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Decent living wage in Shanghai
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roadwalker



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 1750
Location: Ch

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shanghai doesn't have to be all that expensive, especially if your rent is taken care of or you get a decent stipend in addition to salary. The thing is, there are more ways to spend your money, should you choose to do so. More temptations. For some it might be expat-style nightlife or foreign restaurants. For me it would probably be access to expensive groceries that aren't widely available in China, such as real cheese or ethnic foods. Still others it might be cultural exhibitions or entertainment. There are lots of threads on Shanghai working and living, so if you really are interested, look them up to find out what to look for and what to watch out for. Good luck.
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Voyeur



Joined: 03 Jul 2012
Posts: 431

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 10:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Decent living wage in Shanghai Reply with quote

newmansone wrote:

What's the truth behind your country hopping? What is the thing that keeps you from getting a job in your home country? Skipping from country to country in a desperate grabbag for more and more money.

Something is sinister here.


Why are you trolling? This is fairly common EFL-teacher behavior. Even though in this case the stereotype misses the mark, there is a great deal of truth in the stereotype of EFL teachers as people who couldn't/wouldn't make it back home. Many teachers, with little to no ability or marketable skills, are hoping to trade in on their native language's dominance (and sometime their skin color) to make relatively easy money in foreign lands. Everyone in the industry with any sense knows this. So I don't see much point in bringing it up as if it is a revelation.
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likwid_777



Joined: 04 Nov 2012
Posts: 411
Location: NA

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2014 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Voyeur wrote:
newmansone wrote:

What's the truth behind your country hopping? What is the thing that keeps you from getting a job in your home country? Skipping from country to country in a desperate grabbag for more and more money.

Something is sinister here.


Why are you trolling? This is fairly common EFL-teacher behavior. Even though in this case the stereotype misses the mark, there is a great deal of truth in the stereotype of EFL teachers as people who couldn't/wouldn't make it back home. Many teachers, with little to no ability or marketable skills, are hoping to trade in on their native language's dominance (and sometime their skin color) to make relatively easy money in foreign lands. Everyone in the industry with any sense knows this. So I don't see much point in bringing it up as if it is a revelation.


thomthom wrote:
newmansone wrote:
What's the truth behind your country hopping? What is the thing that keeps you from getting a job in your home country? Skipping from country to country in a desperate grabbag for more and more money.

Something is sinister here.


Ha.
First of all, I stated quite clearly that I'm intending to save to go back to university.
The thing that's stopping me getting a job in my own country? The fact that I don't particularly desire to live in my own country or to endure any of the office jobs currently available to me when I adore travelling and living as an expat in East Asia, with all the cultural experiences it has to offer. If you don't understand this perspective... I'm not quite sure why you're contributing to this forum in the first place? Presumably you're an executive banker, living in Mayfair, and purely recreationally you go on Dave's ESL to question people who've chosen to live and work overseas?


Haha. Shazam x 2. I wonder what teachers without sinister agendas (to get paid) do in China? Volunteer, I guess.
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asiannationmc



Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2014 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if in' you wanna sling da Eng
while you dance and sing
an hopping from sea to sea
is where you wanna be
then take it from your propaganda minister
this side of the sea don't care if you are sinister
they just like the role you play &
if you are a yank, the way you say
Now hurry on down to the TEFL store
where you learn to strut and bore
and be sure to save your money
cause it cost plenty to have a honey
you can drink til dawn
and teach through the yawn
but the crap you will always hear
like poison in your ear
are the experts of this land
and their guanxi which is grand
but try and withstand
a posted helping hand
and try an understand
these are not the words of the high command
Just the drivel of another hired hand
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fpshangzhou



Joined: 13 Mar 2012
Posts: 280

PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WOW! That was a great piece to read! Very poetic, yet nailed it with finesse.


Cheers,

Aaron
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thomthom



Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 125

PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shocked

...

Aaanyway, bringing this back on track somewhat..

15,000rmd a month does seem about the bare minimum for living okay in Shanghai. However:

Capt Lugwash wrote:
I couldn't live in Shanghai on less than 25,000.


.. this definitely strikes me as an exaggeration, considering most ESL jobs in China seem to fall around the 12-18k bracket these days.

I've seen perfectly nice centrally located single room apartments, or rooms in house shares, for within 5000 RMD a month including utilities. With no dependants, no debts to clear back home, no car, and only going out 1-2 times a week, I feel fairly confident I could save at least a couple of hundred dollars a month on 15k if my accommodation is under 5k. No?
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litterascriptor



Joined: 17 Jan 2013
Posts: 360

PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Capt. Lugwash is an outlier given he likes his bedposts bedazzled with real cubic zirconium. He's a true 1 percenter.
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3701 W.119th



Joined: 26 Feb 2014
Posts: 386
Location: Central China

PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know teachers in Shanghai that live very well indeed on 12-14k a month. Granted they share apartments (just off Line 1), and aren't really looking to save any money, but they seem pretty happy for now.

Shanghai's as cheap or expensive as you make it.
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jm21



Joined: 26 Feb 2008
Posts: 406

PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you've got housing covered and 10k rmb left over, it sounds like you should be able to save maybe $1k usd per month pretty easily as long as you don't go out too much. The first month or two you might spend more but after you settle in 3000 is plenty for food and basic living expenses. That's what I spend in Qingdao and doesn't sound like Shanghai is that different. You could survive on less but it would be too boring for me.
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Markness



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 738
Location: Chengdu

PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know how people blow so much dough here. I spend 3k RMB per month for everything MAX (unless I buy random crap off taobao like weights or a whiteboard). Booze here comes at 3rmb - 5rmb per beer at a shop, cheap firewater costs about 5-10rmb per bottle. Buying that stuff at a bar at 4-5x the price seems a bit foolish. If you're going to go out to the bars, might as well pre-game (drink first at a buddies house), and then go! Also, try to limit eating an old fatboy burger to once a week. A lot of people I know here don't indulge in some of the arguably most delicious food I've ever eaten. I have my weaknesses like everyone else (eating pizza), but I don't know how people manage to blow so much money. Just seems nuts! Only expensive things here are non-knockoff electronics/clothes. Food/booze/smokes/misc. items from the supermarkets are super cheap.

Wawawooeeh!
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maxand



Joined: 04 Jan 2012
Posts: 318

PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Markness wrote:
I don't know how people blow so much dough here. I spend 3k RMB per month for everything MAX (unless I buy random crap off taobao like weights or a whiteboard). Booze here comes at 3rmb - 5rmb per beer at a shop, cheap firewater costs about 5-10rmb per bottle. Buying that stuff at a bar at 4-5x the price seems a bit foolish. If you're going to go out to the bars, might as well pre-game (drink first at a buddies house), and then go! Also, try to limit eating an old fatboy burger to once a week. A lot of people I know here don't indulge in some of the arguably most delicious food I've ever eaten. I have my weaknesses like everyone else (eating pizza), but I don't know how people manage to blow so much money. Just seems nuts! Only expensive things here are non-knockoff electronics/clothes. Food/booze/smokes/misc. items from the supermarkets are super cheap.

Wawawooeeh!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvwVgIoMjTI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIDHFbjQ93A
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jm21



Joined: 26 Feb 2008
Posts: 406

PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 6:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Markness wrote:
I don't know how people blow so much dough here. I spend 3k RMB per month for everything MAX (unless I buy random crap off taobao like weights or a whiteboard). Booze here comes at 3rmb - 5rmb per beer at a shop, cheap firewater costs about 5-10rmb per bottle. Buying that stuff at a bar at 4-5x the price seems a bit foolish. If you're going to go out to the bars, might as well pre-game (drink first at a buddies house), and then go! Also, try to limit eating an old fatboy burger to once a week. A lot of people I know here don't indulge in some of the arguably most delicious food I've ever eaten. I have my weaknesses like everyone else (eating pizza), but I don't know how people manage to blow so much money. Just seems nuts! Only expensive things here are non-knockoff electronics/clothes. Food/booze/smokes/misc. items from the supermarkets are super cheap.

Wawawooeeh!


Meat here is about the same price as America for the most part except beef is more expensive. Juice and milk are more expensive. Butter is more expensive. Some types of seafood are much more expensive. Some fruits and veg are much more expensive in Qingdao, like citrus and avacado. Pretty much everything related to Thai food is double the price compared to Seattle. Cheese is more expensive. I have not found good bacon, but it will be more expensive. These are all things I enjoy and it's worth my money. I am a bit of a foodie, so yes, I might just spend 80yuan on a piece of ahi, or for a bottle of palatable bourbon every now and then. I do not really consider it extravagant. Yes there are some great eats here for cheap, like one place with amazing baozu for 1yuan each, and there is one brand of Chinese white wine I like that's 30yuan for 2.5l, but lemon or lime juice to mix with the wine is 15yuan for a small bottle. In the end I like variety in my food and cooking certain cuisines can be expensive. I think beef fajitas with home made guacomole, salsa, and sour cream for two people would run you something like 150yuan or so, as an example. I don't even want to think about how much a roast beef dinner would cost, but I will be craving it at Christmas time.

I have never been to a bar here and only eat out maybe 3 times per month (usually 70yuan or so for 2 people with a meituan deal). I drink beer that is 50yuan a case and mostly drink chinese white wine. Found some Russian gin I like for 36yuan a bottle that I make martinis with a bit (vermouth is expensive but I like my martinis very traditional so I hardly use any). Did buy some tonic water for gin and tonic and that was a rip. I have never bought foreign wine here and I don't smoke. I like to bake my own bread. I spend 3k a month pretty easily. If I ate out every meal at cheap chinese restaurants it would probably be cheaper, but I would be bored as hell. My girlfriend pays for all the meals out, some groceries, mostly eats at work, and doesn't drink. I'm including in that 3k everything I spend, including things like an ebike, tv, phone, etc.

Still leaves me enough money for two nice month-long vacations each year. Next year I will probably look for a job with more hours that pays 10k+yuan in a smaller city because I'd like to buy a condo here and pay off my house back home earlier.

Edit:
Wait, I did go on a pub crawl once with some expats shortly after arriving here, but have no recollection of how much I spent, or really anything at all about that night. Had already drank quite a bit before we left.
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asiannationmc



Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342

PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Meat here is about the same price as America for the most part except beef is more expensive. Juice and milk are more expensive. Butter is more expensive. Some types of seafood are much more expensive. Some fruits and veg are much more expensive in Qingdao, like citrus and avacado. Pretty much everything related to Thai food is double the price compared to Seattle. Cheese is more expensive. I have not found good bacon, but it will be more expensive.


Beef seems to be the cheapest of "da Meats" and just returned from the US, I found the prices to be less for items you mentioned except lemons. Try Taobao and lock in on some good sources. My fowl dealer, sends quality chicken and if I am not satisfied, I can return it, no questions asked. At least you know where the chicken is coming from; CHINA. In the states, if the meat is pre-cooked before shipping overseas, and sold in say, a deli, it does not have to have a origin label.
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newmansone



Joined: 07 Sep 2014
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 12:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Decent living wage in Shanghai Reply with quote

thomthom wrote:
After two year's in Seoul and one year in Tokyo, I'm considering one more year of ESL, in a situation where I can save enough to go back to university.

Korea was great for money, but I wouldn't want to go back again. Japan was incredible culturally, but hopeless for making anything doing ESL.
Would I be correct in believing that Shanghai could be a happy medium?

I'm setting the bar at 15000 RMD per month minimum - not considering any positions that offer less than that. How much do you think one could save, living in a fairly nice/central apt, perhaps going out just once a week?
With 3 year's experience and a fairly good CV, should I be aiming higher than that?


I just do NOT get why people come to China and consider "decent living wage" and think 15-25,000 is "decent" when you look at common Chinese folk. If money is so importantly desperate for you, then WHY come to China? Why not get a $50,000+ per year job back in the US? Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, wait, we know.
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wangdaning



Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154

PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 12:33 am    Post subject: Re: Decent living wage in Shanghai Reply with quote

newmansone wrote:
thomthom wrote:
After two year's in Seoul and one year in Tokyo, I'm considering one more year of ESL, in a situation where I can save enough to go back to university.

Korea was great for money, but I wouldn't want to go back again. Japan was incredible culturally, but hopeless for making anything doing ESL.
Would I be correct in believing that Shanghai could be a happy medium?

I'm setting the bar at 15000 RMD per month minimum - not considering any positions that offer less than that. How much do you think one could save, living in a fairly nice/central apt, perhaps going out just once a week?
With 3 year's experience and a fairly good CV, should I be aiming higher than that?


I just do NOT get why people come to China and consider "decent living wage" and think 15-25,000 is "decent" when you look at common Chinese folk. If money is so importantly desperate for you, then WHY come to China? Why not get a $50,000+ per year job back in the US? Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, wait, we know.


So, why are you here?
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