Job Discussion Forums

[djwheat]

Hi all..

I have a job that is supposed to start in September, but because I graduated 31st July 2013, I'm told two years post grad is needed before you can apply for visa.

So, I'm being told to go on an L visa so I can begin working September and go to HK within 60 days to HK to change it. Apparently it's legal to begin working if your visa is being processed.

What do you think? I'm not keen on the idea of having to go to HK.

[jimpellow]

To the best of me knowledge, it is absolutely not legal to do so hence your fear is correct. This is one of those deals where you have a lot to lose and very little to win.

They always seem to take it out on the employee, rather than the employer, for a teacher working illegally in China. Along with this is the fact that usually such schools make you pay for the visa run. Hence the employer has a lot to win and very little to lose.

Chinese will tell you whatever is necessary to get what they want.

Some jurisdictions in China do not yet/currently require two years of experience so you could look there. I am also one of those of the opinion that there are always tons of jobs in China. Missing out on the two big starting periods is really no big deal. You can just wait a bit. Additionally, the jobs that are available are not bottom-of-the-barrel as some opine here.

[doogsville]

Okay, since you need two years post grad teaching experience, what will have changed for you in September? Nothing.

Yes, to satisfy the requirement, you should have two years teaching experience. They don't mean you should just wait two years after graduating to come here. So they're scamming you. Incidentally, the two years of teaching experience don't have to be post grad, you just have to put it on your CV/resume.

It's very likely they'll either keep putting you off, 'you can't go this week, you have to go next month', 'oh, not this month, sorry, we meant February', 'Oh, the visa office is closed for Spring Festival/we lost your application form, we have to start again, next week, okay?' And on and on it will go, until the police come to your apartment and take you to jail and fine you and put you on a plane home at your expense and stamp your passport 'do not come back for five years'.

It is not legal to work while you're visa is being processed, unless your visa is a Z visa, and it's being converted to a work permit and resident permit. Tell these people 'no thanks' and find one of the very many companies that can hire you legally.

[jimpellow]

Excellent points from the above poster.

I do not know if I agree 100% with this part...

"Incidentally, the two years of teaching experience don't have to be post grad, you just have to put it on your CV/resume."

I just say that as some might think they can lie here. I know when I recently was talking to a school about coming back to China they asked that the reference letters equate to at least two years of experience with contact information so they could be verified. The HR person stated that it was for the government. Hence, it seems theoretically in some jurisdictions they are theoretically verifying the two year requirement.

[vikeologist]

A clear red flag.

[Enkates]

[Brunouno]

I'm not so sure if this is a scam. Whilst I have almost three years of teaching experience, only one and a half of it is post-grad experience. My employer was unable to get a FEC from Beijing, because I didn't have two years post-grad experience. My employer did eventually get me approved for a FEC from another jurisdiction.

It does still seem fishy, though, because you're only a month away from qualifying. It sounds like the employer just wants to get you there as quickly as possible and doesn't care about your future inconveniences. If I were in your shoes, I would just tell them that you're only interested in arriving on a Z visa, and if that means arriving late September or October, then so be it.

[vikeologist]

It's not about whether its a scam.

The employer is seeking to employ the Op illegally. They'd have no legal recourse, status or protection.

The Op shouldn't work for them, or for that matter, Brunouno's employer who are also breaking the law.

I appreciate that on another thread recently I implicitly gave advice as to how to work illegally, but in this case, be legal or don't come.

[Non Sequitur]

Apply elsewhere and give as your earliest start date what fits to make your Z legit and in your PP before you leave home.
Many teachers arrive up to 2 months after the start of the semester. Beyond that you are really a candidate for a start after Spring Break.
Others will instantly pounce and say they know people who started in December.
Be that as it may, the main thing is that Z squared away before you leave.
As a newbie, you will have enough to deal with without visa uncertainties.
Best

[bestteacher2012]

Sounds like the school can't get you the legal documents because two years hasn't passed between you graduating from university and now. The school asking you to come on a tourist visa is just a way they can get you here on time. If the school is a public school, then you probably have nothing to worry about, but there is always a risk. If you do not want to come on a L visa, suggest to the school they can apply for the necessary documents in August, meaning you might arrive a little after September.

[talentedcrayon]

It's not really a red flag... because lots of people do this...

BUT... It is illegal to work on an L visa period.

AND... It isn't very smart. So, come to China legally.

My school tried to get me to come on an L visa initially. I politely said no and waited until I had the proper visa. I ended up coming 2 months late. In the end, it wasn't a big deal.

It isn't worth the risk to work illegally, ever. I have said no multiple times to employers who have asked me to work illegally.

The idea that I could be barred from working in China if I get caught is enough for me not to. I like China.