|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
|
 Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 4:47 am Post subject: |
 |
|
"By giving students an unfamiliar pattern of work and activity within a classroom one is adding to the language barrier by creating a cultural divide".
I think the kids have to 'come over' to English, not the other way around.
Chou in preceding post, has nailed it IMHO.
Your students haven't touched anything in English over the past week very like and you need to condition them to the uptake of knowledge in English. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 1549
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 5:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
| GuestBob wrote: |
Just diving in to a classroom with Western method produces exactly the kind of issues which Phiona Stanley talks about in her oft posted article Performing Foreigners. |
Gets very interesting, and enlightening, about a third of the way down.
http://www.deakin.edu.au/arts-ed/ccg/events/pdf/mpn%20028.pdf |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
GuestBob
Joined: 18 Jun 2011
Posts: 270
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 5:05 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Non Sequitur wrote: |
Your students haven't touched anything in English over the past week very like and you need to condition them to the uptake of knowledge in English. |
Horses for courses: I can see the utility of waking students up if it's five o'clock at the end of another tedious day of textbook spelunking.
However, my students have a pretty hard time spotting useful knowledge and information by themselves so I am not sure how effective dressing a lesson up in a different costume would be in getting them to recognise what they should be learning. At least initially. Obviously once you have been working with a class for a while then it gets much easier to move lesson elements around because you've begun the process of changing their attitude towards what language is and how it can be studied.
| Non Sequitur wrote: |
I think the kids have to 'come over' to English, not the other way around.
|
Of all the languages in the world, this statement applies the least to English. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wonderingjoesmith
Joined: 19 Aug 2012
Posts: 910
Location: Guangzhou
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Non Sequitur wrote: |
"A warmup excercise which tries to "ready students for instruction" might even be counterproductive as it sets the wrong tone or isn't a readily comprehensible component of a lesson".
How anything that gets the students to tune in to the teacher as leader of the class can hardly be counterproductive and getting used to English as the medium of instruction is a help in comprehension.
That CTs don't use warmups is hardly a guide to best practice, as they don't have the problem of changing the language of instruction as an FT has.
As to 'young' children I can only say that in my experience Chinese kids are 2-4 years behind their Western counterparts in life skills and sophistication.
That can actually be an advantage as they take easily to class management techniques that you could not attempt with the same cohort in the West. |
16 year old students that are 2-4 years behind may provide teachers with a better control over the kids� behaviors. But can those obedient souls produce the expected results? Being farther back may reduce the options for warm-ups to topics and perhaps the teaching speed or level of difficulty in assignments.
A few posts on the topic, some of my colleagues and my short experience on mainland tell me that the debated warm-ups are only a patch on the wound. To break the ice, classroom dynamics are the temporary solution. A foreign teacher in such environment as here may have to establish some extreme measures. Mildly physical activities may, in my school do, increase chances of oral contribution, even if primitive, to the class. Taking kids on a brief trip around the campus or sitting them somewhere out may temporarily open them up; standing up the whole class when only the contributors are allowed to sit down is yet another ice breaker. Assigning survey, research or other viable tasks, which are connected to the courses/lessons, for homework may be the warm-up a teacher could look too. More confrontational examples may be effectively exercised when addressing some issues with superiors and kids� parents. In any case, over a long haul it must be a tough and thankless job with such kids as described in this thread. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wonderingjoesmith
Joined: 19 Aug 2012
Posts: 910
Location: Guangzhou
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| GuestBob wrote: |
| Non Sequitur wrote: |
I think the kids have to 'come over' to English, not the other way around.
|
Of all the languages in the world, this statement applies the least to English. |
I somewhat differ if it comes to kids with plans to study abroad and if it comes to some large investments in the kids. Hard to imagine the youngsters or their parents unwilling to cooperate although I have heard �this is China� way too many times in a year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sarcastro
Joined: 18 Dec 2010
Posts: 89
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
| wonderingjoesmith wrote: |
A few posts on the topic, some of my colleagues and my short experience on mainland tell me that the debated warm-ups are only a patch on the wound. To break the ice, classroom dynamics are the temporary solution. A foreign teacher in such environment as here may have to establish some extreme measures. Mildly physical activities may, in my school do, increase chances of oral contribution, even if primitive, to the class. Taking kids on a brief trip around the campus or sitting them somewhere out may temporarily open them up; standing up the whole class when only the contributors are allowed to sit down is yet another ice breaker. Assigning survey, research or other viable tasks, which are connected to the courses/lessons, for homework may be the warm-up a teacher could look too. More confrontational examples may be effectively exercised when addressing some issues with superiors and kids� parents. In any case, over a long haul it must be a tough and thankless job with such kids as described in this thread. |
Though I dont 100% agree with everything here I defiantly agree with the heart of this. Especially as a way to break the ice. I only problem I find with warm ups is doing warmups because you should do warmups. I really feel that they need to be calculated and not something to throw in to take up time.
Like today, my kids were more lethargic than usual so I had them get up and play a little game of Concentration. Its a rhythm and concentration game that forces them to be physically active. Anyway I taught them the game did it for about 10 minutes then went back to the lesson. They were 10x more receptive and were able to do much more with then lessons than before.
Concentration isn't necessarily an "English" game so some of you may think that Im contradicting my last post. In respect to my lesson, it doesn't seem like it has much to do with it at all. But what it did was wake the kids up and shook off some of the usual drudgery enabling them to be more receptive. In that way it was enabling what I was teaching to be better received.
As I said, warmups have their purpose if you do them as a service to your overall lesson. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 1549
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 12:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Sarcastro wrote: |
| I defiantly agree |
I don't think "defiantly" means what you think it means  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sarcastro
Joined: 18 Dec 2010
Posts: 89
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
|
| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 2:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| rogerwilco wrote: |
| Sarcastro wrote: |
| I defiantly agree |
I don't think "defiantly" means what you think it means |
LOL Damn you spell check!  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
