Job Discussion Forums

[hdeth]

[buravirgil]

[Sashadroogie]

[spiral78]

[buravirgil]

Thanks Spiral. I agree with 90+ percent of what you post, but wouldn't expect an equivalent reciprocation. Most of my contentions arise with scholastic traditions-- they can, I am prone to explore, make for some mighty large biases, some times.

[spiral78]

[santi84]

[LarssonCrew]

One main problem with IELTS, I think, is the style that they ask you to write/speak in.

It seems most students who are succesful are taught a 'template' and stick to it rigidly.

My friend, a Chinese, who teaches IELTS, lays a foundation of, introduction, starting each paragraph with a 'topic sentence', things which we were taught when we were 9 or 10 in school.

Of course, that's still ok, but in university you will never do it.

Plus, most students do not write anything more than say 2 or 300 words, and then they are 'prepared' for university because they got, say, a 6.5.

They then have to go into a western university style classroom and A) Write upwards of 1000+ words, if not more, and b) [at least in my course] immediately start to reference every idea, case, notation etc. that they want to use.

So many Chinese students will write 'as everyone knows' or just throw 'facts' onto a page, that they will mever bother referencing.

One final thing is that they also seem almost unable to see both sides of an argument, but that's not specifically IELTS based.

[Sashadroogie]

Are these problems with IELTS as a test, or how teacher run preparation classes? And is it really the role of a language proficiency test to prepare students for university? Or is it more likely that it just tests that takers have enough English linguistic skills to manage attending uni?

[santi84]

[wangdaning]

I think the poster was getting to the outcome of IELTS. I know it is not intended (well, I could speculate), but if a student gets a decent score they seem to live with that as the mark of their ability to use English. In reality they cannot piece together an essay or report, even when research is given, cannot take part in a constructive discussion, can't take notes, etc. I guess many native speakers are in the same boat, but a student cannot differentiate between a standardized test and skills they need. Not really the fault of the British (English) Council, but a reality some of us must deal with.

Funny, though, that teachers pay and do the C/D ELTA and then administer exams for the same company. The results are then accepted by many governments. They have quite a monopoly, yes there is the alternative for North America, but interchangeable results do not seem to work both ways. The people on the receiving end of the BC must be quite pleased with the money coming in, doubt they really care much about the results. Love of money and face are not Chinese characteristics.

[buravirgil]

[bograt]

[wangdaning]

Well, I guess monopoly comes in when certain tests are administered by people trained by the same organ to students attempting to go to certain countries which require a certain score on the test. It is not a pure monopoly, but it functions like one in many circumstances. Before it comes up, I have never applied to work as an examiner, nor am I saying it is an exclusively British thing (the majority of examiners I know are not British). My point is more about all of the standards coming from one organ and the result that we face on the ground from it.

You are correct about them all being through Cambridge. I haven't thought about the whole thing for a few years and got it wrong about the BC.

Edit to add in I know D/C elta are not required to be an examiner, just never met an examiner who does not have one. Might be dependent on region.

[bograt]