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Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters
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mashkif

Joined: 17 Aug 2010
Posts: 178

Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 7:24 pm Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

ESL104 wrote:

CVN-76 wrote:

The employers must be getting really desperate in the KSA for teachers these days. Considering the salaries have dropped at least 20% in 10 years at a lot of the old standbys, it's no surprise I've gotten at least 25 job alerts and probably 12 offers in one week. I think that is a record. And this is during the present atrocious economy in the west. People seem to prefer living under bridges homeless than work in Saudi. Leave me alone, Saudi recruting machine. I'm not going to work in Saudi for the going salaries. Give me 8500 USD a month, provide me a fully furnished apartment, guarantee me no layoffs during the contract period, and guarantee me no more than 20 teaching hours a week, at least 2 months' paid vacation per year, and no more than 20 students per class and we might be able to work something out. For anything less, quit bothering me.

This guy has it right. $8500 USD a month should be about the minimum a BA holder should expect to work in that dump of a country.

Think MA holders should be looking at $10,000 USD at least tbh.

$45k USD a year is an absolute insult to anyone with any qualification at all. That's the kind of salary a pot washer should be demanding if he has to live in Saudi.

Boy, do some people have a high opinion of themselves.

(1) You don't need a bachelor's, let alone a graduate, degree to be able to teach plain English. You need to be able to speak it and to be able to teach it. The former comes from many sources (but, crucially, NOT from holding this or that degree); the latter comes from experience.
(2) There is no qualification in the world (other than C.E.L.T.A. and similar) that attests to one's ability to teach well.
(3) "Sorry," but even accounting for the "hazard pay" for the fact that, well, it IS Saudi Arabia we're talking here, demanding a salary equivalent to $140,000 gross in the States to teach a bunch of kids subordinate clauses is bullisht. Frankly, even $45,000 (approximating to $75,000 gross in the States) is pushing the envelope for teaching foundation English.

Perspective, people!

CVN-76

Joined: 28 Mar 2014
Posts: 171

Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 7:29 pm Post subject:

After giving it some very minor thought, I have decided to reevaluate my salary demand. Now I wouldn't teach in Saudi for less than 12,000 a month, with 18 hours teaching max. I'm listening to the advice of people I know who have been there, understand. People who would rather live in cardboard boxes than go back to the KSA and work.

nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world

Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 8:17 pm Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

CVN-76 wrote:

nomad soul wrote:

That's what happens when you put your information and CV on a generic, public job site. Besides, the better employers post their ads on their websites and/or do their recruiting and in-person interviewing at TESOL Arabia each March.

Except my information and my CV aren't on any generic, public job sites. The recruiters have become so desperate they have resorted to actually exerting effort and digging a bit.

Did you apply for jobs through several recruiters? If so, be aware they each generally work for numerous contracting companies.

Perhaps you should do some digging on your own and figure out where they pulled your info from and delete or deactivate it. Additionally, set your spam filter.

CVN-76

Joined: 28 Mar 2014
Posts: 171

Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 10:50 pm Post subject:

Thanks, NS. I did indeed apply through several recruiters. Only I applied back in the 2005-2010 period. They apparently kept my info somewhere and perhaps exchanged it with others, who in turn kept it on file as well. It's been years since I last applied for a Saudi job.

ESL104

Joined: 27 Sep 2014
Posts: 108

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:37 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

mashkif wrote:

ESL104 wrote:

CVN-76 wrote:

1) and 2) The ability to actually teach has always been a secondary thing in the ESL game and has rarely moved anyone significantly up a pay bracket. You get paid according to your qualifications and in some cases, whether you have blonde hair/blue eyes/are female/have the 'correct' passport for the employer.

3) $140,000 gross in USA terms seems about right to me to work in Saudi Arabia. $75,000 gross is an insult. Remember in the States you can drive your car without suffering a 10% chance of getting killed on each journey, you're not surrounded by religious OMGOMGOMG ALLAAAAAAH! nutjobs, you can actually get laid, have a beer, go to the movies, go and watch football, the climate is far nicer whereever you are, there's great natural beauty there if you like things like mountain walks, rock climbing etc...

8500 USD a month should be a base, entry level type salary in Saudi.

To put salaries into perspective, you can earn $39k USD in China a year if you're willing to put some work in (i.e. equivilant to 20k RMB a month, which while 'non-standard', is still doable if you're prepared to work hard in language training centres at the evenings or can teach IELTS). You can't tell me an extra $6k and fewer contact hours is worth working in Saudi frickin Arabia for.

My wages here in Thailand are $19k USD a year (good for Thailand standards, bad for ESL standards in general) and I absolutely LOL at the thought of giving this up to come teach in Saudi for $45k. And here's an even bigger joke - they want you to have an MA too! Laughing

Yes, they actually want people to give up a year of working so they can have the 'priviledge' of working in Saudi in the future on $45k. Laughing

I can actually walk around in the malls here without the fear some bearded nutjob is going to attack me with a meat cleaver, and the girls here aren't dressed up in full Darth Vader outfit when they go out.

nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 2:05 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

ESL104 wrote:

My wages here in Thailand are $19k USD a year (good for Thailand standards, bad for ESL standards in general) and I absolutely LOL at the thought of giving this up to come teach in Saudi for $45k. And here's an even bigger joke - they want you to have an MA too! Laughing

Yes, they actually want people to give up a year of working so they can have the 'priviledge' of working in Saudi in the future on $45k. Laughing

Hey, then don't come. But why are you so stuck on the magical number of $45K? You must have scoured those endless job ads for Saudi contracting companies on this site (despite your claims that you have no interest in teaching in KSA). But that's not reality and those ads don't represent every TEFL job in KSA. Moreover, there are plenty of teachers earning more than that, especially those with relevant MAs.

veiledsentiments

Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 3:07 am Post subject:

I'm wonder why he is posting in this part of the board anyway. He should just head back to the Thailand branch and brag about his miserable pay but at least he's got booze and broads, and that is apparently his priority. The word is... TROLL VS

ESL104

Joined: 27 Sep 2014
Posts: 108

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:02 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

nomad soul wrote:

ESL104 wrote:

Yes, they actually want people to give up a year of working so they can have the 'priviledge' of working in Saudi in the future on $45k. Laughing

Well $45k a year seems about average for your part of the world. Yes some earn more but there's some people in Thailand on $3500 USD a month too, it's not the average which is what we're discussing here.

And the average sure isn't $100k a year which is what it should be, minimum, to work in that dustbowl.

nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:09 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

ESL104 wrote:

And the average sure isn't $100k a year which is what it should be, minimum, to work in that dustbowl.

But you claim to have zero interest and knowledge about working in KSA, so why spend time posting on this forum? Why does it matter so much to you?

cmp45

Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1475
Location: KSA

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:21 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

nomad soul wrote:

ESL104 wrote:

And the average sure isn't $100k a year which is what it should be, minimum, to work in that dustbowl.

But you claim to have zero interest and knowledge about working in KSA, so why spend time posting on this forum? Why does it matter so much to you?

Because he is a dissatisfied under qualified jealous troll on a mission.

ESL104

Joined: 27 Sep 2014
Posts: 108

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:40 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

cmp45 wrote:

nomad soul wrote:

ESL104 wrote:

And the average sure isn't $100k a year which is what it should be, minimum, to work in that dustbowl.

But you claim to have zero interest and knowledge about working in KSA, so why spend time posting on this forum? Why does it matter so much to you?

Because he is a dissatisfied under qualified jealous troll on a mission.

Buddy I assure you if I ever decided to 'upgrade' my qualifications, I'd get a PGCE not an MA TESOL, and then pick up said $45k USD a year while living somewhere reasonable like China or Vietnam.

Why the hell did you all choose Saudi over these places? The PGCE and the MA TESOL take the same amount of time.

cmp45

Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1475
Location: KSA

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:51 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

ESL104 wrote:

cmp45 wrote:

nomad soul wrote:

ESL104 wrote:

And the average sure isn't $100k a year which is what it should be, minimum, to work in that dustbowl.

But you claim to have zero interest and knowledge about working in KSA, so why spend time posting on this forum? Why does it matter so much to you?

Because he is a dissatisfied under qualified jealous troll on a mission.

Good luck with that.

I do not need to justify my choices.
I feel sorry for you. Perhaps you will wake up and realize that diversity is part of humanity.
I think by now we all know you do not like KSA and will never ever set foot here. Therefore stay in Thailand. I agree that Thailand is a great place. I have enjoyed vacationing there and even considered retiring there as cost of living is so cheap. If you like working in Thailand stay there. I actually like working here in KSA. No shame in that. Go peddle your angst some where else.

Last edited by cmp45 on Fri Dec 12, 2014 5:38 am; edited 4 times in total

nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:56 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

ESL104 wrote:

Simple answer: personal choice---making adult decisions as individuals. Besides, your idea of "reasonable" certainly isn't the standard for everyone else. Don't knock it. Fortunately, we're all not cookie-cutter clones of each other and have different backgrounds, career goals, priorities... But you already know that.

ESL104

Joined: 27 Sep 2014
Posts: 108

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 5:38 am Post subject: Re: Being Pestered by Saudi Recruiters

nomad soul wrote:

ESL104 wrote:

But what sort of 'personal choice' is it to pick a place where you're stuck in a compound with no entertainment, over a place where you're free to go out and have fun during your evenings and weekends?

Don't you think someone with a 1 year postgrad degree (i.e. a PGCE or MA) should earn more in Saudi Arabia than they do in China or Vietnam? Simply because Saudi Arabia is a much more difficult place to live. I'm not suggesting the other two countries are perfect, but drinks are freely avaliable, there's no 5am morning prayer at your local centre of terrorism...errr, mosque. There's a huge supply of hot girls who are all too willing to talk to you and don't wear black robes with a letterbox for their eyes. You're apparently free to travel outside the country on your vacation periods. And you're getting paid the same for this as you would in Saudi.

Why would anyone in their right mind pick the MA TESOL---> Saudi Arabia route over the PGCE ----> South East Asia route?

cmp45

Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1475
Location: KSA

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 6:00 am Post subject:

Your critical thinking is astounding! What is the sound of one hand clapping!

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