Job Discussion Forums

crt999 · Joined: 03 Jun 2014 Posts: 2

So I am planning on moving to China in about 3 months. I have already started applying to jobs and working with recruiters. However, the more information I get the more confused and frustrated I get. I have been offered a position at Kid Castle in Shanghai. The recruiter made it sound great of course but after everything I've read online I don't really trust them. I have been researching this company and found some bad reviews but also some really good reviews. I just don't know what to do! Does any one have any information on Kid Castle or recommendations for good schools to work for? Any help would be very appreciated.

vikeologist · Joined: 07 Sep 2009 Posts: 600

1. Don't use recruiters, but I suppose you're not going to take my advice, so

2. Why do you want to start with a language mill like Kidcastle? It's not necessarily a bad move. There's lots of very successful teachers in China, (and also myself) started with mills, and there are some good ones. I'm just curious why you think it's the right move for you.

3. You say you've heard bad things about Kidcastle, but there are a lot of Kidcastles. For instance Kidcastle Xian is maybe a frontrunner for the worst school to work for in China, but it turns out there are lots of Kidcastles just in Xian, and maybe it's just one that's bad, so I'm sure it's the same deal in Shanghai.

That said, I seem to remember hearing positive things about the Shanghai branches; for instance here; http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=105498

The posters there are recent enough that you could probably send them a message.

To finish, (and forgive a bit of bluntness) I realise that you might want to work for a mill. I realise that you might want to use a recruiter, but it's completely beyond me why you would need to use a recruiter to apply for a job at Kidcastle.

crt999 · Joined: 03 Jun 2014 Posts: 2

1. I'm looking for advice so why wouldn't I take yours? I'm completely new at this so I'm looking for any help I can get. I don't know the best way to get a job and that's why I posted my question.

2. I don't want to work in a language mill. I;m not going out of my way to work for one. That's a job I'm being offered and I want to make sure it will be ok. I never said it was the right move for me, it's something being presented to me.

3. I think the fact that there are so many Kid Castle's is what is making this the most difficult. In one place I will read a review saying they are the best and it was a great experience. Another 5 places I read reviews saying they are the worst places ever. It's confusing.

I think you misunderstood me. I don't necessarily want to work for a mill or use a recruiter. I'm trying to figure all this out and what the best way to find a good job is, whether that means using a recruiter or working at Kid Castle. I just don't know.

vikeologist · Joined: 07 Sep 2009 Posts: 600

Sometimes I feel like I'm the sock puppet for Raoul's China Saloon, but as an intro to the options available to new teachers, this is the best summary / thread I've seen. Of course, it's only 1 viewpoint. (I'm going to go out on a limb and say Raoul was not pro-Kidcastle) Smile

As with everything you have to weigh all the different points of view up.

http://raoulschinasaloon.com/index.php?topic=71.0

you're not the first person to ask these questions. have a look at this

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?p=1130055&highlight=#1130055

doogsville · Joined: 17 Nov 2011 Posts: 924 Location: China

Language mills are not all bad. Some of them may seem the very bowels of Hell, but they can be a good introduction to living and working in China. The main problem as I see it, is the owners are totally focused on making money, and care nothing for the product they provide nor the people providing it. A lot of them seem barely able to put their underwear on the right way round without a lot of help. They're happy to suck in and grind out both teachers and students, as long as they keep making money.

They can also be useful places to hone your teaching skills and present you with a range of ages and abilities to develop your teaching practice. The better ones provide legal paperwork and accommodation, and often have someone who can almost speak English to help you with the things you need to do to make daily life easier. The hours are often unsociable, but at least you get to hang out with a bunch of other random 'foreigners' who have the same unsociable hours you do. The biggest drawback seems to be that finding a good one is like playing Russian roulette. Even the big, established and supposedly professional outfits seem to have at least a few bad apples in their respective barrels

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

Kid Castles are as variable as the franchisees.
At the risk of boring regulars, I recommend get a nice little uni or vocational gig doing Oral English for 5000-5500 per month, with accom provided, max 18 hours pw contact and airfare refund or allowance of 10K after 10 months.
Look at language schools/KC etc as a moonlighter on Saturdays.
Best

mw182006 · Joined: 10 Dec 2012 Posts: 310

How long have you been considering this move? It took me a couple years to finally take the plunge and during that time I was scouring Dave's and other forums to get a basic feel of what I was in for. Ultimately it's always going to be a roll of the dice, but if you dive right in to job posts and recruiters without knowing your options you might be setting yourself up for some difficulty. I don't know if that's the case for you, but you said you're completely new and also considering a job you don't really want.

thechangling · Joined: 11 Apr 2013 Posts: 276

wangdaning · Joined: 22 Jan 2008 Posts: 3154

Think of language mills like fast food chains and it might be more clear why there is such a difference. Service, staff, management, and customers vary wildly.

doogsville · Joined: 17 Nov 2011 Posts: 924 Location: China

It occurs to me that rather than focusing on ESL specific sites that carry job ads, many of which are from recruiters rather than schools, it might be better to look at the many city specific sites that exist. A lot of 'expat' sites in the cities carry job adverts too, often directly from schools. They would also have the advantage that you can ask on the board for information about the school itself. You might get first hand information from people who work/have worked at the school, or at least from people who have some idea of the schools reputation. You would also get a picture of what life is like in that particular city for foreigners.

I got my first two jobs in China from the job board here on Dave's. The first was a disaste. I turned up on a tourist visa to find the promised Z visa conversion was impossible. I naively didn't do any research on the school but took it on trust. The second was in a language mill that had an okay to poor reputation on Dave's forums, and turned out to be okay to work for, but just barely. It gave me a platform to work from though, and now I have a great job in a university which only advertises on local expat forums.

Bud Powell · Joined: 11 Jul 2013 Posts: 1736

DAYTIME: It's really difficult to contact schools directly from the west. One may THINK he's dealing directly with the school, only to learn upon arrival that the school allows the recruiter to use a school email address to give the appearance that he's a school employee. Unless one can walk into the employer's office, he cannot be sure who he's dealing with.

The mantra that "recruiters are bad" is getting old.