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RWA1981
Joined: 27 Mar 2014
Posts: 143
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 Posted: Mon May 26, 2014 3:59 am Post subject: Touchy Tax Scam Subject Hit A Nerve Today In China ESL World |
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You guys were right. My school has been pocketing our taxes. I talked with one of the more veteran teachers who broached the subject just an hour ago after we finished a staff meeting. No sooner than she asked for an itemization of all her payroll deductions, she was quickly ushered into the Administrator's office. When she came out 15 minutes ago, I asked her what happened, and she said she "could not talk about it". I then asked her if my suspicions were right and she just nodded.
Now what? Can we get all that money back somehow? Do we wait for the school year to end and get our final checks before we bitch, or do we go to the tax authorities now? They have been deducting 20% of our pay for a year and that adds up to quite a few bucks. Advice? |
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Bud Powell
Joined: 11 Jul 2013
Posts: 1736
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2014 4:28 am Post subject: |
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| Gee. Your plight just gets worse. Have you considered leaving China? |
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RWA1981
Joined: 27 Mar 2014
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2014 4:57 am Post subject: |
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| Bud Powell wrote: |
| Gee. Your plight just gets worse. Have you considered leaving China? |
Its not just me Bud, there are 7 expat teachers who all got whacked with these phony taxes. You know my situation, I got a rottern recruiter from the start who put me with a cheap school. Come September I will be fine. But for now, what is your advice to recover this stolen 20%. Do we make noise now while we have the leverage of parents or after final pay day. Only 2 of the 7 teachers will be returning next year. |
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Banner41
Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 656
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2014 9:18 am Post subject: |
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| RWA1981 wrote: |
| Bud Powell wrote: |
| Gee. Your plight just gets worse. Have you considered leaving China? |
Its not just me Bud, there are 7 expat teachers who all got whacked with these phony taxes. You know my situation, I got a rottern recruiter from the start who put me with a cheap school. Come September I will be fine. But for now, what is your advice to recover this stolen 20%. Do we make noise now while we have the leverage of parents or after final pay day. Only 2 of the 7 teachers will be returning next year. |
Seems to me you are just not cut out for this business. It's always one thing or another with you. So much information is readily available as another poster pointed out but apparently you didn't do your research before you came.
Walk down to the local tax office which was recommended many times before and ask for a print-out. It takes five minutes. Present it to the school and politely ask about your taxes because you need to file them at home.
I can't wait until September when you will be fine. WE ALL want you to be fine........Seriously...... |
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The_Kong
Joined: 15 Apr 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2014 11:59 am Post subject: Re: Touchy Tax Scam Subject Hit A Nerve Today In China ESL W |
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| RWA1981 wrote: |
Now what? Can we get all that money back somehow? Do we wait for the school year to end and get our final checks before we bitch, or do we go to the tax authorities now? They have been deducting 20% of our pay for a year and that adds up to quite a few bucks. Advice? |
I don't get how you think you will personally end up with the money in the end.
Aren't you screwed either way? I'm pretty sure your not going to see a dime of that money.
Let's say you are 100% correct in that the school has been skimming 20% off your salary and pocketing it instead of paying taxes.
So you go to the tax bureau and report them, how does that get you the money? You think the tax bureau is going to demand your school give you the money the school should have been giving to the government???
If what you say is true the school is breaking the law, but that doesn't mean somehow they will have to reimburse you personally for taxes they should have but didn't pay.
Unless, of course, your also claiming that they were taking 20% when they really should have been taking say 10%, in which you case you should, but I doubt you ever will, see the difference they shorted you. |
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thebroformerlyknownaschou
Joined: 09 May 2014
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2014 12:12 pm Post subject: Re: Touchy Tax Scam Subject Hit A Nerve Today In China ESL W |
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| RWA1981 wrote: |
You guys were right.
Now what? Can we get all that money back somehow? |
maybe.
are you 100% legal? do you have a proper z-visa? do you have an
RP & FEC tied to YOUR school in YOUR city? is YOUR school authorized to
hire foreign teachers?
what is the exact wording in your contract? have they been deducting
20% from what they are contractually obligated to pay you? or is this
the difference from what some recruiter promised you'd earn?
if your papers aren't in order, you likely have no recourse. you could
report them, but that's like calling 9-1-1 because your dealer cut
your dope with baby laxative. |
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fat_chris
Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3198
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 5:26 am Post subject: Re: Touchy Tax Scam Subject Hit A Nerve Today In China ESL W |
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| thebroformerlyknownaschou wrote: |
| you could report them, but that's like calling 9-1-1 because your dealer cut your dope with baby laxative. |
+1
Warm regards,
fat_chris |
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fat_chris
Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3198
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 5:27 am Post subject: |
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| Banner41 wrote: |
| RWA1981 wrote: |
| Bud Powell wrote: |
| Gee. Your plight just gets worse. Have you considered leaving China? |
Its not just me Bud, there are 7 expat teachers who all got whacked with these phony taxes. You know my situation, I got a rottern recruiter from the start who put me with a cheap school. Come September I will be fine. But for now, what is your advice to recover this stolen 20%. Do we make noise now while we have the leverage of parents or after final pay day. Only 2 of the 7 teachers will be returning next year. |
Seems to me you are just not cut out for this business. It's always one thing or another with you. So much information is readily available as another poster pointed out but apparently you didn't do your research before you came.
I can't wait until September when you will be fine. WE ALL want you to be fine........Seriously...... |
Also +1. Also...seriously.
Warm regards,
fat_chris |
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RWA1981
Joined: 27 Mar 2014
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 10:43 am Post subject: |
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| We went to the tax office today and the "school" is licensed as a "learning center" and only authorized to hire "one foreign consultant" and there were no taxes paid for the one single foreigner who they listed as "part time". I guess we should have waited until after pay day to deal with this. |
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thebroformerlyknownaschou
Joined: 09 May 2014
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 11:59 am Post subject: |
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| RWA1981 wrote: |
| I guess we should have waited until after pay day to deal with this. |
bro, there is no 'dealing with this.'
you are an illegal employee. your work visa (if you have one) and your
RP (if you have one, too) were illegally procured. without seeing the
papers, i'd bet they were sponsored (if you have them) by one of your
school director's friends who runs a school in a more legally lax province.
you have no recourse. (see: baby laxative!)
wanna push it? go for it, bro. the school might wind up paying a moderately
harmonious fine.......or not, if the director has guanxi.
regardless, you no have guanxi. you will be picked up, fined, deported.
say bye-bye to that high-paying job lined up for september.....and have
fun moving the family with 10 day's notice. |
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Bud Powell
Joined: 11 Jul 2013
Posts: 1736
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| A fellow told me that there's a government agency that visits FTs who complain nonstop... |
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fat_chris
Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3198
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Bud Powell wrote: |
| A fellow told me that there's a government agency that visits FTs who complain nonstop... |
Oh!
Warm regards,
fat_chris |
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Guerciotti
Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 842
Location: In a sleazy bar killing all the bad guys.
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2014 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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Dear RWA1981,
Yes, the school cheated you and your friends. You have a right to be angry.
However, (as others have eloquently stated in various ways):
You won't get the money back. It would be paid as taxes. The difference you are entitled is not worth the risk.
You are illegal. Doesn't matter how you came to find yourself in this position, you simply are. And making yourself a nuisance at the various official offices only puts you and your friends in danger of being fined and exported at your cost. You are first in line should they need to make an example of someone. If they decide to do so, no amount of explaining will change their mind. So step out of the 'kick me' line. Please?
Don't put yourself in harm's way on principle. You are risking the new job for nothing other than principle and neither you nor I can afford that.
Yes it sucks. It's not fair. But you cannot change it, so look forward. Look ahead.
You have that sweet position waiting for you. Don't risk it for - what? about 8k RMB? It's academic cause you ain't getting it anyway.
You admirably dug yourself out of a bad place with your job starting September. Don't throw it away.
Start that new gig and I'll bet dollars to donuts you'll be a different man by December.
Every last one of us clowns here wants you to win. You have arranged a win starting September. Keep it. Stop calling attention to your illegal self with the powers that be.
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RWA1981
Joined: 27 Mar 2014
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Wed May 28, 2014 12:35 am Post subject: |
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| You are probably right about not getting the money back but I did finally get my Z visa from a new employer - so I am not "illegal" as you say. If the school hired me "illegally" that does not make me "illegal". Since I can't afford to be with my family this summer, I will have a lot of extra time on my hands and I will use a good part of it to read up on China's labor and employment laws. I hope they are not as convoluted and subjective as the visa laws. I think it all comes down to "selective enforcement". |
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The_Kong
Joined: 15 Apr 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Wed May 28, 2014 1:59 am Post subject: |
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| RWA1981 wrote: |
| You are probably right about not getting the money back but I did finally get my Z visa from a new employer - so I am not "illegal" as you say. If the school hired me "illegally" that does not make me "illegal". Since I can't afford to be with my family this summer, I will have a lot of extra time on my hands and I will use a good part of it to read up on China's labor and employment laws. I hope they are not as convoluted and subjective as the visa laws. I think it all comes down to "selective enforcement". |
Huh?
Your in China and you got a new Z-visa instead of transferring/renewing your residence permit?
How does that work?
You may be wrong too, unfortunately if the school hired you illegally that would by sheer logic suggest that you are here illegally. However, the local PSB would maybe take pity on you since, if your claims are true, you were unaware.
Or they may just throw you out of the country anyways, never know! |
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