Job Discussion Forums

[weigookin74]

[Scrabble King]

This is a misleading subject because what a teacher in China actually nets depends on whether or not they are getting skimmed and cheated out of overtime pay, salary commissions, and how much real tax is being deducted and what their gross salary was to begin with. Generally speaking if you find your own job without using an agent or recruiter you will earn about 30% more than you would otherwise.

Don't believe that a recruiter "works for free" even if you don't have to pay them a dime up front. Legally they are entitled to take a month's salary as their fee but many collect a monthly percentage you will never even know about. See the below which some Shanghai teacher found out the hard way:


SNIPPET:

Re: China's Silent Scam Steals 40% Of Foreign Teacher Salaries

Post by Nobodys Fool » Fri Dec 26, 2014 2:27 pm

Let me try to do the math here... Lets say the school allocated 15,000 per month for my position, but my recruiter skims 5,000 and kicks half back to my principal. That leaves me with 10,000 net per month. Normally I must work about 5-6 hours of unpaid overtime per week so that is 25 hours per month where I am losing about 2,000 yuan, maybe more because it keeps me from earning tutoring money at 250 per hour, but lets stick with 2,000. So now instead of making 12,000 per month I am still at 10,000, but for the first 90 days they said I was on "probationary status" and only paid me 5,000 per month. Every month they take 1,000 from my check which they say is for taxes. For holiday time they pay 50% wages. So here are the gross and net totals and subtotals...

First 3 months @ 5,000 less 1,000 for tax = 4,000 net x 3 mo =12,000
Six months @ 10,000 less 1,000 for tax = 9,000 net x 6 mo = 36,000
3 holiday months @ 5,000 less 1,000 tax = 4,000 net x 3 mo = 12,000

TOTAL NET PAY RECEIVED........................................ 60,000
GROSS SALARY ALLOCATED (15,000 x 12 mos.)...............180,000

Legally the recruiter is entitled to one month's salary so minus 15,000
and 12,000 for legitimate tax deductions and that should leave me with a Legal net income of 180,000 minus 27,000 or 153,000 yuan.

153,000 minus 60,000 = 93,000 missing/stolen income!

Cao wo! They screwed me out of $15,000 and I had to pay for my own HK visa runs as well. The OP is right - they hide these employee rights to make/steal wages from us! In my case it was a lot more than 40%. I guess I have to change my user name now.

Also you make less money working in the rural areas than in the big cities, and those who do private tutoring can make over 25,000 a month, BUT they are a very small minority - maybe about 5% or so.

Personally, I net around 17,000 a month which is about half of what I would earn in Singapore and about 70% of what I'd earn in Korea - for the same number of working hours per month. I remain here in China only because of my Chinese wife and here aging parents. If you are an AP teacher at an International school you could probably rake in about 30,000 yuan per month, but still collect double in Korea or Singapore.

I read somewhere that teachers in China are the lowest paid expats in the country. I asked my wife who works for a huge International HR firm to look up some official statistics for me at her job.

Overall, I have to conclude that expats teachers chose China for fun, and adventure instead of money. At least I did.

[roadwalker]

More crap. If a school wants to pay an agent long after the teacher has been hired, they have every right to do so. It's idiotic, but it's their right. If I allocate 15k/month for a teacher but am able to sign you to a contract for 10k, why would I pay some other dude the money I saved by hiring you? If I have a manager running my business, you better believe I'll want to see all of the books, including signed contracts.

China has lower starting salaries than Korea or Japan and the Middle Eastern countries, but it is certainly not anywhere near the lowest salaries for teaching English abroad, which is NOT a career for those seeking to get rich.

[Scrabble King]

[asiannationmc]

[Scrabble King]

[asiannationmc]

I worked in an international school in Beijing and even the aiyis' drove mega buck cars but of course they had control of the crayons in the supply closet. I came to this employment through a recruiter that was extremely helpful and signed a two year contract, that was voided (after finishing 1 year) by both parties (with the help of the recruiter) due to a disagreement as to payment of taxes. My recruiter was able to increase my salary in negotiations, but as in other aspects of the % earned on a little bump in salary may not be in the interest of the recruiter so I wouldn't expect em to work to hard to increase your digit. Turn over is the name of the game in placement also school satisfaction will keep the schools coming back for more FT cannon fodder to throw as the teaming masses of "chillians" yearning to be learned.

[The_Kong]

[Scrabble King]

Look there are bot honest and dishonest recruiters here in China, but my experience is the vast majority will grab every extra dollar they can. We teachers are the expendable firewood that keeps their money machine going. I too met an honest agent a while ago, but the last time I met him (after more than a year gap) he was working for one of the most hated agencies in Beijing. Chinese cannot resist low-hanging fruit. It is sooo easy for a newbie teacher to trust a recruiter. This link shows just how much they can get away with.

http://www.shanghaiexpat.com/phpbbforum/china-s-silent-scam-steals-40-of-foreign-teacher-salaries-t181524.html

Enough about the problem. The solution is to force accountability upon agents and recruiters. They all need to be licensed and registered online where they can be verified with real names. Maybe they should also be required to post some sort of security bond that they forfeit if people get screwed? Just an idea.

But to get back on point. We make more money in China without using recruiters than when we use them in most all cases.

[Bud Powell]

[Scrabble King]

[asiannationmc]

[Scrabble King]

If I am not mistaken, the purpose of ESLCafe is to help each other learn and earn more. I cannot imagine any ESL or TEFL teacher out there who actually wants to...

- Work dozens of unpaid overtime hours every month

- To lose their bonus, sick, and holiday pay

- To be used a marketing monkey to hand out flyers on a street corner

- To work at three different locations in a single day

- To work six days instead of five

- Get arrested, fined, jailed, and deported for working without a Z visa

- To get cheated out of housing deposits and air fare reimbursements

- To be cheated out of 50% of their paycheck

- To get late paychecks

- To be assigned split-shift working hours

- To be extorted for money for their invitation and/or release letters

- To have an illegal contract that forfeits their employee rights

- To have their lesson plans and ppts stolen from them and even sold

- To have their passports "held hostage"

- To be a victim of a "bait and switch" scheme

- To have their resume and passport scan sold to identity thieves

- To have their photos used in advertisements without their knowledge

- To have their names attached to fake testimonials

Every employee in the world expects to be treated fairly and have an honest employer and job recruiter. If a teacher in China is promised an 18,000 yuan per month paycheck, they should get it - on time - every month.

When working in China you always get surprises and most of them are unpleasant. Although this may also happen in other countries as well, it is the worst in China. So when we talk about how much money people can earn here compared to elsewhere, all of the above has to be factored in. How much we take home on pay day is what really counts - not what was promised to you in a contract.

As I said before, teachers who work for universities and public schools as well as international schools are going to be the 50% of teachers that are most content. The other 50% are prey for the vultures who will take whatever they can get - any way they can.

For every honest recruiter we find in China we find nine that are not. Even the foreign recruiters are getting less and less ethical to stay "competitive". I visit http://chinascamwatch.org and scam.com once a week to check for new scams I haven't heard of yet, and there is always some new clever way to cheat expats in China, and teacher job applicants are the No. 1 victims. Here are my sources:

http://www.scam.com/showthread.php?t=642187&highlight=china+foreign+teachers

http://www.eslwatch.info/china-2/reviews-china/58-china-scam-or-schemes/12410-foreign-teacher-scam-alert-trust-no-esl-or-tefl-china-job-recruiter-that-has-no-saic-license,-a-website,-and-real-street-address.html

http://chinascampatrol.wordpress.com

http://www.shanghaiexpat.com/phpbbforum/china-s-silent-scam-steals-40-of-foreign-teacher-salaries-t181524.html

http://www.chinascambusters.com

http://open.salon.com/blog/china_business_central/2013/03/13/phony_china_recruiters_now_target_5000_expats_monthly_1

http://www.scam.com/showthread.php?p=1821535

http://chinascamwatch.org

http://www.eslwatch.info/reviews/asia-reviews/141-china-in-asia/12386-chinascamwatch-org-warns-of-cloned-recruiter-scam-websites-luring-china-foreign-esl-tefl-teachers-with-fake-jobs.html

https://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20140922203725AAkSLgn

http://chinablacklist.wordpress.com

IMHO, the ONLY people who do not want foreign teachers to know about all these tricks, traps, schemes, and scams are the China job recruiters. The rest of us should want to warn as many people as possible. And when less than 40% of China foreign teachers even know they have some decent employee rights, there is obviously an information gap - that too many greedy agents love to exploit. So until there is real accountability for recruiters who are forced to use their real names on a public registry, the only other real solution at present, is to avoid job recruiters altogether and find your own job directly with the FAOs.

[asiannationmc]

Your starting to sound a little "touched". Continuous "Bold and Black" speaks to desperation and attention seeking. You have made your point and given so many links, and ESL'er couldn't miss it if they tried. In other post I have stated that I don't know many FT's and tht is due to this continuous ranting about China, employment and air quality. Jobs here are ok and often better than stateside. I find the quality of women to be better suited to having a fun and substantial relationship. Cost of Living is much better than the alternative and educational as well as many find that they can live without the western trinkets or they have learned to reproduce them or source them. In China only the innovative and strong will survive and many before them have done so without a ESL messiah toting a persecution complex. You have stated on other threads that you have a weibo and QQ and you know how to use them. Why not put those to use and become true warrior instead of tinkling on the keyboards ad nausea accusing common posters of being recruiters which they may be and what difference does it make. Only to those who are disturbed and it places you right in bed next to those China haters who seem to find a reason to post every aspect of the PRC in a negative light. Your from the west and if all you can do to sound the "hue n cry" is to continue to post links is the least you can do. Contact those who have had problems and offer them your weibo page and QQ groups to out these who are shady.

[Scrabble King]