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torentosan
Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 54
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 Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 8:42 pm Post subject: Public Schools |
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Hello all,
I have five years of ESL experience and have just got my state teaching license. I am ready to make the transition to better things.
I will make a grand stab at getting into a good international school, however the competition will be keen.
Therefore, my backup plan is to get into a public elementary school.
My question is for those who know, those who are there and who have knowledge of the way things go.
Do public schools there hire full-time foreign teachers and if so, are they paid more or the same as local school teachers?
I ask this question because it seems some countries do, some don't, and some have a system where foreigners just show up to teach a class or two. Also, it is hard to find the information quickly...
I appreciate any information you may have.. Thanks! |
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vabeckele
Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 439
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| Posted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 1:35 am Post subject: |
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You will be paid at least 5 times more than a local, but don't think this means you will be getting it easy. We, as foreigners, have our own special pricing index here in Vietnam.
Putting native English teachers into public schools is becoming more common and is actually also becoming the norm, at least here in Hanoi (how long it will last is another question).
From what I understand teachers will be spread across 2-4 different schools in any city. The pay will be hourly and a teacher will make between 1k-2k a month.
A couple of International and half way in between schools in Hanoi: UNIS, Hanoi Academy, Korean School, Kinderworld and Singapore International Schools, St Paul's American School, International School of Vietnam (ISV). There are quite a few more but I cannot remember the names, perhaps others will chime in. |
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Tigerstyleone
Joined: 26 Mar 2010
Posts: 181
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| Posted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:37 am Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| torentosan wrote: |
I have just got my state teaching license. I am ready to make the transition to better things.
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Better things? Do you think Vietnam will offer you something better?
By the way, what state is your license? Is it Florida by chance ? |
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torentosan
Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:15 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| Tigerstyleone wrote: |
| torentosan wrote: |
I have just got my state teaching license. I am ready to make the transition to better things.
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Better things? Do you think Vietnam will offer you something better?
By the way, what state is your license? Is it Florida by chance ? |
It's not Florida...Why? |
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TRH
Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 340
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:55 am Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| Tigerstyleone wrote: |
| By the way, what state is your license? Is it Florida by chance ? |
| torentosan wrote: |
| It's not Florida...Why? |
"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" said the wizard to Dorothy.  |
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Tigerstyleone
Joined: 26 Mar 2010
Posts: 181
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| Posted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:18 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| TRH wrote: |
| "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" said the wizard to Dorothy. |
Not a familiar quote from the novel.
And you're very good friends with Lizzy. |
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TRH
Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 340
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:12 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| Tigerstyleone wrote: |
| TRH wrote: |
| "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" said the wizard to Dorothy. |
Not a familiar quote from the novel.
And you're very good friends with Lizzy. |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWyCCJ6B2WE
Apparently I misquoted the movie. It seems to be: "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain-the greatest OZ has spoken."
Here's another quote from the movie:
Dorothy: How do you talk if you don't have a brain?
Scarecrow: Well, some people without brains do an awful lot of talking don't they?
And some encouragement for those seeking work permits without degrees:
Wizard: Why, anybody can have a brain. That's a very mediocre commodity. Every pusillanimous creature that crawls on the Earth or slinks through slimy seas has a brain. Back where I come from, we have universities, seats of great learning, where men go to become great thinkers. And when they come out, they think deep thoughts and with no more brains than you have. But they have one thing you haven't got: a diploma. |
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Tigerstyleone
Joined: 26 Mar 2010
Posts: 181
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| Posted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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Wizard of Oz = Summer School 2013 = Lower Secondary
Busted |
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RustyShackleford
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 449
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| Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| TRH wrote: |
And some encouragement for those seeking work permits without degrees: |
I certainly am no not one to equate university education with actually knowing anything, but let's not the encourage the J*ey Arn*lds of the country, shall we? |
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Oh My God
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 273
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| Posted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 11:18 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| TRH wrote: |
| But they have one thing you haven't got: a diploma. |
Commitment to being the great student of "all of the above" is what makes Great Comrades of the Pursuit of Education. |
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TRH
Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 340
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:23 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| RustyShackleford wrote: |
| I certainly am no not one to equate university education with actually knowing anything, but let's not the encourage the J*ey Arn*lds of the country, shall we? |
Not really taking a stand on the issue as I have a degree, but I found the quote amusing. Sorry to be out of touch but I don't get the "J*ey Arn*lds" reference.
Since this thread is nominally about Public Schools, I thought I would throw out a number I worked up. Based on the number of students in primary schools (and a dismal 76% national completion rate) and one foreign teacher for only one period per class per week, I postulate that the country will need about 6,800 teachers to fulfill the stated goal of placing foreign teachers in every class. This is with dropout rates of 25% applied from Elementary to Secondary and from Secondary to High School. This is just for placement in public schools and does not include language school employment (decreasing?) or the really top jobs which will be advanced instruction for local English teachers. The last mentioned could significantly increase the value of both significant experience and advanced qualifications like the DELTA.
Before I get jumped on for the obvious, I know there is a huge gap between publicly stated goals and reality in Vietnam. These numbers are just what could develop over the next ten or so years. I don't know how many western English teachers there are out there but I would guess it's a lot less then 6,800. |
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vabeckele
Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 439
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| Posted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:55 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| TRH wrote: |
| RustyShackleford wrote: |
| I certainly am no not one to equate university education with actually knowing anything, but let's not the encourage the J*ey Arn*lds of the country, shall we? |
Not really taking a stand on the issue as I have a degree, but I found the quote amusing. Sorry to be out of touch but I don't get the "J*ey Arn*lds" reference.
Since this thread is nominally about Public Schools, I thought I would throw out a number I worked up. Based on the number of students in primary schools (and a dismal 76% national completion rate) and one foreign teacher for only one period per class per week, I postulate that the country will need about 6,800 teachers to fulfill the stated goal of placing foreign teachers in every class. This is with dropout rates of 25% applied from Elementary to Secondary and from Secondary to High School. This is just for placement in public schools and does not include language school employment (decreasing?) or the really top jobs which will be advanced instruction for local English teachers. The last mentioned could significantly increase the value of both significant experience and advanced qualifications like the DELTA.
Before I get jumped on for the obvious, I know there is a huge gap between publicly stated goals and reality in Vietnam. These numbers are just what could develop over the next ten or so years. I don't know how many western English teachers there are out there but I would guess it's a lot less then 6,800. |
I didn't get that reference either...
Anyway, that analysis gives many of us some food for thought.
Personally, I don't see it happening. Namely, because of the lack of organisational skills; always fishy when one needs 'agents & recruiters' for state funded English lessons for the nation's youth. And then again, what would happen if schools were suddenly given budgets for this?
Until the highest value of being the richest and most callous is not seen as the ideal we are all going round in the same dull circles. I have heard of Vietnamese kids returning to these state run schools from long periods abroad in developed countries having to be pulled out because they 'disturb' the equilibrium of the status quo (history, Uncle Ho songs etc). And as parents can't afford international school fees... quite the conundrum. |
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Tigerstyleone
Joined: 26 Mar 2010
Posts: 181
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| Posted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| TRH wrote: |
one foreign teacher for only one period per class per week, |
This is not true. If you have a university diploma, a clean criminal record, are HIV free, a work permit, and a name tag then you teach 3-90 minute classes per week or two three hour classes per week, or something like that.
Why does TRH think he knows everything? |
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TRH
Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 340
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: Public Schools |
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| Tigerstyleone wrote: |
| TRH wrote: |
one foreign teacher for only one period per class per week, |
This is not true. If you have a university diploma, a clean criminal record, are HIV free, a work permit, and a name tag then you teach 3-90 minute classes per week or two three hour classes per week, or something like that.
Why does TRH think he knows everything? |
Not one class for the teacher. One teacher for one period for the class. I think everyone else got it. I tried to summarize without all the details but I assumed a 30 contact hour week for each teacher, a lot more than the 6 hours a week that you suggest. At your levels, it would take 34,000 individuals, not very likely. I teach in public schools and enjoy it but believe me, a 30 hour week, or 40 periods, with 50 students per class is not easy, but if one wants the work it is there. If the average were lower as it probably would be, then more teachers are needed. At a more realistic 20 hours a week, the number of teachers needed bumps over 10 thousand.
You have never explained your obsession with name tags. Are the rest of us not really teachers if we don't have name tags?  |
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