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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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 Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:04 am Post subject: HEP C revisited- again |
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Some of you who've been around for a long time may remember me writing about concerns with being HCV positive (healthy- just have the antigens) and worried about passing the medical exam.
Well I did pass it obviously (that was Guangzhou) and now I'm trying to relocate to Yunnan.
My advice if you have anything wrong with you: NEVER tell the FAO about it beforehand. I thought I'd be honest about it (I was asked if I had any chronic diseases) and I just got an email back saying that she called the Foreign Experts Bureau and they 'suggested' that she not hire me, and that she contacted the personnel department and they said 'no way.' My belief is that the FAO just didn't really want to hire me anyway and that was a good way to get around it. I was honest because it wasn't a problem here in GZ, so I didn't think it would be a problem in Yunnan either. And I bet my bottom Yuan it's not- it's either the FAO was opportunistic, o hypochondriac. or naive (or stupid like me). Of course if you tell people that the teacher you're considering has Hep C, they are not going to say, 'Oh great- that's who we were looking for!'
Two things, one: I was really stupid to divulge this info (so you should not) and two: has anyone with hep C or who knows anyone with it got a foreign expert certificate and is working with it in Yunnan? Apparently it's OK to be a student with Hep C but not a teacher!?
Like everything else in this country's rules and regulations (which frankly I've had it up to here with) you never get a straight answer, everything is vague, and you only find out at the last minute. Unless you have wads of cash (which I did not come here for). |
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likwid_777
Joined: 04 Nov 2012
Posts: 411
Location: NA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:09 am Post subject: |
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| Be careful, a guy I taught with when I was in China had what you have, and passed away soon after I returned home. I feel that if he was at home, in a better environment and with better medical care, he may still be here today. |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:54 am Post subject: |
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| likwid_777 wrote: |
| Be careful, a guy I taught with when I was in China had what you have, and passed away soon after I returned home. I feel that if he was at home, in a better environment and with better medical care, he may still be here today. |
Thanks but I am not sick. I've had antigens for at least 25 years and my liver was never abnormal. And that just proves my point- his illness (i.e. cirrhosis) must have surely been caught in the exam. I don't have anything but normal blood pressure and a good strong heart.
And please sir, I don't want to sign whiny, but really, the age of discrimination against lepers should be long over. It's called Hep C, H. C, HVC, or whatever- not the 'had what you have.'
In the news, supposedly China is nowhere near as strict as they used to be and discrimination against Hep. B carriers has ended. I can get a student visa with Hep. C, but not a foreign expert certificate (in Yunnan- supposedly). Gee, does HC make you dumb? |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:12 am Post subject: |
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my healthy certificate i had as a student in yunnan was the
same as for employment, shows that there were tests done for:
HBsAg
Anti-HCV |
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likwid_777
Joined: 04 Nov 2012
Posts: 411
Location: NA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:22 am Post subject: |
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| This was the same school which brought me over on a tourist visa and then failed to get the proper visa as promised. It's possible that something similar happened to my friend and he was not given the medical. Yes, you have Hep C, as did my friend. He was an IV user back in his day, and contracted it through such activity. Chain smoking along with Harbin air probably didn't help much either. |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:51 am Post subject: |
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| choudoufu wrote: |
my healthy certificate i had as a student in yunnan was the
same as for employment, shows that there were tests done for:
HBsAg
Anti-HCV |
Same for me in getting a Foreign Experts certificate. But like everyone I've read about, it obviously did not cause me a problem. I haven't read of someone NOT getting a visa for having HVC antigen but some might think that's because those denied didn't report it. Not me. If I don't get a visa based upon the presence of antigen (25 years now) and no disease at all, I'll report it everywhere I can as discrimination.
I realize one person's voice doesn't change much, but it's better than nothing. |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:00 am Post subject: |
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| likwid_777 wrote: |
| This was the same school which brought me over on a tourist visa and then failed to get the proper visa as promised. It's possible that something similar happened to my friend and he was not given the medical. Yes, you have Hep C, as did my friend. He was an IV user back in his day, and contracted it through such activity. Chain smoking along with Harbin air probably didn't help much either. |
Not to respond to you personally of course, but to the content, I've never seen a drug needle in my life. HCV stigmatizes people as probably 'dirty' (iv drug users and the like) and ignores two facts. One is that a whole generation of people my age have it (we got it before it was detectable), and they are just a bunch of average folks- my aunt has it, my ex-wife does not. A lot of aren't sure exactly how we got it. Perhaps through vaccination. Secondly, China has the highest incidence of hepatitis in the world by far. How are a few foreign college English teachers going to make things any worse? Heck, the other foreigner I work with is Hep B positive (he got it from his Chinese wife), and he has had no problems either.
I'm a pretty thick-skinned guy but I think I've had it. If I can't at least get a student visa in Yunnan I'm heading to Laos (perhaps). Humbly speaking, I'll apply my talents elsewhere. |
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likwid_777
Joined: 04 Nov 2012
Posts: 411
Location: NA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:14 am Post subject: |
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| Yeah I know, there is a stigma. Anthony Kiedis from the Chilli Peppers claims to have cured it by injecting "ozone". Also my friend's ex husband claims to have cured it by the natural therapy route, clean eating and all of that. Sorry to come off callous, just reminded me of my friend there, and no I was not suggesting that you contracted it in a similar fashion. It was just important to point out that, as we worked for a cowboy outfit, there is a large chance that he wasn't subjected to a medical test (or a thorough one). |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:50 am Post subject: |
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| likwid_777 wrote: |
| Yeah I know, there is a stigma. Anthony Kiedis from the Chilli Peppers claims to have cured it by injecting "ozone". Also my friend's ex husband claims to have cured it by the natural therapy route, clean eating and all of that. Sorry to come off callous, just reminded me of my friend there, and no I was not suggesting that you contracted it in a similar fashion. It was just important to point out that, as we worked for a cowboy outfit, there is a large chance that he wasn't subjected to a medical test (or a thorough one). |
No, it's great that you're bringing it up. Like I said, my fellow teacher has Hep B antigen and he's OK too. China has been stopping discrimination against hep carriers.
The bottom line, as far as I know, is that if you get a 'healthy' stamp you're OK- as long as you don't have HIV or any of the STD's. I don't think they want people dying here, but clearly I'm healthy as is my co-worker.
Maybe the FAO had an agenda- whatever that was- and blocked the process. I'm going to work on this with my FAO here and find out if I can find out more info on policy differences between the provinces. |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:42 am Post subject: |
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| bluetortilla wrote: |
| Maybe the FAO had an agenda- whatever that was- and blocked the process. I'm going to work on this with my FAO here and find out if I can find out more info on policy differences between the provinces. |
maybe it just never came up before and the FAO didn't know what to do.
you did the worst thing possible.....you offered information.
she then did the even worst thing possible....she asked a bureaucrat for
advice/permission.
and it went like this..................fao calls zhou liubao at experts bureau. old
zhou never had this come up. sure, plenty of foreigners have fatty liver,
but his office never had one test positive on one of the blood (!!!) tests.
old zhou don't know nothing 'bout blood, so he sure ain't gonna take
responsibility. zhou don't say no, zhou don't say yes. zhou says maybe
better not.
fao then calls the school's hr department, says we got this laowai with some
crazy laowai disease, and the expert office says better not to hire him.
what shall we do? "unnnn..." says the lady hired cause her brother knew
the wife of the second cousin of the schools third party secretary, "...maybe
we better pass. tell the laowai the expert bureau says no. got any other
monkeys on file?" |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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| choudoufu wrote: |
you did the worst thing possible.....you offered information.
she then did the even worst thing possible....she asked a bureaucrat for
advice/permission. |
Boy you got that right. Neither of us showed any respect at all for the 'discretion is the better part of valor' thing. She wrote me a long sobbing email later saying sorry for messing things up so badly and that she had no experience at this sort of thing.
| choudoufu wrote: |
tell the laowai the expert bureau says no. got any other
monkeys on file?" |
Yeah, another great point. Don't be too intellectual at a job interview (that's another school, another story). Don't let them know that you can actually think critically and analytically. IMO, as long as China, like almost everywhere else in the dingbat Biffy Boffy TEFL world, keeps this degrading contractual system in place, high quality teachers who do their work with sincerity and love will be few. And that is true.
I did come here to study; specifically for that reason. I've made great headway in the HSK over the past year and thought I'd keep financing my studies through Z visas. Maybe it's time to give 'em all the middle finger as it were and just enroll in school. If THEY scream blood terror virus then I guess it's the slow march out of China. Sad stuff (I say for everyone involved, not just me). |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| choudoufu wrote: |
and it went like this..................fao calls zhou liubao at experts bureau. old
zhou never had this come up. sure, plenty of foreigners have fatty liver,
but his office never had one test positive on one of the blood (!!!) tests.
old zhou don't know nothing 'bout blood, so he sure ain't gonna take
responsibility. zhou don't say no, zhou don't say yes. zhou says maybe
better not.
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I talked to my current FAO today and she brought my health certificate up on the computer. She said that is the ONLY document she got from the hospital and the only document that goes to the FEB.
The document basically says "Healthy" and has the doctor's name and the hospital's stamp on it. There no details of what tests were done or the results. So neither the FEB, the FAO, nor anyone else except the doctor knows the details of your health check. She said she's pretty sure it's the same all over China.
I hope that's useful info to somebody.
So if you like China you need to put up living with uncertainty or having a clear answer on just about anything. Oh yes, and learning to keep your mouth shut. All part of the fun. At least my experience has been a great motivator to get the h*** out of contractual 'Foreign Expert' working. At least for now! (OxO) |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:50 am Post subject: |
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check your healthy certificate booklet, page 5.
there you will find a list of the lab tests and the results. |
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bluetortilla
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 815
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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| choudoufu wrote: |
check your healthy certificate booklet, page 5.
there you will find a list of the lab tests and the results. |
Really? I was never given a 'healthy certificate booklet.' So the FEB and FAO should have a copy of this booklet too?
All I was given (briefly- not it's in the FAO's safe) was my Foreign Expert's Certificate. Thanks though. The suspense gets more suspended... |
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