|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Geronimo
Joined: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 498
|
 Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 6:57 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
If you're interested in the Road Accident Statistics for Oman, 1st Sgt Welsh, the annual numbers up to 2012 are available at:-
http://www.salimandsalimah.org/oman-crashes/crash-statistics/
"Since 2000, nearly 10,000 men, women and children have lost their lives in crashes in Oman and more than 110,000 have been injured, many disabled for life. These are appalling statistics for a small, developing nation and the escalating trend threatens to undermine more than 40 years of nation-building and development. Oman is repeating the pattern experienced by rapidly motorising high-income countries in 1970s when death on the roads claimed 1 life in every 3000. The trend was reversed only when people including victims, media and public personalities began to react and to speak out against silent, passive acceptance of the carnage..."
Oman has around 35 road deaths per 100,000 population per annum,
compared with around 5.4 per 100,000 in the U.K., (another country where people drink alcoholic beverages from time to time).
The risk factors for Oman?
http://www.salimandsalimah.org/oman-crashes/risk-factors/
The solutions?
http://www.salimandsalimah.org/oman-crashes/solutions/
"Countries which have targeted one or more of the main risk factors such as speed, seat belt wearing, distracted driving, fatigue, road design and infrastructure etc.. have succeeded in reducing road crash fatalities by 20-40 per cent within a few years even when the trend was previously rising sharply. Neighbouring Dubai is a compelling case in point where a targeted speed reduction campaign involving new traffic offences, tougher penalties and increased police visibility resulted in a 54% reduction in road crash deaths between 2008 and 2010 whereas the previous decade had witnessed a 60% increase..."
See also -
http://www.salimandsalimah.org/doc_uploads/National_Traffic_Safety_Symposium_Recommendations.pdf
Geronimo |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
1st Sgt Welsh
Joined: 13 Dec 2010
Posts: 946
Location: Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 7:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks Geronimo. That's much worse than I thought it would be  . |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
grahamb
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1945
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 9:22 pm Post subject: Road safety in Oman |
|
|
| Something I observed prior to my departure was an increase in the number of women police officers on the road. When they stopped someone for a traffic offence there was no hand-shaking, negotiation, or "please forgive me." They simply enforced the law, and their no-nonsense approach is exactly what the country needed. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| MuscatGary wrote: |
| Alcohol ban = end of tourism as a secondary economy and with oil running out and selling cheap they need the cash. |
However, I'm one of many tourists to Oman who either abstain from alcohol for whatever personal or religious reasons, or simply don't consider drinking a priority when out for some R&R. Besides, you're assuming Oman's tourism industry is supported solely on the sales of alcoholic beverages. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mushkilla
Joined: 17 Apr 2014
Posts: 320
Location: United Kingdom
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:38 pm Post subject: Re: Road safety in Oman |
|
|
| grahamb wrote: |
| Something I observed prior to my departure was an increase in the number of women police officers on the road. When they stopped someone for a traffic offence there was no hand-shaking, negotiation, or "please forgive me." They simply enforced the law, and their no-nonsense approach is exactly what the country needed. |
Why do you assume that a police woman in Oman hand-shake a raffic offender?
I hope you are not drunk! 
I remember sometime ago in UK, a police woman stopped me for a minor traffic offence, but she did not hand-shake with me. So, how do you expect a Muslim police woman to hand-shake a car driver in a Muslim country? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013
Posts: 1364
Location: Flying around the ME...
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| nomad soul wrote: |
| MuscatGary wrote: |
| Alcohol ban = end of tourism as a secondary economy and with oil running out and selling cheap they need the cash. |
However, I'm one of many tourists to Oman who either abstain from alcohol for whatever personal or religious reasons, or simply don't consider drinking a priority when out for some R&R. Besides, you're assuming Oman's tourism industry is supported solely on the sales of alcoholic beverages. |
No I'm not but I reckon that the vast majority of Western tourists would like a drink after the desert/wadi/mountains. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 5:40 am Post subject: Re: Road safety in Oman |
|
|
| Mushkilla wrote: |
| grahamb wrote: |
| Something I observed prior to my departure was an increase in the number of women police officers on the road. When they stopped someone for a traffic offence there was no hand-shaking, negotiation, or "please forgive me." They simply enforced the law, and their no-nonsense approach is exactly what the country needed. |
Why do you assume that a police woman in Oman hand-shake a raffic offender?
I hope you are not drunk!
I remember sometime ago in UK, a police woman stopped me for a minor traffic offence, but she did not hand-shake with me. So, how do you expect a Muslim police woman to hand-shake a car driver in a Muslim country? |
Have you ever lived in the Gulf? Ever been stopped by the police? An Omani male police officer will naturally shake hands with a male driver that they stop. Whereas in the US or UK, that would never happen. So we are not talking about comparable situations.
The one time that I was stopped by an Omani police officer, he spoke zero English... and I found it interesting that we went through the whole normal Arabic greetings, as if it were a social situation. But obviously since I was female, he didn't offer to shake hands. Then we quickly got beyond any shared language, and he gave me a ticket - which was waived when I went to the police department and met with the "captain."
I found grahamb's post about more female officers to be quite interesting. It makes sense that the male drivers don't go into their normal social greeting/negotiation mode. Good thinking on the part of the Omani police. I wonder what happens when they stop a female offender. Does the handshaking and negotiation reappear again? 
VS |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
1st Sgt Welsh
Joined: 13 Dec 2010
Posts: 946
Location: Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
| MuscatGary wrote: |
No I'm not but I reckon that the vast majority of Western tourists would like a drink after the desert/wadi/mountains. |
Seconded. Of course, if a tourist is not interested in having a drink while on holidays then they don't have to. However, plenty, if not most of Western tourists, would. Sure, this isn't Thailand or Ibizia and Oman has a different tourist market with different expectations, but, if extreme measures banning alcohol did go ahead, such news would be reported widely internationally and, I believe, hurt Oman's image as a comparatively liberal Gulf state. They would join the club of Kuwait and Saudi Arabia, and, aside from religious pilgrims, the vast majority of international tourists have no desire to spend their hard-earned holiday time and money in what they see as as a hard-line Islamic state and I can understand that. There are, of course, many differences between Omani society and, say, Saudi's that don't involve alcohol, but, in marketing, perceptions are important and such a move could cost a lot of people their jobs and damage a fast-growing industry with enormous potential.
Moreover, if they do take hard-line measures to ban alcohol then they lose the tax revenue generated from alcohol sales and they will need to spend money on enforcing the ban. Where's the money going to come from? Certainly it will help the finances of criminals, but the state will lose out. There will be other problems created by prohibition as well. Geez, I have spoken to a lot of people who have worked in Saudi and it often sounds like something out of Animal House. Moonshine, often unsafe, is made everywhere and the underground drug culture appears to be huge. People who would ordinarily just have some beers to get their buzz look elsewhere and this is what would probably happen here.
Also, as MuscatGary mentioned earlier, how would it effect international recruitment? To continue getting low or semi-skilled workers from South Asia etc won't be a problem, but, if Oman wants, for example, a top engineer (who could work anywhere) then a complete alcohol ban would probably cause issues. Sure, Oman isn't poor, but it hasn't got as much money to burn as some of the other Gulf states and I wouldn't have thought that they, for example, could compete with Saudi Arabia or Kuwait in terms of the remuneration that they can offer overseas professionals. However, they can certainly, at present, offer a more attractive lifestyle than the other two examples and if that lifestyle is no longer as attractive then they will have to, quite simply, pay more or do without the best people.
Last edited by 1st Sgt Welsh on Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:51 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
omanoman
Joined: 11 Jun 2014
Posts: 140
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
There are just too many pragmatic considerations and people in power with good sense to allow a full ban on tourists or foreign residents drinking. I would bet anything on that prediction.
The most that these news snippets are doing is to placate the more conservative pockets out there that at least it is being talked about out of respect for their culture and society. Don't forget, these majlis al Shura folks are politicians first and foremost. Recall the campaigning and signs posted before elections, supporting any number of platforms for their constituents. And in the end? not much is actually done.
Sounds like democracy at home!
omanoman |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013
Posts: 1364
Location: Flying around the ME...
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 8:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| 1st Sgt Welsh wrote: |
| However, they can certainly, at present, offer a more attractive lifestyle than the other two examples and if that lifestyle is no longer as attractive then they will have to, quite simply, pay more or do without the best people. |
True that, my per diem allowance is 400 AED but next month I'm going to KSA for four days and I've demanded (and will be given) 1000 AED per diem for the hardship! I won't be able to spend it there but will have a good time when I get back into Dubai for the weekend before heading back to Tenerife for my hols! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mushkilla
Joined: 17 Apr 2014
Posts: 320
Location: United Kingdom
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 10:16 am Post subject: Re: Road safety in Oman |
|
|
| veiledsentiments wrote: |
| Mushkilla wrote: |
| grahamb wrote: |
| Something I observed prior to my departure was an increase in the number of women police officers on the road. When they stopped someone for a traffic offence there was no hand-shaking, negotiation, or "please forgive me." They simply enforced the law, and their no-nonsense approach is exactly what the country needed. |
Why do you assume that a police woman in Oman hand-shake a raffic offender?
I hope you are not drunk!
I remember sometime ago in UK, a police woman stopped me for a minor traffic offence, but she did not hand-shake with me. So, how do you expect a Muslim police woman to hand-shake a car driver in a Muslim country? |
Have you ever lived in the Gulf? Ever been stopped by the police? An Omani male police officer will naturally shake hands with a male driver that they stop. Whereas in the US or UK, that would never happen. So we are not talking about comparable situations.
VS |
Yes I have lived and worked in the Magic Kingdom, UAE, and visited Oman and Qatar. I have never seen a male police man hand-shake with a male driver in the Magic Kingdom - traffic police women do not exist in the Magic Kingdom.
Also, I have been stopped in the Magic Kingdom several times, and the male police man did not hand-shake with me. In addition, I have seen a female police woman in Dubai stopping a taxi driver and she did not hand-shake with him. Many men and women from the Gulf do not hand-shake with the opposite sex. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hard to compare Saudi to Oman as the cultures are quite different in many ways. Omani men nearly always shake hands with another Omani male on meeting... not always with a foreigner though...
VS |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
grahamb
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1945
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:04 pm Post subject: Missing the point |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Many men and women from the Gulf do not hand-shake with the opposite sex. |
That's my whole point: male drivers shake hands and try the "Forgive me, brother" routine with male police officers in the hope of avoiding prosecution. They can't do that with women officers. Result? Less "forgiveness" and more law enforcement. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
grahamb
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1945
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:06 pm Post subject: Hand-shaking |
|
|
Very sociable, but not very nice when the other party sneezes into his hands first.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Geronimo
Joined: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 498
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 8:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
For me the flagrant misuse of apostrophes only adds spice to muscatmutterings arguments...
"There are, on average, approximately 160 shipping containers brought into the Sultanate each month with alcohol in them. Rough estimates of these 160 containers are that half are beer and half are spirits or wine. The approximate tax revenues on these containers are about RO 6,000 per container of beer and RO 3,000 per container of spirits or wine. This comes up to RO 720,000 per month in direct alcohol import taxes, or RO 7,920,000 per year (assuming 11 months). Thats before corporate taxes paid by hotels for profits made on alcohol related sales or revenue generated by tourists opting to visit Oman for a holiday. Or state dole payments for Omani's not out of work because of a tourism based job."
And,
"Humaid Al Nasri, the Majlis al Shura member who launched the proposal to ban alcohol consumption in all forms in Oman stated this, "The ban aims to reduce traffic accidents, divorce, murder and adultery, and reduce avenues leading to drug abuse,". ROP stats suggest that 167 accidents (with 15 dead) are due to alcohol (source) so far this year. To put that into perspective, in 2013 there were 7,829 accidents leaving 913 people dead (source). "
Take a look at the comments below the main post as well at:-
http://www.muscatmutterings.com/2014/12/the-booze-debate.html
If Humaid Al Nasri seriously believes that a ban on alcohol will "reduce avenues to drug abuse", he should read this article:-
"This year, according to the U.N. Office on Drugs and Crime’s 2013 World Drug Report, 30% of amphetamines seized by counternarcotics officials worldwide came from Saudi Arabia, a country with less than 1% of the world’s population."
http://world.time.com/2013/10/29/conservative-saudi-arabia-is-becoming-a-hotbed-for-amphetamines/
and explain to his constituents why it would be so very different on the other side of the fence (where the sand is alway oranger).
The Omani Princess shares her views:-
"As a Muslim, of course, I strictly applaud this attempt, like every Omani I know---however, as a rational human being, and then again as a Muslim, I have stipulations and hesitation. Intentions are great and totally Islamic in this... however, both Islamically and rationally, the ban is not thought out or what is best for Oman or...Muslims. It should be a conditional ban to be truly Islamic, only affecting Muslims, not non-Muslim expats or non-Muslim Omanis. It is less hypocritical then, where we can compare it to Saudi---where alchohol and nightclubs are readily available, supplied by corruption of custom officials and gangsters, and allowing non-Muslim citizens of the country to claim the benefits of a reputation of being Islamic when they are far from. Oman should approach this situation differently.
I say this as a concerned citizen, a former non-Muslim expat, and a Muslim who prefers to be strict with herself, rather than forcing others to the tenents of her faith."
http://howtolivelikeanomaniprincess.blogspot.ae/
Finally, may I make known the observation that traffic is delayed on the Causeway between Bahrain and Dhahran by vehicle searches due largely to a ban on alcohol in the K.S.A.? What impact would an alcohol ban have upon the operation of the border crossings between Oman and the U.A.E.? I'm sure that it will be fine for teetotal Omanis going out at the weekend to the new Rotana Al Rayaan...
"Hili Rayhaan by Rotana is located in the heart of Al Ain, the garden city of the UAE. The five-star property offers 254 splendid rooms and suites with their modern design complementing the values of the contemporary Arabian culture in an alcohol free environment..."
https://www.rotana.com/rayhaanhotelandresorts/unitedarabemirates/alain/hilirayhaanbyrotana
.. but what about their return trip to Oman? How long will they be held up in traffic?! 
Are the Shura elections due next year?
I'm really not Shura!
Geronimo |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
