Job Discussion Forums

[macula31]

Is this type of clause normal in contracts in China?

"Cancellation of Work Permit and Visa. In the event of early termination of the contract, and

according to the relevant authorities, the EMPLOYEE will forfeit to EMPLOYER the work permit

certificate and cancel the work visa. If the work permit certificate is not provided, the EMPLOYEE

has the right to withhold the EMPLOYEE’s last month salary until the above requirements are met."

[johntpartee]

I've never seen this in a contract. It really doesn't make sense. The employer would cancel the resident permit. That's probably what they mean, but you don't have to give them anything in order for them to do that.

[Bud Powell]

" '...the EMPLOYEE has the right to withhold the EMPLOYEE’s last month salary until the above requirements are met.' "

This doesn't make sense. Is there a typo in this line?

If you meant EMPLOYER in the first instance, I can say that I've seen similar weasel words, but not involving residence permits.

I was given an early release from a position and the FAO had my RP canceled. I think this sort of thing will become more and more common as schools feel the effects of revenue dry up. It's a dog-in-the-manger situation when you must deal with neanderthals.

[Zimmer]

[unclealex]

As far as I know, the authorities must have our passports in order to cancel the FRP and stamp it as such. This document allows us to stay in the country until the expiry date, but not legally work for another employer. Meanwhile, relocation requires registering with the proper PSB. (Hotels do that for us when we check in.) At that point we would be informed whether we must leave the country. And if so, we'd have to take our passports to the local Entry and Exit Bureau.

[muffintop]

[Javelin of Radiance]

[Bud Powell]

I am sure that an FAO or school owner can have your RP canceled without your permission if you don't turn in your passport. If you don't turn in your passport, they have a much more difficult time doing so. Worse, an employer can make your life a living hell to the point that you'll WANT to leave China.

However, if you give your passport to the FAO or employer, or if you accompany said poo-bah to the PSB, it will look as though you agree with the whole procedure. An FAO or school owner can do many things to make you comply with his wishes such as turning off your heat in the middle of winter if one lives on school-owned property.

[unclealex]

muffintop wrote:

unclealex wrote: As far as I know, the authorities must have our passports in order to cancel the FRP and stamp it as such. This document allows us to stay in the country until the expiry date, but not legally work for another employer. I don't think this is correct. Think about it for a moment....if what you said is true then unless you are kind enough to go to the PSB and let them cancel your RP...it can't be cancelled. I know this is China and logic goes out the window but I don't believe for a moment that we have that much control. Perhaps they have to have your passport to make it completely official but I am fairly sure they can cancel an RP with or without your passport in hand.

Like I said, it's the PSB which requires that the passport be submitted for the cancellation to be thoroughly processed. The employer can only notify the PSB that the employee has left the company or school and that the RP no longer extends together with the work permit and foreign experts certificate which have been cancelled. If the employee stays in China and registers as a resident elsewhere (at a hotel or a friend's apartment), he should should report to the local PSB to explain the circumstances. At that point he'll find out whether his employer had actually notified the PSB at all. (The work permit is cancelled through the labour board; the FEC through the FEB.) And if so, he could apply for a 30 day L (exit) Visa for enough extra time to either leave the country or apply for a new job and transfer the FRP, which, of course, normally requires the LOR. According to the expiry date on the FRP stamp, I don't see how anyone could be charged with overstaying if they leave the country by that time, unless the officials expect the foreign resident and former employee to submit their passports at the local PSB of their next destination in China. If I were in this situation, I would go to the PSB and inquire about my status instead of drawing an assumption.

[unclealex]

Bud Powell wrote:

I am sure that an FAO or school owner can have your RP canceled without your permission if you don't turn in your passport. If you don't turn in your passport, they have a much more difficult time doing so. Worse, an employer can make your life a living hell to the point that you'll WANT to leave China. However, if you give your passport to the FAO or employer, or if you accompany said poo-bah to the PSB, it will look as though you agree with the whole procedure. An FAO or school owner can do many things to make you comply with his wishes such as turning off your heat in the middle of winter if one lives on school-owned property.

School employers have no clout over the PSB and normally are apprehensive about having to deal with them in person to answer all their questions. I read on Chinacities that many employers don't even go to the PSB to report having cancelled the work permit and FEC through the labour board and Foreign Expert's Bureau. Last year a toddler was struck by a van and left on the road to be hit by two more vehicles. None of the drivers stopped; nor did any bystanders come to the aid of the child during this period - simply because nobody wanted to get involved with the police. It's the police we have to fear, not the employer.

[godmachine12]

Like I said, it's the PSB which requires that the passport be submitted for the cancellation to be thoroughly processed. The employer can only notify the PSB that the employee has left the company or school and that the RP no longer extends together with the work permit and foreign experts certificate which have been cancelled. If the employee stays in China and registers as a resident elsewhere (at a hotel or a friend's apartment), he should should report to the local PSB to explain the circumstances. At that point he'll find out whether his employer had actually notified the PSB at all. (The work permit is cancelled through the labour board; the FEC through the FEB.) And if so, he could apply for a 30 day L (exit) Visa for enough extra time to either leave the country or apply for a new job and transfer the FRP, which, of course, normally requires the LOR. According to the expiry date on the FRP stamp, I don't see how anyone could be charged with overstaying if they leave the country by that time, unless the officials expect the foreign resident and former employee to submit their passports at the local PSB of their next destination in China. If I were in this situation, I would go to the PSB and inquire about my status instead of drawing an assumption. [/size][/quote]

Well written and correct. Without your passport in hand, your employer can only notify the local PSB you are not longer employed by them. As I know, the RP would only be cancelled in absentia if you have committed, or are suspected of committing, a crime. Even the crime is debatable, but I believe it must be fairly serious in nature.

Just to add some information, my mate and I were both in the same situation. We both left our jobs and were told our RPs had been cancelled, we were now blacklisted, couldn't enter China again for five years, etc. Even though we knew it was bollocks, we still went to the PSB, enquired, told the story and the lady officer actually laughed and told us in spot on English, 'They can't cancel your residence permit just for quitting your job. That's ridiculous. You can stay here until the date of expiry.'

Take it as you will, but this has been my experience anyway. We've both left the country and come back in without issue as well.

[notnow]

[quote="godmachine12"][color=darkblue]my mate and I were both in the same situation. We both left our jobs and were told our RPs had been cancelled, we were now blacklisted, couldn't enter China again for five years, etc. Even though we knew it was bollocks, we still went to the PSB, enquired, told the story and the lady officer actually laughed and told us in spot on English, 'They can't cancel your residence permit just for quitting your job. That's ridiculous. You can stay here until the date of expiry.' /quote]

Had a mate in Shanghai who handed in his notice 6 months into a 12 month contract. School were ok with it but said they would cancel his FEC and RP straight away. They did cancel his FEC but, for some reason, forgot to cancel his RP. My mate didn't tell them thinking he'd save 400 RMB by not changing his work RP 6 months before it expired. So, 5 months later he tells the school his RP’s going to expire, he gets the paperwork, and heads off to the Entry Exit Bureau only to be fined 500 RMB for not having changed his RP when the FEC was cancelled.

[godmachine12]

So he went to another job and didn't transfer his RP? If so, only getting hit for 500 wasn't so bad.

[notnow]

godmachine12, he did some travelling. He got the fine for the 5 month delay

[godmachine12]

Oh, I see. The law is a bit murky on whether you can stay or not stay. Some people will tell you 'yes, but you can't work' and other will say 'you have to go once you've left your employer'. Honestly, I'm still not sure, but I've gone in and out of the country and not once have I been questioned. It looks I'm going to be okay till May. Fingers crossed anyway…