "teachers" you're meeting are the boozers and drop-outs, then you're running with the wrong crowd. Perhaps that says more about you than you'd want to admit...
I'll jump on board with all this "Vietnam is a dreadful place to live and teach" bandwagon when I see it actually affects me. So far I've had good employers who value me and want to keep me. I guess that's what happens when you're actually qualified to teach, and have a good attitude about your job. Some things I've seen very few posters in this thread possess. |
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