| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
jimpellow
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 913
|
 Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:17 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| Bud Powell wrote: |
| jimpellow wrote: |
| Bud Powell wrote: |
| jimpellow wrote: |
In seriousness, it is another hurdle and cost which the Chinese have heaped upon the ESL teacher. |
I disagree. A two-week course in lieu of two years teaching experience? I don't think that it's unfair at all.
I do agree with you, however, that it will do nothing to increase the competency among FTs, especially if the new graduate was at the bottom of his class. |
I see your point Bud. But what if one already holds a TEFL, CELTA etc but lacks two years verifiable experience? The way I have read others report it on the Web, they were required to take the Chinese version too. How much of a put off would it have to be to get a CELTA, teach a year in Korea, then apply to a job in say Beijing and find out you will also be required to pay and do this? If the requirement were no two years nor recognized TELF, then I am in agreement with you. But that is not what it seems to be, at least in the locales I have heard mentioned implementing this. |
Guess what? Before I could teach in ANY post-secondary institution in the U.S., I was required to complete a BA, a masters degree program AND acquire two years experience teaching.
Guess how much sympathy I have for those who can't get a job in China because they fall short of their own home country's requirements.
Being allowed to teach is not a birthright. It is a privilege. |
So Bud goes through with the teacher certification process in New York which is vigorous as outlined above. Then Bud wishes to move to the Carolinas like most of Upstate New York, but South Carolina will not accept his New York teaching credentials. Thus Bud has to restart the process to gain the credentials for the privilege of teaching in South Carolina. Will Bud still pursue teaching as a profession in South Carolina?
So I am talking about reciprocity of teaching TEFL certifications which this latest requirement fails to recognize. Or at least from what I have read.
The stated goals of the new visa regulations were to tighten security, stop abuses, and streamline the process to attract qualified people for the "privilege" of working in China. They seem to be doing a much better job on implementing the first two than the last. Cheers |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
wonderingjoesmith
Joined: 19 Aug 2012
Posts: 910
Location: Guangzhou
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 3:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jimpellow wrote: |
......................................................................
Think the delusion comes from their worship of testing scores. Little Emperor gets a high score on a Chinese state English exam and parents are convinced he can produce English. 75% of my prep students would leave class after opening bell and sit next door and memorize brain dumps for IELTS. One scored an 8.5 on listening but if I asked him what he ate for lunch a look of utter bewilderment overcame him. Parents would pay off the teachers and headmaster thinking this was the way. Doctor Dingbat who headed that program was too stupid and weak to back the foreign teachers to get them back in the classroom. The Chinese IELTS prep classes they attended were even funnier. But it was the Chinese way!
That is why I say I laugh about this new Chinese TEFL. Foreigners paying money to learn to teach language through rote. |
I sense the Chinese requirement is related to the country's approach to education which is well mentioned above. What I've seen with locals is that many appear to be task oriented lacking overall prospective. This attitude may well affect the schooling in the nation. Sadly enough some Chinese study to go abroad and preparing them will probably be more difficult than it has been under the circumstances that require foreigners to adjust further here. How much happier western unis will be with all the tuition fees collected remains to be seen there.
By the way, I am wondering how connected is the western TEFL organization to this "Chinese TEFL" and how much they both share in a sense of academics and profits in case they are cooperating. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bud Powell
Joined: 11 Jul 2013
Posts: 1736
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jimpellow wrote: |
So Bud goes through with the teacher certification process in New York which is vigorous as outlined above. Then Bud wishes to move to the Carolinas like most of Upstate New York, but South Carolina will not accept his New York teaching credentials. Thus Bud has to restart the process to gain the credentials for the privilege of teaching in South Carolina. Will Bud still pursue teaching as a profession in South Carolina?
|
New York certification is accepted in both North and South Carolina AFAIK. Cerification is more stringent in NY and in Florida. I believe that Florida requires a teacher to pass the Praxis II test as well as Praxis I. I've been out of the public school system for awhile, so I don't know.
I'm not sure that all TEFL programs are created equal. Since I am an MA level teacher, I've never been required to take any TEFL courses. That could change, though. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kungfuman
Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 1749
Location: In My Own Private Idaho
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 5:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
I would call shenanigans on this. And please do tell us what guarantee you have of a decent job waiting for you after pay a fortune for a basically worthless online certificate that proves exactly nothing?
So you are going to believe a person that you never met when they tell you that by paying them 4800y they have the power to bypass the Chinese government lay requiring a person to have 2 years experience in order to get a working visa?
And you should pay them by sending the money via Western Union I presume?
Come on are you all morons? Wake up and smell the scam  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
thechangling
Joined: 11 Apr 2013
Posts: 276
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| kungfuman wrote: |
I would call shenanigans on this. And please do tell us what guarantee you have of a decent job waiting for you after pay a fortune for a basically worthless online certificate that proves exactly nothing?
So you are going to believe a person that you never met when they tell you that by paying them 4800y they have the power to bypass the Chinese government lay requiring a person to have 2 years experience in order to get a working visa?
And you should pay them by sending the money via Western Union I presume?
Come on are you all morons? Wake up and smell the scam |
Yep sure is. Wake up and smell the Scam Scam Scam Scam! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jimpellow
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 913
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
"Come on are you all morons? Wake up and smell the scam"
A moron is someone who does not read up on the topic first but simply makes statements based on his present internal paradigms. The type who generally is the easiest to scam. Objectively the Chinese TEFL is a scam considering its understood lack of quality and inappropriateness to the base issue (lack of experience). Yet it does exist and will most likely be further expanded. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bud Powell
Joined: 11 Jul 2013
Posts: 1736
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm not sure that it's a scam. The guy I knew who had to take it was fresh out of school. He had taken no TEFL course whatsoever prior to his arrival. He had absolutely no sense of classroom procedure, and he seemed to be at a loss for what he was supposed to do.
I haven't heard of anyone with a western TEFL certificate being required to take another Chinese TEFL course. Is this really happening? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jimpellow
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 913
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Bud Powell wrote: |
I'm not sure that it's a scam. The guy I knew who had to take it was fresh out of school. He had taken no TEFL course whatsoever prior to his arrival. He had absolutely no sense of classroom procedure, and he seemed to be at a loss for what he was supposed to do.
I haven't heard of anyone with a western TEFL certificate being required to take another Chinese TEFL course. Is this really happening? |
It really depends on what your definition of a scam is. Not in the sense that the posters a few posts above state. Here it is:
http://tefl.chinajob.com/
It clearly states that the TELF in China certification will allow a person in China to have the two years experience waived if they possess it. It does not directly state that another TEFL without the two years experience will be acceptable. That is implied and an adept search engine user will find examples that it is not.
My beef with it is consistent with my original arguments. It is a scam as accredited TEFLs are supposed to have reciprocity, but the Chinese have ignored this and it has become another expense-hurdle for an ESL teacher to make. This is especially true, for example, if they do already possess a TEFL and a year experience. Even if one possesses nothing it is at the least odd that a classroom based TEFL is what is being used to replace two years of classroom experience.
I have no idea on the quality. They do SHOW foreign trainers. My assumption is that if the course itself is actually ok at present, it will deteriorate as this program expands.
Beyond the tuition and lost time in a salaried position, the student is responsible for hotel and such. Thus, a new teacher interested in Beijing needs to pay for this, airfare, a pre health check and A CBR which requires sign-offs from the home and Chinese governmental authorities amongst other things. Like I said they are really piling it on for the ESL teacher, the vast majority of whom will be earning modest salaries.
It is no wonder that although I have not put my resume out there in over a year, my mailbox is flooded everyday with promises of fun times teaching in places like Beijing for a whopping 8000 a month.
This TEFL in China has been around a while it seems. I am of the opinion that the school which offered this had the guanxi and the promise of kickbacks to the governmental lao da who were the masterminds of this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
