Job Discussion Forums

[Capt Lugwash]

I won't attach a poll to this but I would be interested to hear opinions from people as to how much harder it is teaching than simply sitting and being a student in the class.

As I suspect others may have done, when I was a student I thought the teachers/lecturers did bugger all. Once I started teaching I realised how much harder it was to be at the front of the class instead of with my backside planted on a seat.

But how much harder do you think it is (if at all)? I would appreciate answers to be of the order of one class teaching = two classes as a student etc. I have my own opinion and answer but I am interested in others. Many of my students go on to be teachers and it would be handy to get more input.

[wangdaning]

I think it depends on the nature of the class. If it is more lecture based, definitely easier being the student. You really only have to listen and take notes, maybe through out the odd question if something is unclear. That doesn't really mean it is difficult for the teacher though. If they know what they are doing it should be a simple matter of delivering the material.

If it is a more interactive class, again, really would depend. If the students are eager and participate in the activities, easier for the teacher. Again though, not really difficult for the students. If the students are less than eager, it sucks for everyone, but especially the teacher who ends up in front of a class of non-students.

So, it varies.
Lecture maybe T-1 /S-2
Interactive w/ eager students T-1/S-1
Interactive w/ unmotivated students T-2/S-5

[Bud Powell]

Preparation fior class was much more tortuous than working as a teacher MOST OF THE TIME. When I was in school, I was carrying 15-18 hours (undergrad) and 12 hours (Masters) per week. With each class requiring a lot of writing as well as reading and taking well over six hours prep per class, being a student was much more harrowing.

Teaching university on the MA (lecturer) level in the U.S. is time consuming when paper correcting and grading time comes. Generally, a lecturer will teach one subject: writing. Figure 20 hours in class, 22-25 students per class: that's approximately 80-100 papers to read, correct and grade. You can go with peer review to cut down the correcting time, but you're still stuck with reading and correcting over 80 papers 3-4 times per semester. It's not particularly intellectually challenging. It's drudgery. That's just the paper correcting. Preparing a new class every day can be time consuming.

In Chinese universities, the difficulty and demands of teaching depends upon a lot of factors: resources, how well the resources match student abilities, the size of the classes, and the number of different subjects I'll teach. I refuse to teach more than two subjects, and only ONE of those classes can be writing.

Teaching in China becomes easier with time because I now have a lot of handouts to cover most things that I'll teach. I prefer teaching in China for the lighter work load and the fact that I can avoid the insane politics and posturing of American Academia. After 12 years in one university and successfully negotiating a new three year contract every cycle (e.g., not being fired because some moron graduate faculty member wants his cousin's daughter to have a job) one can pull down an average of $45,000- $60,000 per year. I'm not sure that the BS is worth it in the short run. In the long run, it's worth putting up with it because there's usually a state retirement plan.

To make a long story interminable, I'd say that being a student was always more difficult than teaching, as long as I didn't have to create a curriculum from thin air.

[Blingcosa]

Dunno man, teaching sure ain't easy (at least not for me), but when I'm learning Mandarin, I feel being a student is much more difficult than being the teacher

[Voyeur]

So hard to make an apples-to-apples comparison. Generally speaking, the actual classroom time is more onerous on a teacher because he must perform. If a lesson is too difficult for a student, or he is not into it that day, he usually has the option of simply becoming passive and letting the clock run out in class (but, if he aims to succeed, making up for that time with self-study later). Teachers typically do not have that option.
But when you factor in preparation (for students and teachers), assignments (writing or grading), and class design for teachers, we start to get too many variables.

[Capt Lugwash]

It appears my wording of the question was lacking. What I intended to garner was opinion on classroom time only.

[Voyeur]

Dealing only with classroom time, you still have essentially an answer that reads like the answer to an equation, rather than a single figure. I would say that the range of difficulty for a decent teacher is narrower and in the middle. He has to perform and can't slack off. But this is his language, and he shouldn't be teaching material that he finds incredibly demanding.

The student range is broader: they can, as I said above, zone out. Or if the class level is easy for them, it can be a lot of fun with only a moderate amount of challenge. But if you are in a class where you are in over your head, but still working your damnedest to swim, well that can be totally exhausting.

Caveat: none of this is factoring in a teaching environment where class management is a serious issue. At that point we aren't really even talking about 'teaching' so much. Very few things are as soul-destroying, tiring, and self-esteem demeaning as having to teach a class where there are fundamental discipline problems that can't be resolved by the teacher alone, but where the teacher is being asked to solve them by himself. This is the definition of 'no win'. I think most of us veterans have been there. It is horrible and harder than being a student. Harder than just about anything since you typically cannot succeed.

[Capt Lugwash]

I read your caveat and had to smile. I have never had serious discipline problems at my university. We taught three year and four year course students. I say taught as I have the honour of ushering the last three year students out as the uni has decided they (presumably) pull down the national ranking for the school.

In my first term they gave me two of these classes which numbered 65 and 66 students. That was hard work and I spent a great deal of time relieving students of their phones and stopping them talking to each other in Chinese when I was teaching. When I bemoaned the class size, a more seasoned colleague suggested I take my concerns to the Dean. She in turn simply told me to split the classes. I have done so ever since if I am given a large one.

A couple of years ago I was teaching summer school. I hate it but the owner is a friend. About four weeks in I had a class like no other previously (or since) encountered. Even the girls were horrors! The tactic of simply staring and saying nothing failed and short of doing what I really wanted to do, which was throw them all from the 6th floor window I could do nothing. I walked out, told the owner I could do nothing with them unless he sent their usual CT in to keep order and promptly left for the day. There was no recurrence but this summer I just said no to summer school. I earn more online anyway.

Conversely by and large the 4 year students are an absolute joy. There is always one outstandingly active class and perhaps three others that are still active but to a lesser extent. They are fun to teach and make you want to go to work.