Job Discussion Forums

[RW8677]

[quote="ESL104"]

[RW8677]

There are some good points here, but the majority are based in misconceptions.

Scores can change over several tests, this is true. As I said earlier, examiners can only assess the performance on the evidence they have at that moment. Some test-takers perform erratically, mainly due to nerves. Others improve their knowledge of the format of the test etc. and improve dramatically, e.g by managing timing effectively to write both tasks effectively, instead of just task 1.

It is true that marks can go up when challenged. They can also go down. But how many challenges lead to any changes to results? I think you'll find it is quite a small segment.

I can only comment on what I have seen, . Firstly students only challenge when the feel they have been erred against. I do't collect the numbers, but, many students have challenged in the last, and a lot of them have been successful, I guess maybe one in three. I have no recollection of a student being marked down - perhaps it happens, my hunch is upgrading is far more frequent. Yes, it is anecdotal but it suggests that, even with second marking many exams are wrongly graded. Perhaps you think this is not a flaw, I disagree



As for non-native speakers being IELTS examiners, I can't see how there can be any objections there. Apart from borderline racist ones. The fact is that non-natives have to take IELTS themselves in many countries. They get 9s all round. Might not be so in China, but is so in Russia. And let me tell you that these examiners are scarily proficient not just in English, but in language assessment. Would put many posters on these boards to serious shame.


You really need to look up the word racist. My contention is that a native speaker, from any country, any sex, any colour, suitably qualified would be better that a similarly qualified non native speaker. Ther's a guy in our place, Dr Phil. Habil - highest qualification available I think, but I wouldn't want him examining my kid, he knows the language inside out, could tense a verb up the wazoo, but he still looks puzzled at some of the nuances and subtleties we sometimes use. BTW we are both white Europeans - but, you know, go ahead and call me racist if it makes you feel good



However, none of the objections quoted above means IELTS is flawed

That's your opinion, I think they clearly show it is flawed. If you agree that challenging can work, and accept not everyone challenges, then the logical conclusion is some dud scores get thru. I'm sorry, but that is a flaw. I never said it was entirely flawed, but it is flawed nonetheless.

[spiral78]

[ESL104]

[Alien abductee]

These are not just any old EFL teachers, but EFL teachers with 10,000 posts. Are these not men? No! They are _ _ _ _!

[Sashadroogie]

[Sashadroogie]

[Sashadroogie]

[buravirgil]

[Sashadroogie]

Thought that was your lawn, bura baby : )

[wangdaning]

One thing these wonderful examiners have seemed to ignore is this is the China forum.

I know we all can have a puritanical view of what should happen, but what happens?

I think people cheat the test left and right, the people making money by testing say no. See what is happening, good luck!

[RW8677]

[Guerciotti]

I learned a lot from this topic. I thank those who contributed.

In the past, I learned that when certain others post in a thread, it's time to abandon it as it devolves into an 'I'm smarter than the FTs in China' debate.

Thanks to all who contributed to and debated memorization and other relevant topics in general.

[Alien abductee]

[Bud Powell]

I asked this before but was ignored. Since there are so many experts aboard now, I'll ask again (not to be confrontational but to FIND OUT THE ANSWER): How can memorization of tracts of text help someone taking the TOEFL or the IELTS (or any other achievement test) if the prompts are unknown?