Job Discussion Forums

[johnslat]

Dear kev7161,

[anthyp]

What a joke this thread has become.

The same people whining about "racism in China!"

"The Chinese people are looking at me!" "Heeelllllllooooooooo!" Or gems like this:

[ilunga]

Interesting story talkdoc.
You've just made me think of something that happened last night which is quite the opposite of what you experienced. I would have probably forgotten about it otherwise.
I was at the KTV and went with my Chinese friend to the little shop to buy some beer and snacks. This guy is very different from your regular Henan guy. He's worked in Shenzhen so he likes to think he's a cut above the locals (so people tell me). It's hard for me to decipher what his attitude is like when he's speaking in Chinese.
Anyway, we went to pay for this beer. I got my wallet out and he said 'no, don't worry, i'll pay'. At this point an overweight, scruffy looking guy ('rough man' was my friend's description of him) who had been gawping at me said something to us.
My friend was very agitated by this. There was no confrontation but he was very riled by what had been said. He then proceeded to phone an acquaintance of his (a policeman) to come and take this man away.
I asked what he said that was so bad. Apparently he had shown his displeasure with my friend for paying for the beer. In his opinion the laowai should have paid.
Ok, this is a stupid, uneducated kind of attitude, and also none of his business whatsoever, but hardly a crime is it?

I don't know if he actually did get taken away. I can't imagine there was any grounds for him to be locked up. I wouldn't fancy bumping into this guy on the street though.

[Redfivestandingby]

As part of the 'dragging them into the 21st century', I try to teach them whenever possible that there are no races. We are one race: human. Many Chinese still believe in the very old idea of 3 races: black, white, and yellow. Most people around the world probably still believe in some variant of this concept. Many students have told me that they truly believe that their blood is different than non-Chinese as if we were different human species.

Have you seen the Denzel Washington movie 'Remember the Titans'? I showed this movie to one of my classes a while back and pointed out one of the players. I told them to look at his facial characteristics: small almond shaped eyes, roundish face, low nose bridge, thick lips, etc...common features that usually describe Asians. My students were horrified because the character in question was black. That's all they saw; the colour and how dare I compare them to black person.

Ace is totally right. China IS a multi-ethnic country. The longer you stay here the more you realize it. China brainwashes itself(either through government propaganda or ethnocentrism) into not recognizing this. A great example is the whole mutton BBQ thing. This is Middle Eastern in origin but most Chinese will say that it is Chinese not Middle Eastern even though they KNOW that the people selling it are mostly Muslim. I relate this to how Americans have assimilated Italian food. We know it's Italian but we consider it part of American foods.

Struelle, thank you for the website link. Wonderful!!! I'll be sure to pass it on to my students.

[LSP]

[Kurochan]

[kev7161]

Anthyp said: "China's about as racist as anyplace else."

And I believe I stated as much when I posted this as a prelude to the rest of my message:

"We have a large amount of REDNECKS in the USA that are homophobic, racist, wife-beating, deadbeats that, no matter what you say, will never change their mind about someone who is not white, male, and straight. These are the ones that comprise the lynch mobs (and yes there are still lynch mobs in the good ol' USA 2004), the zealots, and the bible-thumpers. "


Now, I can't speak for Ireland, the Czech Repulic, or Kenya as I've never visited those countries. However, I HAVE lived in the good ol' USA for all of my life (except for the past year, being here in China). But China is so proud that they've become part of the WTO and will host the 2008 Olympics (as well it should be). I'm not saying it is my job to educate ALL of China on how to come out of their shell and notice differences in the world around them, but I think as a human being who has a pretty fair amount of tolerence to other human beings (except for those aforementioned rednecks), I can teach a few in my time here what it means to be open-minded and accepting. It's akin to a missionary I think. I'm certainly not religious, but I can understand their desire to go out and educate the masses. I WANT my students to be successful and part of a modern world. I hope my being here and showing them how people are people regardless of their differences will enlighten them and make them want to become a better person. I can't speak for Anthyp or anyone else, but that makes my life a little more fulfilling.

[KOKO]

I love the attention the only weird thing is public bathrooms. I am a young guy and in good shape but i have never had so many people try to get a look at the goods in my life. They don't even hide it they just look. I laughed out loud as there is really nothing i could do and im not insecure about myself but man talk about funny. Hope they weren't disappointed.

[blackguy-n-Asia]

Kurochan-
Thanks for clearig that, I must have misunderstood.

KOKO -
I still get some people (chinese and others) trying to look at my snake when I go to the public washroom. It's another stereotype about the size of penises, but I didn't think guys (at least straight guys) would care about it that much!

In general, I think it would be responsible to lead by example, especially if you are teaching. Why keep people who do not have the benefit of multiculturalism in the dark? Even in Canada, or in the US, there are people who live by themselves in the midst of multiculturalism. If they behave in a certain way, why not give them another way to think about. It's not conversion, only stretching their minds.

anthyp- If you were singled out and insulted, and people like you (foreigner!) also treated as second -class, would you smile, bend over, and take it up the a$$? Or would you find ways (constructive) to deal with it? Racism, foreigner-ism, you're not from here-ism, is no joke, and people have been robbed and even die because of it.

[Norman Bethune]

[quote="Ace"]It really pisses me off to read a Westerner like Mr Bethune quoting the same kind of nonsense the Chinese would have us believe...

[Roger]

Some say, China is "multiethnic". Agreed - you must not contradict evidence.
But it is monocultural. All those "minority" (a derogatory term?) "cultures" are but "tolerated", lite versions of their former self before the Hans invaded their territories and impsed "socialism with Chinese characteristics".
And because of this Han-centeredness I do believe, CHinese are incurably racist.

[Ailian]

[anthyp]

[blackguy-n-Asia]

anythp you have a point. It's only first-hand experience in-country that can answer some of these questions, but foreigners have died in China and the Party knows how to whip up the mob ie. Japanese in 2003 or Africans in 1988 .


See you there in 2005

[Ruth]

Talkdoc - my husband and I have been out shopping with Chinese friends on several occasions where the seller tried to cut a deal with our companions. We get told about it after the fact. Once my husband was shopping with a student and the store-keeper told her that if she got my husband to buy something he (the store clerk) would give her a gift. I was shopping at the street market with a teacher who was bargaining prices for me. The seller asked her why she was siding with a foreigner instead of with the Chinese. My friend replied that she was my friend and they should not be trying to cheat me because I am a foreigner. I was in a supermarket with a teacher, buying a fan. The price was clearly marked on the item (65Y). This is not a store where one can bargain, so I was waiting for the sales slip to go pay. The teacher I was with was arguing with the store clerk. She told me later that he was telling her to tell me the price was 165Y and she could keep the extra money. WHAT!!! I can read a price tag, for goodness' sake. How stupid does he think I am. Apparently these kinds of exchanges happen a lot, but our companions don't always tell us.

I grew up very close to Toronto (Brampton for those who know the area). Doesn't surprise me a bit that the pool was 95% Chinese. As a previous poster said, there are pockets of nationalities in all large Canadian cities.

We are an oddity in our small Chinese town. The attention has brought me to tears on more than one occasion and I consider myself an intelligent, mature woman. Let me qualify that those were my emotionally low days and for the most part I love it here and am having a very positive experience. However, I share that because I cannot imagine how children will react to this. I have no direct experience with the Chinese and how they treat foreign children. Other posters in that situation will have to address it. When my kids were 12-13 they were having a tough time just dealing with normal life changes. Not sure how a kid that age would cope, along with all of the extra stuff being a foreigner in China entails. Folks we have developed relationships with treat us as people. Just people. And that feels good. On the street, however, it is a different matter.