Job Discussion Forums

[cnthaiksarok]

Ok,..this has been on my mind now and again as of late.

Hands up if you don't really mind, or even "gasp" enjoy living in the land of sand.

Count me as an "Enjoy."

It seems to me that as more of the "indigo children-gen" move in and start maneuvering around, there is a slight reduction of the "live it with no life for the cash," crowd. There are still PLENTY of them around, to be sure, but...

I've been here a number of years (3 provinces), but haven't felt as connected to the local community before, and it's really made a big difference.

(Yes, akoo's comments on another thread reminded me of this)

Over on the expat-blog forum (saudi room) one Saudi wrote of "the good old days," (pre-911) where westerners could (and more importantly WOULD) stop at any ole' bedo farm / camp to say hi and have a look around and end up being bowled over by the welcome. I can say from recent experience that that phenomenon is the same as it ever was. Our hosts remain the ultimate hosts.

Of course I like the pay, the vaca time and all the other perks, but I've come upon an interest in a culture and history behind the curtain that is rich and appealing (at least to me).

Anyone who says, "there's no culture in Saudi, just look around," is being foolish, imo. We all came from specific pasts, ongoing changes and most often peculiar circumstances that made us and our families who and what we are. The Saudis are not different. We all have an interesting tale to tell, if anyone decides to be patient and interested enough to listen to it.

In conclusion, the Saudis come in all shapes, sizes and orientations - just like the rest of us.

people are people, so why should it be?....

So,..where do you stand?

Enjoy
Kinda' like
Tolerate
Just live with
Can't stand

or somewhere in between?

discuss quickly

this thread'll prolly av' a short life

[johnslat]

Dear cnthaiksarok,

I'm not there now, haven't been since 2003, but I did spend 19 years (off and on) in Saudi.

I don't know if anyone can choose just one of your 5+ options; I know I can't.

There were times when I felt ALL those ways about the Kingdom. On the whole, though, I guess I'd have to cheat and pick two:

I mostly enjoyed my work and I mainly tolerated the rest. Oh, at first, a society so "exotic" to most Westerners was fascinating; then it dropped down to interesting and finally it ended up at ho-hum."

I made some very good friends there, though - both Westerners and Saudis. And even after all these years, I'm still in contact with many of them.

What one gets from the Kingdom depends in large measure, I'd say. on what one brings to it, especially one's nature and personality.

Are you self-contained. patient, have a bizarre sense of humor and a lot of curiosity about the customs of others - well, then, I'd say the chances of your falling between "Enjoy" and "Tolerate" are pretty good.

Regards,
John

[water rat]

I never had much of a problem with the Saudis themselves. There was the time a young man blocked my way into a rather small hotel elevator because his mother was also in it, but he kept his eyes downcast like he didn't really want to do it but felt he must. I don't understand much Arabic. It could be that his mum insisted he do it. All right then. That's why I travel, to encounter different customs.

Besides that, I found then lovely people. My problem was ever the nutcase, megalomaniac American school administrators, tinpot dictators inside their one building in the trackless desert, but only if a Saudi superior was not on the premises. The Saudi superiors were always classy, openhearted men.

So I vote 'kinda like' except for the food which I love, except for camel meat and cardamon coffee - which I will not touch even at the risk of being impolite.

[cnthaiksarok]

[cnthaiksarok]

Dearest John,

Thank you for your reply.

Yes, I am all of those things (you mentioned towards the end of your post), on my "good" days.

Yes, it's certainly a facet of human nature to not be lumped into one category for any kind of duration, since we're all in the midst of continual change ourselves, not to mention our surroundings.

With all of the above said, I've certainly had my trying days (and even months) in the KSA, so I have a lot of empathy for those who can't stand the place or the people, yet find themselves in a position that relies on "her" financial resources.

At the same time though, I do have a hard time with people who spend copious amounts of time bad-mouthing the community and it's denizens when they've never even made the slightest attempt to take part in it.
Those walls can be pretty thick.
But, hey...their life - up to them.

[cnthaiksarok]

[Gamajorba]

I'm not gonna lie, I've not even finished a year and I absolutely despise living in KSA. Period.

My issue hasn't exactly been the cultural issues e.g. segregated genders, prayer times closing everything, etc, even though these can appear to be very backwards and ludicrous to any Westerner. My issue lies in something worse - the people.

Unfortunately, I've grown to really dislike almost everyone in Saudi for one reason or another. Saudis in particular. I must stress that I really did try and integrate with Saudis and their culture, especially when I first arrived, using social networking to meet up with people, the occasional visit to a compound etc for a bit of Western touch and so on, but I really have found people, almost regardless of nationality completely insufferable.

I work predominantely with South Africans and Americans. I've never really met any South Africans until coming to Saudi, but those that I have met and worked with have been complete pains in the ass. And most Americans I work with are either complete hypocrites, hyper lazy or just full of BS ALL THE TIME.

Saudis, on the other hand, I've found to be:

- lazy
- rude
- arrogant
- selfish
- hypocritical
- annoying
- self important
- uncourteous
- cowardly
- full of BS
- idiotic
- pathetic
- uneducated

They're too much for me. Even the 'lower class' expats can be absolute nutjobs as well, although they're usually the least of the worries as far as people go...sort of...

I will stress this as well - I'm fully aware not everyone is the same, and I'm aware this is a generalisation, but everyone makes generalisations about anything and everything.

And it's not like I've STAYED in Saudi either, in the space of a year, I've left the country 12 times (technically 15 if you count entering/exiting different land borders 3 times in a weekend), and I've previously taught people from other Arab nations, and yet to find any as unbearable as Saudis, with the possible exception of Kuwaitis.

But that's just my 2 cents...I'd be happy to disclose more privately if anyone wishes to know more.

[cmp45]

Enjoy: the 60+ summer vacations and plenty of free time to work on personal projects; also enjoy the hot weather

Kinda' like: the traditional food
Tolerate: the work place politics
Just live with: the laws of the land
Can't stand: Riyadh traffic

Never could understand why people express such strong negativity and continue to stay and wallow in their hatred. If you speak about others with such hatred, then you need to take a hard look in the mirror because you are the problem not the others.

[Gamajorba]

[Makkah]

[Gamajorba]

[scot47]

I spent 17 years there. The first two - when I was a performing drunk, were difficult. After I learned how to not drink my time there was better.

One thing I do remember is that Saudis are actually incredibly diverse. Don't be fooled by the thobes. There are loads of individuals there.

[fledex]

People are people wherever one goes. That is why i travel and teach. The hospitality of Arabs, in general, is wonderful. Its rules, meaning Saudi rules, are infuriating and stupid. The sooner they are destroyed the better. Some things in the culture are enjoyable, like sitting on the carpet on the beach, eating camel kapsa or BBQ at night. But you've been in the sun and sand too long if you really enjoy Saudi or like the people, in an objectified manner. When we move from the subjective to the objectivization of people, that's when we get wars.

[mnruman]

Has anyboyd here taken their families along with them? whats there for the kids to do? is there any place or anything for todlers to go to and do like a play centre or a creche (I highly doubt it, but thouught I'd ask) .

[cnthaiksarok]