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Day Dreamer
Joined: 09 Dec 2015
Posts: 24
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 Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 7:44 am Post subject: |
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Far too often people quote laws and regulations based on what other people tell them. What someone believes isn't always factual. And if you don't like what I say, well, sorry, I didn't make the rules.
When dealing on behalf of my school with the various authorities, I learned a few things. For one, not all of them are etched in stone. Two, they change constantly. And three, many people read stories that are just that - stories.
While I don't doubt the arrests and police action, my suspicion is with the person who wrote the article. I seriously find it hard to believe the police would inform him on all the details of the foreigners they arrested |
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hdeth
Joined: 20 Jan 2015
Posts: 583
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:15 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Day Dreamer"]
| asiannationmc wrote: |
You should be writing the China Law Blog....this is "drunk legal advice" akin to the ever successful advice for being pulled over by a Florida State Trooper when holding an open alcoholic beverage between you legs....simple put your thumb over the opening and thus, no longer an open container..... |
Okay I should have been clearer. Signing a contract with a new company while working with your original visa at your first company is the faux pas,
Actually the norm. Going through the process right now. If I waited until my visa expired (or even until after my last day of work) I wouldn't be able to transfer my residence permit and would have to go home and get a z-visa. It's totally normal to sign a contract while you're still on a z-visa for another company. |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| Your comment about Florida State Troopers is moronic |
Day Dreamer, your the guy who actually tried the ole' thumb over the open container trick.... aren't ya.....
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asiannationmc wrote:
Deportation actions incl. incarceration awaiting disposition is not subject to laws but regulations......
Truly "drunk legal advice" |
Ok, time to shine, Day Dreamer (my fronting cousin) ..... What law determines the length of maximum incarceration in a holding facility detaining an offender of an overstay? Hint: it is providential in compliance with a Beijing directive! The trick would be that the regs also allow for local interpretation of the practicality of the directive.
| Quote: |
| And if you don't like what I say, well, sorry, I didn't make the rules. |
On the contrary, I enjoyed reading the post, I however just think for the most part your "popin yor beak" Not only did you not make the rules, you have no idea what the rules are ...... nor do you understand the way that Chinese laws are generalized and then specific-ized at the local level. (Yeah I know I made that word up)but then again when FT's begin to dispense legal advice with the certainty of a Bill Burroughs "bull-eyes accuracy" then it is necessary to caution those readers that serve in Dave's passion play as a vulnerable Joan Vollmer. |
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Day Dreamer
Joined: 09 Dec 2015
Posts: 24
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:48 am Post subject: |
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Okay, the last word I'm going to say on this.
asiannationmc: keep the idiotic comments about your run ins with troopers and your flames to yourself
hdeth: you can sign it, but it's not legal until the process is done. You can start working after it's registered and finalized
But let's get back on track
All I said was based on the information the story teller wrote, I doubt everything after the first two sentences. Please discuss this |
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SH_Panda
Joined: 31 May 2011
Posts: 455
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:06 am Post subject: |
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How can people not spot that this is the same guy who's been posting this rubbish for years on here and other China forums?
Do I just have a really keen eye for a troll or what?
There are no sources, nothing in the real news except a forum post... nothing of any substance whatsoever to go on.
I even remember this particular tale being told on here before! He said something about being part of a group rounded up for something or other, then released, then blah blah blah. He doesn't even bother to make new stories now... just rehashes the old ones! |
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7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| SH_Panda wrote: |
How can people not spot that this is the same guy who's been posting this rubbish for years on here and other China forums?
Do I just have a really keen eye for a troll or what?
There are no sources, nothing in the real news except a forum post... nothing of any substance whatsoever to go on.
I even remember this particular tale being told on here before! He said something about being part of a group rounded up for something or other, then released, then blah blah blah. He doesn't even bother to make new stories now... just rehashes the old ones! |
I'm with you on this.... He's always part of a group that was rounded up, arrested, deported, abused etc etc. Same crap, different thread. I located one of the other ones here:
When things go wrong: Working in China
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| I, myself have just finished spending 10 days in a prison on the outskirts of Beijing. |
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| Inside the prison we (both the Chinese and Foreigners) were confined to overcrowded (13-15 people) cells |
Must have been really tight..... In the cell I mean..... |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 10:09 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| All I said was based on the information the story teller wrote, I doubt everything after the first two sentences. Please discuss this |
I think if you had actually contained your hyperbole to the first two sentences, than a heaping helping of ridicule would not be on your blue plate special.
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asiannationmc: keep the idiotic comments about your run ins with troopers and your flames to yourself
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Oh, my apologies..... I thought you would jump at a chance to show that you were not just "popin yor beak".....
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| Must have a nice Chinese rap sheet |
I just heard of a Taiwan-ish instructor at a overseas program in Nanchang who was picked up and deported within several day and the rumor mill indicated he had a hot girl and many local friends; he was slinging a little "Bud'da" ....the admin authority of his work unit has been hush-ole' bout it ....that is about as much as you hear bout these kind of things....but for sure, the PSA in Beijing did run a sting similar to the party in tht it targeted foreigners but was a job interview publicized and several clubs were locked down and tested with a little white cup and indicators for smokey ingestion of "the cheapest insurance for Chinese mental health" so the bottom line would be .... to stay frosty.... and stay away from advice delivered by Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds... |
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SH_Panda
Joined: 31 May 2011
Posts: 455
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 12:00 pm Post subject: |
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| 7969 wrote: |
| SH_Panda wrote: |
How can people not spot that this is the same guy who's been posting this rubbish for years on here and other China forums?
Do I just have a really keen eye for a troll or what?
There are no sources, nothing in the real news except a forum post... nothing of any substance whatsoever to go on.
I even remember this particular tale being told on here before! He said something about being part of a group rounded up for something or other, then released, then blah blah blah. He doesn't even bother to make new stories now... just rehashes the old ones! |
I'm with you on this.... He's always part of a group that was rounded up, arrested, deported, abused etc etc. Same crap, different thread. I located one of the other ones here:
When things go wrong: Working in China
| Quote: |
| I, myself have just finished spending 10 days in a prison on the outskirts of Beijing. |
| Quote: |
| Inside the prison we (both the Chinese and Foreigners) were confined to overcrowded (13-15 people) cells |
Must have been really tight..... In the cell I mean..... |
There you go! |
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Blue Skies
Joined: 29 Nov 2015
Posts: 22
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not sure what you guys are talking about, but the Christmas Eve fiasco was the first and only time I was ever randomly asked to show my passport in China. Maybe had some of the party goers been less noisy and rowdy we may have not been questioned at all. I'm not sure. But one of the porters at the hotel said the cops were stopping every foreigner coming out of the hotel after 9 pm and asking to see their passport. For all I know maybe some crime took place at the hotel and they were making a suspect list.
Anyway, they were polite with me and even apologized after my GF fetched my passport for me and brought it to the cop shop. If people just follow the visa laws of countries they visit, they have nothing to worry about I think. Happy Holidays People! |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Blue Skies wrote: |
I'm not sure what you guys are talking about, but the Christmas Eve fiasco was the first and only time I was ever randomly asked to show my passport in China. Maybe had some of the party goers been less noisy and rowdy we may have not been questioned at all. I'm not sure. But one of the porters at the hotel said the cops were stopping every foreigner coming out of the hotel after 9 pm and asking to see their passport. For all I know maybe some crime took place at the hotel and they were making a suspect list.
Anyway, they were polite with me and even apologized after my GF fetched my passport for me and brought it to the cop shop. If people just follow the visa laws of countries they visit, they have nothing to worry about I think. Happy Holidays People! |
Oh, what a tangled web some posters weave. |
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theoriginalprankster
Joined: 19 Mar 2012
Posts: 895
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 6:51 am Post subject: |
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| Word has it absolutely nothing of the sort happened at the hotel - just a nonsense story dreamed up by .... lord knows who. And why. |
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Shanghai Noon
Joined: 18 Aug 2013
Posts: 589
Location: Shanghai, China
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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| I've lived in Shanghai for three years. I've been asked for my passport once when the police went door-to-door in my complex looking for squatters. It's easier to produce your passport the next day than it is to replace a lost one. I'm still not going to carry mine when I go to the bar and supermarket. |
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SH_Panda
Joined: 31 May 2011
Posts: 455
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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| theoriginalprankster wrote: |
| Word has it absolutely nothing of the sort happened at the hotel - just a nonsense story dreamed up by .... lord knows who. And why. |
You have to laugh really 
This guy basically dedicates his life to trolling all kinds of China message boards. Just think about that. Think of all the fake e-mail addresses he has to create, think of all the hours he spends concocting these fanciful tales, think of the hours he has spent setting up and maintaining those websites that nobody actually reads, except for if they need a laugh.
It's incredible. What a complete and utter waste of time |
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Blue Skies
Joined: 29 Nov 2015
Posts: 22
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:24 am Post subject: |
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The only "pranks" involved here are the ones pulled by the unethical agents who persuaded the ignorant newbies to come work in China without a Z visa. We all heard their lies...
" It's okay to work your first 90 day probationary period without a Z visa"
" Don't worry, after you get to China your employer will get you a z visa"
" No big deal because our company has guanxi (connections) with the government"
" The law was just changed two weeks ago and now its okay to work on a L, M, or F visa in China."
" We are partners with the China Ministry of Education and have a special exemption."
If people follow the China visa laws they have nothing to worry about getting arrested or deported. There are dozens of warnings all over this China section about MANDATORY Z visas, as well as at http://safea.gov.cn and every embassy web site. If people are too lazy to check out the visa laws of the country they are visiting, they will learn their lesson the hard way. We also arrest, jail, and deport illegal aliens back in America, Canada, and the U.K. Why the hell do you think it would be any different in China? http://www.antifraudintl.org/threads/beware-of-china-internship-visa-scams.96692/#post-264961 Have you guys already forget about the Disney teachers that were busted and deported last year in Chengdu for the very same Z visa issue? http://www.vice.com/read/the-chinese-esl-industrial-complex-shady-working-conditions-abound-for-foreign-english-teachers-in-china-127
To the guy who said the law is not "clear" and "constantly changing", he has his head up his ass, or might be an agent himself who uses one of the above lies to recruit newbies. The 2015 China foreign teacher requirements are "very clear":
1. Verifiable bachelor degree
2. Z Visa (work visa)
3. 2 years verifiable work experience
4. Police certificate in Beijing & Shanghai (no criminal record)
5. Ages 21-55
Yes, the law does change from time to time but no change has been made since July of 2013 and those changes went into effect of on September of 2013.
Last edited by Blue Skies on Wed Dec 30, 2015 4:21 am; edited 1 time in total |
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JamesD
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 934
Location: "As far as I'm concerned bacon comes from a magical happy place."
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2015 3:08 am Post subject: |
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| Blue Skies wrote: |
...The 2015 China foreign teacher requirements are "very clear":
...........
5. Ages 21-25
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Damn!! That makes most of the FTs I know illegal. The airlines are going to make a fortune this week with all the foreigners over 25 scheduling a last-minute flight home. |
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