Job Discussion Forums

[fat_chris]

[veiledsentiments]

[trapezius]

How about Jordan?

Or is it too risky now with the Syrian situation next door?

[veiledsentiments]

Jordan seems to be fine, but there isn't a lot of work there. Morocco has significantly more possibilities for employment and private lessons.

VS

[ryanlogic]

[veiledsentiments]

No one should take a job in North Africa or the Levant expecting to save money or pay loans (except for the rare oil company jobs in Libya). They are jobs to get the experience to be able to be hired for the jobs in the Gulf that will do both. It is rather like teaching ESL in the US where you end up getting a few hours at 3 different community colleges and hopefully cover the rent each month. No salaries or benefits...

It is important that they make this clear on their website, as there are so many people who believe the hype about high pay in the Middle East... with no credentials or experience. The high pay in the Gulf is NOT at entry level where you are. If you are hired in language schools, there is no guarantee of how many hours you will get, as it depends on their student numbers... and you are paid hourly.

It is possible to make enough money to live on if you hustle. Get hours at a couple language schools and start building private lesson students. That is enough to live on in the local economy. Saving and paying loans doesn't come until you have moved up from entry level jobs.

One way to delay paying the education loans might be to be admitted to an MA program over the net. Not sure how many hours you would need to be carrying to avoid loan payments.

VS

[sicklyman]

[justcolleen]

Have you considered Egypt?

A HUGE community of converts live permanently - and easily - in Egypt as their primary purpose is hijra.

(And, actually, a wide assortment of Christians live in Egypt for religious reasons, too.)

My advice: Skip Saudi. You could make the same money, if not more, elsewhere. Have I asked if you've considered Egypt?

[justcolleen]

I came back to this thread to see of the OP had responded and noticed this:

[ryanlogic]

Maybe some others can elaborate on the skin color thing.

I understand that whiteness is revered, and I'm sure Africans fall into the lowest castes in places like Saudi. Akin to that, is the fact that black Muslim women have an extremely hard time getting married in the US.....

however, I've known several Saudis who were very black with "African" features... Furthermore, every single American that I have ever met that worked or studied in Saudi have been African American converts. None of which have complained about debilitating discrimination. In fact many have sung praises about the benefit of being a convert in the gulf.

I'm not saying the racism factor isn't very real, I'm just questioning the extent of which it would effect us.

My wife is light skinned and would very likely wear niqab if we with to Saudi (she would wear it here if I didn't discourage it)

Please, enlighten me with examples... Or clarify by outlining a some of the things that are likely to make my wife so miserable.

[ryanlogic]

I'm not convinced that the political situation is stable in Egypt.

We know people who have left there because if the conflicts and we even know of a mans brother who was shot and killed by riot police earlier in 2013. My mother would not sleep if she knew I was in Egypt. Even if the situation is overblown in the media, the bad PR would make my whole family try to pull some kind of intervention.

[ryanlogic]

I'm looking into Masters programs...

MA in education with concentration in TESOL would probably eliminate most if the what ifs and headache.

I don't know if I can get funded, but I'm going to apply to several programs and see if I can get a decent package. Struggling at home for two more years to solidify my resume seems like a better idea than struggling in an unpleasant and unfamiliar place for two years just to get two years experience.

If I can't get into a decent program with enough department resources to furnish tuition and a living stipend, I'll pursue the CELTA, and apply for jobs. I should at least try to get into a masters program with funding. If I can't get a TA slot, then I will try to get two years experience as mentioned in all the posts above. Even then, it may be wise to enter a masters program after those two years because the teaching experience would make me a very competitive applicant for teaching assistantships.

Can anyone recommend Masters programs stateside?

I'm positive that even if I get a MA Ed. SOMEONE is going to tell me that it isn't good enough and I should get a Phd. along with some pixie dust.

[SENTINEL33]

There are many places to do an MA in TESOL in the USA. All you have to do is google the subject and SHAZAM – all kinds of choices will appear.

You’d have to choose which one can best fit into your particular situation. You’ll have to do the research since you’re the only one with all the relevant facts. There are places you can do the entire MA online http://www.newschool.edu/m/matesol/?gclid=CP3i5ajIjbwCFUiN3god11QAIA and there places you can get an MA in a year.

There are 3 things to watch out for with regards an MA:

1- Be sure the program is given by an accredited institution. This is vital. I’m sure you know what “accreditation” means in this regard. Don’t even think of a commercial establishment. Also, take the shortest route possible. As I said, there are places where you can get an MA in a year…..most places, however , require a 2 or 3 year course of study…..that’s too long.

2. If you decide to do it online (which I don’t recommend – it’s too new), be aware that many institutions overseas, especially at the university level, will not recognize your online MA even if you got it at Harvard (which you can’t anyway). They simply won’t and that’s that. In 10 years, things may be different, but for right now, that’s the way it is in most places.

3. If you decide to stay in the field as a career, I suggest that an MA is essential for the long run. I’ve seen too many teachers roaming the world hobbled with all kinds of “certificates” from this place and that always getting hired last and getting the lowest salaries (and wondering why – although it’s always been perfectly clear to me why).

The British have a different take on all this. To them, an MA is nearly worthless for a variety of reasons I won’t go into here whereas for an American, an MA is about as high as you can go for a working degree. (A PhD in the field is really a research degree but what employers overseas want is teachers, not researchers).

I said above “if” you stay in the field an MA is almost a requirement anymore. However, I don’t believe you will stay in the field – not from a perusal of your comments on this thread. The commitment just isn’t there, in my opinion. It may be there later, but it isn’t there now. Your priorities appear to be counter- productive and counter intuitive to a serious and productive approach to a career in the field.

For one thing, several times, you’ve mentioned “debt” as an issue that preys on your mind . Without knowing details, it’s hard to comment here. Is it $5000 we’re talking about or is it closer to $50,000? Each one would require a different approach and strategy to solve the problem.

All I can say is if I were heavily in debt, my number one priority (barring none) would be to get out of debt as soon as possible.

Forget the MA, forget learning Arabic (you’re looking at a 10 year commitment *at least* to do that seriously), forget living close to the two Holy Abodes, forget everything. Do whatever it takes to get out from under. AFTER that, then you can plan more clearly.

Hope this helps (although it’s only the tip of the iceberg to what other things I might say with regard your situation.)

[CANDLES]

Dear Ryan,

1) Get CELTA + 2 years teaching experience, but I have known people to go to Saudi without any teaching experience, only CELTA and a degree.
2) If your wife isn't/doesn't want to work then it is going to be pretty difficult for her to go with you to Saudi as they only give a single status visa, until you get an Iqama, then you can call your wife over. This is generally for a duration of maybe 3 months. I say this, because married women who call their husbands over are given a 3 months visa.
3) If you call her over for Umra, then she will only be allowed to go directly to Jeddah for 3 weeks maximum. She will be allowed Jeddah and Medina only.
4) She will have to wear an abaya and a scarf when she is outside the compound/flat.
5) Praying- you can pray 5 times a day if you wish- all universities, colleges, schools have a prayer room.
6) Halal food- eat all you want including junk food. Everything is halal, including 'haribos sweets'.
7) Having an MA means a bit more money, but it's a 'prestige' thing for the Middle Eastern universities. They like the idea of having MA's, Phd's, etc to show on their brochure the calibre of people working for them.
Learning Arabic is difficult unless you already know it. There are plenty of schools that teach Koranic Arabic and some general Arabic.
9) I say difficult, because one is constantly talking in English and there is no chance to practice the Arabic language. Taxi drivers speak Urdu (from Pakistan/India), but some will speak Arabic.
10) Students (some) want to practice English rather than Arabic- we are there to teach them that after all.

Finally don't stress- it's one of the easiest jobs in the world. Enjoy it!

[ryanlogic]