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General Disarray
Joined: 23 Jun 2010 Posts: 58 Location: Kent
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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Theres a lot of people in this world, everywhere you'll go, you'll meet westerners.
I was in a hostel in Ukraine about 4 months ago, speaking to a fellow Brit (from Manchester though) in the dormitory. Turns out we had a mutual friend in Budapest.
I loved Guanajuato, great city!! I went there 2 years ago for Cervantinho, my friend told me to pre-book my hostel so I did 3 weeks in advance at a bargain price I thought of 100pesos a night. My friend couldn't believe the price, the day I leave for Gto, I look at the address and realised I booked for Guadalajara!!! I rang my friend who told me not to worry as his cousin lived in Gto, stayed in a big house with 17 other Mexicans for the 3 nights.
Went back the following year as on my way to Torreon from D.F, a beautiful city!
I think I would prefer to live in Guadalajara or Oaxaca though if given the choice. Morelia was a very beautiful city as well, I went there by mistake as the bus to Queretero I think it was, was all sold out.
Cali is a good shout, but you need to learn how to Salsa..
Vienna is a good city to live in right now, although it's pricier than most.
Belgrade is a good city with soul, Ryanair haven't started flying there yet, so the stag parties haven't discovered it yet!!!
I'm off to Belo Horizonte in 6 weeks myself though, just to learn Portuguese though, not for work, will be back in Budapest I suspect by February, a city with a lot of soul but been infiltrated recently by tourists as Ryanair started flying there 2 years ago, the stag parties have followed. |
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plumpy nut
Joined: 12 Mar 2011 Posts: 1652
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Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:12 am Post subject: Re: Finding places that still have spirit... |
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Lack wrote: |
I'm from the U.S., so that might be why I feel this need so strongly. Americans' idea of "architecture" is, "Hey, let's put some boxes here. No, wait, I know: METAL boxes! Let's put metal boxes up! They can be schools and churches and stores and everything!"
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Seoul, South Korea would be a really great place for you. You may think Myanmar has the spirit, but perhaps you should read this from the General Asia Forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=110609 |
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Cosmixed
Joined: 11 May 2014 Posts: 11 Location: Istanbul
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:04 am Post subject: |
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Istanbul has an excess of character, and definitely feels alive. It's a clusterfuck really, but not in a bad way, if that makes sense. Anything can and does happen here. So if you are up for an adventure (and can stomach a bit of chaos) come on over. You definitely won't be bored. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005 Posts: 3898 Location: Pittsburgh
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Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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Lack wrote: |
I'm giving up on my idea. It's just not possible. Every city, country has been "discovered" and ruined. If it's not some post-modern LEGO block building dystopia, then it's some overpriced and overrun tourist trap.
Normally when we think of avoiding tourists, we think of avoiding Western tourists. Well, I recently visited a Chinese city with tons of beautiful ancient architecture still standing. Didn't see a single other foreigner besides myself, but what I did see was this: every place of beauty in the city turned into a tourist experience and tons of tourists...Chinese tourists. Much like American tourists in their own country. Commercialization and selfie sticks abounded.
There's no place left. It was silly of me to think I could find such a place. |
I think you will be fine if you book a trip to North Korea. I doubt you will run into too many tourist. |
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nortenagirl
Joined: 21 Nov 2008 Posts: 16
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Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2015 6:25 pm Post subject: City with spirit |
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Hi Lack,
Did you ever find your city with spirit?
I miss Mexico, for that very reason. Northern Mexico has the beautiful city of Alamos (in the state of Sonora), full of Colonial architecture, but it does get very hot in the summers.
Good luck!
Nortena Girl |
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Lack
Joined: 10 Aug 2011 Posts: 252
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Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 5:05 pm Post subject: Re: City with spirit |
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nortenagirl wrote: |
Hi Lack,
Did you ever find your city with spirit?
I miss Mexico, for that very reason. Northern Mexico has the beautiful city of Alamos (in the state of Sonora), full of Colonial architecture, but it does get very hot in the summers.
Good luck!
Nortena Girl |
Nope, never found it. I realized the entire world is in a bad state and has no hope. Whether it's a soulless American suburb, a Chinese grey-sky mega-metropolis, a garbage dump town in Philippines, or pretty much anything else, it all sucks - but some suck worse than others.
For the time being, I'm just going to keep moving around without staying in one place for too long.
Anywhere you go, they can never match what they did in the past. No one builds cathedrals or temples anymore. It's just cheap, bird-s*** buildings with all the visual and spiritual appeal of a LEGO block. Every old piece of architecture has been turned into a mindless tourist trap. No thanks.
I need to start my own country (or planet.) |
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Hod
Joined: 28 Apr 2003 Posts: 1613 Location: Home
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Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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Charming.
Plenty of places are still great. Taking one of your example countries, China, I'd have loved to have lived and worked in somewhere like Hong Kong, Macau or Beijing. |
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Lack
Joined: 10 Aug 2011 Posts: 252
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Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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Hod wrote: |
Charming.
Plenty of places are still great. Taking one of your example countries, China, I'd have loved to have lived and worked in somewhere like Hong Kong, Macau or Beijing. |
No doubt those cities would be fun...for a while, but that's not what I'm looking for.
No society on earth in this era creates a Great Wall, Taj Mahal, Angkor Wat, etc. There is still natural beauty left in the world, at least, but humanity is finished. We're just playing out this game of 'global economy,' though it's all in vain. It's a global race to the bottom. Yes, there are places that are 'still good,' but they're just running on the fumes of past glory.
I know I can't explain it well. It doesn't truly fit into words.
So it goes. |
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Hod
Joined: 28 Apr 2003 Posts: 1613 Location: Home
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Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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Well, would you have liked to have lived in China, India or Cambodia whilst those greats were being built? We'd probably be hod carriers or in charge of water rationing like Immortan Joe in Mad Max (guess who's flown long-haul economy and watched/slept through films, films and films recently).
It'd be obvious to now bang on about 21st century blah blah, but what about Morocco?
It wasn't my favourite place in a year there (Casablanca), but that's a country that isn't overrun by development, and the locals believe in tradition, etc. |
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spanglish
Joined: 21 May 2009 Posts: 742 Location: working on that
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Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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Lack wrote: |
Hod wrote: |
Charming.
Plenty of places are still great. Taking one of your example countries, China, I'd have loved to have lived and worked in somewhere like Hong Kong, Macau or Beijing. |
No doubt those cities would be fun...for a while, but that's not what I'm looking for.
No society on earth in this era creates a Great Wall, Taj Mahal, Angkor Wat, etc. There is still natural beauty left in the world, at least, but humanity is finished. We're just playing out this game of 'global economy,' though it's all in vain. It's a global race to the bottom. Yes, there are places that are 'still good,' but they're just running on the fumes of past glory.
I know I can't explain it well. It doesn't truly fit into words.
So it goes. |
Maybe you'd feel at home in places that carefully preserve the glory of the past while living in the present with a sense of style and refinement? I'm thinking Rome, Barcelona, Madrid, or even London or Oxford? Of course these things are a luxury and you'll pay for the privilege, but the cobble-stoned streets of the Trastevere neighborhood in Rome certainly have some spirit left.
Some of the row houses in Washington DC are also quite beautiful; in particular many neighborhoods in the northeast part of the city have been beautifully renovated and some of seem to have also retained a sense of history and community - again, you'll have to pay for the privilege. Also, the colonial centers in many Latin American cities are quite beautiful - albeit dirty and crime ridden - and retain a sense of silent history in their streets and walls. Many of the neighborhoods in the older parts of Bogota are dripping with memory and history. Finally, many of the large, grand neogothic university campuses in the US have quite a lot of architectural beauty - the University of Washington and Georgetown both come to mind right off the bat. Not particularly helpful for living, though.
Anyway, having come back to the US after years and years abroad, I certainly understand where you're coming from - the architectural drudgery can be torturous - and have made an effort to find my own corner of 'spirit.' |
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hdeth
Joined: 20 Jan 2015 Posts: 583
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Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 1:35 am Post subject: |
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Hod wrote: |
Charming.
Plenty of places are still great. Taking one of your example countries, China, I'd have loved to have lived and worked in somewhere like Hong Kong, Macau or Beijing. |
How did you manage to pick the three most reputedly boring cities in China? I've lived in Beijing the last year and it's arguably the most boring city in China, if not the world. I will probably be visiting Hong Kong soon but everyone I've talked to about it says to plan on just staying a few days because after that you've basically seen and done everything.
to the OP, we do build that sort of insane stuff still, it's just things like space shuttles, not temples. Do you know much of the history of Angkor Wat? Taking taxes from the peasants and lining the walls with solid gold? Emperor was a divine being and Angkor Wat was basically the head office of the IRS. As much as I like architecture I'm not sure 'spirit' is the word I would use to describe a tax collection agency imbued with 'holy' powers.
For me the place that probably had the most 'soul' was Sapa in Vietnam. Yes, the central part of town is a tourist trap, but a few minutes by motorbike to get out and it's beautiful. Humans living in relative harmony with nature. Use the water flowing down the mountain to grow the rice, to power the mill that pounds the rice, for drinking, etc. Take a mid-day bath in the stream. Use old plastic soda bottles as toys or to transport liquids. Of course it's more conservative and most people are directed to marry a spouse of their parents' choosing at around 15 years old, but such is the nature of traditional societies. |
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jpvanderwerf2001
Joined: 02 Oct 2003 Posts: 1117 Location: New York
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Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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Much of India would be a possibility.
Almost anywhere in Russia, outside of Moscow/StP could arguably work. Other former Soviet countries, such as Ukraine or Bulgaria, would be options.
There are plenty of places in South America that might be considerations, but there aren't many jobs.
I would imagine much of Africa might have what you're looking for, though jobs are probably hard to come by.
The places where people need or want English (enough that people will pay good money out of their pockets to get instruction), almost by definition, are the most likely to be modernizing. I mean, you could head to the "soul-est" place on Earth, but can or will the people there pay enough for English lessons to warrant an entity hiring a native speaker? |
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Shanghai Noon
Joined: 18 Aug 2013 Posts: 589 Location: Shanghai, China
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Posted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 2:56 am Post subject: |
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Cosmixed wrote: |
Istanbul has an excess of character, and definitely feels alive. It's a clusterfuck really, but not in a bad way, if that makes sense. Anything can and does happen here. So if you are up for an adventure (and can stomach a bit of chaos) come on over. You definitely won't be bored. |
Istanbul is great but for the love of God stay away from Taksim. |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Posts: 15343
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Posted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:25 am Post subject: |
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Bulgaria was never part of the Soviet Union. It was a member of the Warsaw Pac t, but that is not the same. As a destination for EFLing, it is hardly new. Fascinating place but very low salaries.
It was better in the old days before Thatcher scrapped the Cultural Agreement between the UK and Bulgaria. Under that. the British Council sent around 20 teachers every year to work in secondary schools. Local salary was topped up by a sterling supplement. I was on that programme in 1991-1993. |
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Lack
Joined: 10 Aug 2011 Posts: 252
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Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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Hod wrote: |
Well, would you have liked to have lived in China, India or Cambodia whilst those greats were being built? We'd probably be hod carriers or in charge of water rationing like Immortan Joe in Mad Max (guess who's flown long-haul economy and watched/slept through films, films and films recently). |
You do have a good point. I suppose in the modern era, we have taken a slight step down. Most of the slavery and exploitation of human beings is hidden rather than blatant and our labor is used to produce ugliness instead of beauty. A small step down overall.
Anyway, the past is the past and the present is what we've got. I'm going to focus on something else: cities where I can have approximately 80% pleasantness. Perfection is a fantasy. Even that won't be easy; modernity has taken over. It too will not last, but this is the world I live in, so I have no choice but to make the best of it. |
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