Job Discussion Forums

[Playa]

Hello to everyone, and thanks for useful info. I am getting reading this forum.
I am seriously thinking about teaching English in China this fall, and would like to get some additional info mainly regarding job details...

Here are my credentials which are unfortunately very weak:
- I have BA (not related to english though )
- Only couple months teaching English in kindergarten
- No TEFL/TESOL/CELTA (but could get online version though)
- Europe passport but not native

Having all this, please advise me are following job conditions in kindergarten/training center reachable for me or not:

Salary: +9000rmb (up to 20 working hours per week )
Accommodation: Provided or +2500rmb allowance
Holidays: 2 months payed
Visa: Working visa (Z) provided
Airfare reimbursement after 1 year contract

or

Salary: +15000rmb (up to 40 working hours per week )
Accommodation: Provided or +2500rmb allowance
Holidays: 2 months payed
Visa: Working visa (Z) provided
Airfare reimbursement after 1 year contract

Let me just add that I am interested working in Guangdong province (Guangzhou or Shenzhen).
Sorry for a bit longer post, hope you can help me
Thanks in advance,
Cheers

[roadwalker]

I'd say no, they are not attainable for you, but there are probably more than a few teachers in China with similar backgrounds and qualifications. The only way to know is to apply, which is free except for your time. Some employers do have connections with the government, but that only protects them (until it doesn't) and not you. If you are found to be working without government permission, you are subject to fines and/or deportation. So be sure to arrive on a employer-sponsored z- working visa or give the prospective employer a pass.

[Playa]

Ok, so working with any other visa type different than Z is a bad idea thanks!

How hard/easy is to come to China on tourist visa, search for a job, and when finding one obtaining working visa? Or is it better solution to do it while in home country? I guess exploring job options is much more effective live in person, but it is costly as well..

[Non Sequitur]

Hello to everyone, and thanks for useful info. I am getting reading this forum.

If you are asking about conversion of an L to a Z 'in country' then I suggest you continue your reading.

Helluva lot cheaper to find out about getting a Z while still at home, than chance your arm when you get here.
China is not a warm soft regime with multiple appeals against deportation available to you.

[likwid_777]

I have seen jobs on the China job board which stated that non-natives would be accepted for positions. I don't know if you could get a Z visa by doing this, surely some can in certain schools. Unfortunately, I imagine that schools with the connections and willingness to get Z visas for non-natives are probably diminishing by the day.

There are probably still many schools that have the connections to get this (dodgy Z visa) done, but what would be the point in spending large sums of money or calling in big favours, when they can just get a native speaker? Alternatively, they will make you work on a tourist visa and continually tell you that they will get a Z visa for you (they won't, it's bull****).

In this tourist visa manner, the school will not be inconvenienced financially or otherwise by you, and you may get hired. You will be labelled as a Brit or American and you will either slip through the cracks or get busted. Given your "slippery" status, you will essentially have no rights if the poop hits the fan, and when you get busted, the school will drop you like a sack of potatoes.

Some of the above happened to me whilst working on a tourist visa, and I am a native speaker. I didn't have a degree, so there was one inhibiting factor for obtaining a Z visa. Still, as the rules were more lax a few years ago, I bet you that I could have gotten a Z visa if I had done the proper research and not left for China in a hurry.

Oh yeah, I got "asked to leave China within 10 days", which is basically a soft deportation. So, you've been warned. Do your research and remember that in the "lesser" provinces (think West) of China you will have a better chance, as these aren't as popular destinations for both tourists and teachers alike.

With respect to the job ads which you posted, no one can tell you if you will get those jobs or not. Just try and see what the employer says. Also, look for those ads which actually state that they are non-native friendly. As I said above though, I suspect that those ads stating that non-natives can work will be welcomed on a tourist visa only.

[toteach]

[likwid_777]

Yes, as the others have said do your research online. For the reasons toteach has mentioned above, and especially given that you have an "issue" regarding your employment.

"I'm here to see if any work is available."

"Why, yes, there is."

"...but I'm a non-native speaker."

Either "No thanks" or "Ok, now that you're here, we have work for you (but at 60% of the proper salary)."

[Bud Powell]

It's worth a try.

Three years ago, your situation wasn't that big of a problem. If the "rules" have really been tightened, you may have some problems getting around the non-native speaker problem and the lack of experience. My advice is to go the university route if you intend to teach. When universities become desperate, they can usually get around the rules. You may be accepted, then sent off to complete a TEFL course to fulfill the experience deficit. (I don't get the connection, but I've seen it done for a just-graduated recruit).

As long as you are honest from the get-go, you won't have problems once you are accepted. Try out esljobs.com, Serious Teachers, and abroadchina.com. Throw enough mud on the wall, etc..

[Simon in Suzhou]

Most native speakers with a B.A. in English would be happy to get the salary and working conditions you're hoping for. 2 months paid vacation with those salaries? Good luck with that! Not really practical, imo. But you never know unless you try.

[Playa]

[Playa]

[likwid_777]

[Playa]

[likwid_777]

You would have to get one of the gurus to answer this question for you, but I will give you a bit of info from the reams I've read over the past few years all over the internet.

I don't think that it's generally possible to go to China and get a Z visa converted from a tourist visa while in country. I've also been reading that the famous HK run is becoming less and less of a common occurrence, and such a trip is further complicated by your situation as a non-native speaker.

Most of the regular posters here on Dave's are native speakers and probably don't have too much knowledge in this particular (non-native) area. It is why you are getting a lot of "I don't know, just try."

Unfortunately, I doubt that the many non-natives are going to document their stories on the internet. So, for you perhaps a stint of volunteering or boots on the ground in some sort of internship might be helpful to get plugged into the scene. Hmm it sounds more and more like working on a tourist visa. Once again, I don't recommend it. You are wondering if you will be working in China legitimately due to visa conditions, and what are the best conditions you can get whilst working on a Z visa. I, on the other hand, have worked illegitimately before and am wondering if I can go back. Get that Z visa where possible is my strongest advice, don't end up like me.

[cedarstreetcowboy]

One of my colleagues is a non-native speaker and has a Z visa. We're in the middle of nowhere, and I suspect this is why they bent the rules for him. I've also seen them bend the rules on age restrictions. If you're willing to live in a remote location, then yes, you can probably work here legitimately.